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  #241  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2021, 9:30 PM
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I'd just like to state for the record that the idea of canMNT/canWNT & the canPL being locked into an app is horrible for the game in Canada and will limit growth going forward. The game tonight vs Haiti should be on TV - it's the biggest game the men's team has had in years.

Not to mention the app is on so few platforms, furthering its inaccessibility.
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  #242  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2021, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by yveseluj View Post
I'd just like to state for the record that the idea of canMNT/canWNT & the canPL being locked into an app is horrible for the game in Canada and will limit growth going forward. The game tonight vs Haiti should be on TV - it's the biggest game the men's team has had in years.

Not to mention the app is on so few platforms, furthering its inaccessibility.
OneSoccer is pretty great, though, and an obvious path for CSA/CPL/CSB to take rather than relying on broadcasters to show games. Remember that TSN would not show every CMNT/CWNT game when they had the rights. This idea that traditional TV holds the key to the future of CMNT/CPL is entirely misplaced, and although there is some market share traditional TV is not the future and not where the future will be watching. Creating OS allows for complete control over the broadcasts, matches, etc. No sense selling your soul to TSN/SN for five minutes on highlight shows that are seeing diminishing audiences.

Sweating over tonight's game, which I will find very easy to watch on browser.
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  #243  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2021, 10:50 PM
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OneSoccer is pretty great, though, and an obvious path for CSA/CPL/CSB to take rather than relying on broadcasters to show games. Remember that TSN would not show every CMNT/CWNT game when they had the rights. This idea that traditional TV holds the key to the future of CMNT/CPL is entirely misplaced, and although there is some market share traditional TV is not the future and not where the future will be watching. Creating OS allows for complete control over the broadcasts, matches, etc. No sense selling your soul to TSN/SN for five minutes on highlight shows that are seeing diminishing audiences.

Sweating over tonight's game, which I will find very easy to watch on browser.
I can appreciate the historic lack of respect by TSN/Sportsnet to Canada’s soccer program, but I feel like we’re entering a bit of a different age here with the program that’d really benefit from a larger audience, especially with some of the world class players we now have. It isn’t going to grow if it’s paywalled in an app most don’t know about.
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  #244  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2021, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by yveseluj View Post
I can appreciate the historic lack of respect by TSN/Sportsnet to Canada’s soccer program, but I feel like we’re entering a bit of a different age here with the program that’d really benefit from a larger audience, especially with some of the world class players we now have. It isn’t going to grow if it’s paywalled in an app most don’t know about.
💯 Exactly
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  #245  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 2:04 AM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Originally Posted by yveseluj View Post
I'd just like to state for the record that the idea of canMNT/canWNT & the canPL being locked into an app is horrible for the game in Canada and will limit growth going forward. The game tonight vs Haiti should be on TV - it's the biggest game the men's team has had in years.

Not to mention the app is on so few platforms, furthering its inaccessibility.
I agree.

I shouldn't need to go on a Russian live stream website to see my own national team play soccer, which is what I'm doing right now.

No one gives a fuck about the Minnesota Twins play the Mariners. Or the Milwaukee Bucks play the Nets. (which is what TSN is showing right now ! )

I bet you any Haitian sitting in Port-Au-Prince right now with a small TV with rabbit ears can see the game ! Me however, with a near $200 monthly TV/Internet bill, can't.

Shameful !

P.S The Haitian goalkeeper just gifted us a goal ! 1-0 Canada. (2-0 agg)
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  #246  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 2:13 AM
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Canadian goalie lets in goal that will make highlight reels around the world.

Canada leading Haiti 1-0 (2-0 on aggregate), once a Canuck always a Canuck.

