Winnipeg | True North Square | U/C - Page 137

esquire · #**2721** Posted **May 31, 2017, 2:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by robertocarlos

Playoffs!??

Oh yeah, it's that thing where some other teams keep playing even after the season is over. I don't know what that's all about... they must just be getting a jump on training camp.

Biff · #**2722** Posted **May 31, 2017, 3:39 PM**

And current cam for the new page

Wolf13 · #**2723** Posted **May 31, 2017, 3:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pegaholic

after driving down carlton today is it just me or does the actual public space seems kind of small relative to the buildings.. i dont understand how they need over 17 million dollars in public money to help fund it.. What are the benches and water fountain feature going to be made of gold with expensive champagne pouring out of it.

i understand that the lighting and large led display might cost a bit of money but 17 million seems like a lot.. the space seems tiny but it might just look that way because of the all the construction equipment and work going on

Quote:

Originally Posted by USA

A lot of that money is supposed to pay for the skyways

It's because the rest of the project is that expensive. It's not lining pockets, but the money is totally needed to complete the project, I'm guessing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rrskylar

They'll take as much as they can get and we have a mayor and council willing to give it!

In fairness everyone with exception to perhaps my grandmother would take as much as they're offered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

Oh yeah, it's that thing where some other teams keep playing even after the season is over. I don't know what that's all about... they must just be getting a jump on training camp.

rrskylar · #**2724** Posted **May 31, 2017, 4:06 PM**

^ But isn't it the responsibility of a "good" mayor and ''good" council to limit how much they give? Trouble is we have neither!

Any public money going to projects like this need to evaluated more clearly on a cost-benefit analysis, trouble with politicians here is they throw money around that isn't theirs to begin with an hope it sticks!

buzzg · #**2725** Posted **May 31, 2017, 4:51 PM**

The ROI on the $17m is staggering.

rkspec · #**2726** Posted **May 31, 2017, 4:57 PM**

did they move the nearest (in the pic) tower crane? i thought it was rite where the water fixture is going, sandwiched between 2 wooden structures?

unless i'm way off?

rrskylar · #**2727** Posted **May 31, 2017, 4:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzg

The ROI on the $17m is staggering.

And also proving that nothing can get done here without public money involved, right?

buzzg · #**2728** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by rrskylar

And also proving that nothing can get done here without public money involved, right?

Gotta start somewhere. You could also look at it as being our taxes are so high here that it can be cost-prohibitive, so giving some of that back when it's needed to get things done isn't the worst thing.

Sure you could argue tax less and it will happen on its own, but maybe then they'd still ask for help and you're screwed. Developers know costs here. Look at lots of the big downtown projects recently - many are by local companies. They know maybe margins aren't as high, but they're doing it anyway.

bomberjet · #**2729** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:03 PM**

From my POV, looks like the floor height is reduced starting at the 5th floor. All the columns look shorter than the previous floors.

buzzg · #**2730** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

From my POV, looks like the floor height is reduced starting at the 5th floor. All the columns look shorter than the previous floors.

I believe the renderings had a 5 floor commercial podium, so that would make sense.

bomberjet · #**2731** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:17 PM**

Based on this, the podium is only 3 actual floors. But looking at the image it looks like the 4th floor is also higher and part of the podium with the outdoor space. 5th floor then looks to be like the rest of the tower. So that makes sense. I guess I assumed the floor heights would change after the 3rd floor but just hadn't noticed it.

Authentic_City · #**2732** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:32 PM**

How would the public square at True North compare, in terms of size, with the plaza behind the Hydro Bldg on Graham? The Hydro plaza is actually a good size and used in the warmer months for an outdoor farmers market. Is TNS going to be larger?

Urban recluse · #**2733** Posted **May 31, 2017, 5:57 PM**

They WILL include all of the rooftop trees and shrubs correct?

esquire · #**2734** Posted **May 31, 2017, 6:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Authentic_City

How would the public square at True North compare, in terms of size, with the plaza behind the Hydro Bldg on Graham? The Hydro plaza is actually a good size and used in the warmer months for an outdoor farmers market. Is TNS going to be larger?

They look comparably sized, but so much of Hydro Place's plaza is unusable for the market because of the landscaping. On that basis, TNS will probably have more room to accommodate something like the Downtown BIZ market.

That's actually pretty exciting... given what a success that market has become, the thought of having it spread out over those two plazas means it can get quite a bit bigger. It's somewhat cramped in its current location.

Authentic_City · #**2735** Posted **May 31, 2017, 6:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

They WILL include all of the rooftop trees and shrubs correct?

Given our harsh winter climate, I'm skeptical that the final product will look like this in terms of landscaping. They may plant all sorts of things on the roof, but I'm not sure it will thrive in the climate here.

Authentic_City · #**2736** Posted **May 31, 2017, 6:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

They look comparably sized, but so much of Hydro Place's plaza is unusable for the market because of the landscaping. On that basis, TNS will probably have more room to accommodate something like the Downtown BIZ market.

That's actually pretty exciting... given what a success that market has become, the thought of having it spread out over those two plazas means it can get quite a bit bigger. It's somewhat cramped in its current location.

That would be great if they expanded the summer market. It's a great thing to have downtown in the summer months.

Urban recluse · #**2737** Posted **May 31, 2017, 7:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Authentic_City

Given our harsh winter climate, I'm skeptical that the final product will look like this in terms of landscaping. They may plant all sorts of things on the roof, but I'm not sure it will thrive in the climate here.

Summer I would think so.

Wolf13 · #**2738** Posted **May 31, 2017, 7:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by rrskylar

^ But isn't it the responsibility of a "good" mayor and ''good" council to limit how much they give? Trouble is we have neither!

Any public money going to projects like this need to evaluated more clearly on a cost-benefit analysis, trouble with politicians here is they throw money around that isn't theirs to begin with an hope it sticks!

The first part is true. I don't blame TNS for getting the money. If there is blame to go around, the councillors and the mayor.

I hope it's justified somehow here, but I admittedly say that because I really like this project! My personal opinion is that Winnipeg has done nothing for a while, and clearly not gotten far for it, so if an injection comes along for a game changer, I'm hopeful.

That also depends on the confidence inspired by the developers... I obviously have more faith in TNS than SkyCity

Quote:

Originally Posted by rrskylar

And also proving that nothing can get done here without public money involved, right?

It's common practice for any city to provide some forms of incentive. In Winnipeg, we actually need some injections. In our case, we fall victim to our market... our rents too low, our prices too high, and not enough competition to drive costs down, and a ho-hum office market.

I lament Winnipeg's attitude to always look to the government for blessings like a child asks its parents if it's allowed to play in the backyard, but in the case of mid/large scale projects downtown, we need the boost. There are a lot of understandable factors that contribute to our high construction costs, but on some levels we have a few trades that dominate their segments and keep their prices high.

The cynicism kicks in if we evaluate the need for such an extravagant project and the associated huge grants, at the expense of more smaller yet successful projects. If I were applying for a TIFF grant with a small/medium scale project and got turned down because TNS got it all, I'd be pissed.

bomberjet · #**2739** Posted **Jun 1, 2017, 9:44 PM**

I encourage you to take a walk by the site, especially down Hargrave, if you're in the area. It's getting big haha.

The Jabroni · #**2740** Posted **Jun 2, 2017, 2:47 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

I encourage you to take a walk by the site, especially down Hargrave, if you're in the area. It's getting big haha.

I actually drove by it earlier today, and holy moly, it's really coming along!

That camera angle really does NOT do justice. They really need to change the angles now.