Larin scores against Haiti again, 2-0

Hoilett scores on his own rebound off the post, Canada up 3-0

On to the Octogonal

Last edited by elly63; Jun 16, 2021 at 3:06 AM.
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  #247  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 3:17 AM
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Originally Posted by yveseluj View Post
I can appreciate the historic lack of respect by TSN/Sportsnet to Canada’s soccer program, but I feel like we’re entering a bit of a different age here with the program that’d really benefit from a larger audience, especially with some of the world class players we now have. It isn’t going to grow if it’s paywalled in an app most don’t know about.
The larger audience will have access when the game is loaned out by OS to TSN for larger matches, as will likely be the case for some of the next round games.

I can't emphasize enough, though, that traditional TV is overwhelmingly in the hands of a demographic that is not the target audience and not where the future of CMNT support lies.

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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone
I shouldn't need to go on a Russian live stream website to see my own national team play soccer, which is what I'm doing right now.
OneSoccer literally costs $6. On you if you're not willing to pay that but are willing to pay for TSN etc.
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  #248  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 3:23 AM
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On to the Octogonal
Here’s hoping we can somehow finish in the top 4.

Top 3 qualify automatically for the World Cup. 4th placed team goes to an intercontinental playoff with 3 other teams (one each from Asia, Oceania and South America) for a chance at a spot in the WC, to be played in June 2022.
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  #249  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 3:28 AM
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OneSoccer literally costs $6. On you if you're not willing to pay that but are willing to pay for TSN etc.
Fuck onesoccer and fuck TSN. Games like this should be shown on CBC or other free-to-air channels, so that anyone with a TV and an antenna can watch.
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  #250  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 3:51 AM
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Best Canadian side ever, that's for sure. But man, TSN shows the highlights but doesn't show the third goal by Hoilett. I mean, it's soccer, there's not that many goals. Would it hurt to show all the goals from your national team?

TSN is just an absolute joke. They just changed their website, which I think looks worse than the previous which still lagged behind SN, but maybe their videos work properly now? This was the second one I watched since their change. Before, you watch one, then it ends, and then it fucks up the rest and you can't scroll down to watch others.

And I worked 10 feet away from the brother of TSN's president for seven years and had many hours of conversation about TSN. I told him many times to tell his bro to fix your shitty website, have your dumb hosts learn how to pronounce names, and of course, to hire me so I can come in there and kick some ass. Whip that place into shape.
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  #251  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 4:54 AM
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Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
Fuck onesoccer and fuck TSN. Games like this should be shown on CBC or other free-to-air channels, so that anyone with a TV and an antenna can watch.
Tell us how you really feel.

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Best Canadian side ever, that's for sure. But man, TSN shows the highlights but doesn't show the third goal by Hoilett. I mean, it's soccer, there's not that many goals. Would it hurt to show all the goals from your national team?

TSN is just an absolute joke. They just changed their website, which I think looks worse than the previous which still lagged behind SN, but maybe their videos work properly now? This was the second one I watched since their change. Before, you watch one, then it ends, and then it fucks up the rest and you can't scroll down to watch others.
And yet people keep saying that things would somehow improve if we were to move rights away from OneSoccer and to an org. like TSN.
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  #252  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 12:07 PM
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I can't emphasize enough, though, that traditional TV is overwhelmingly in the hands of a demographic that is not the target audience and not where the future of CMNT support lies.
You are looking so far into the future that you're overlooking the present. I stand to be corrected but I'm convinced that most people, including young ones, are watching sports mainly on TV. Locking away this event to an app that almost no one has is a great way to ensure continued obscurity. I mean, I realize Canada Soccer has to take what it gets to a certain extent and it can't call the shots, but surely it can do better than this?!
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  #253  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 1:42 PM
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You are looking so far into the future that you're overlooking the present. I stand to be corrected but I'm convinced that most people, including young ones, are watching sports mainly on TV. Locking away this event to an app that almost no one has is a great way to ensure continued obscurity. I mean, I realize Canada Soccer has to take what it gets to a certain extent and it can't call the shots, but surely it can do better than this?!
It doesn't help that the suits in Toronto who run SN and TSN are fixated on broadcast anything else but wholly Canadian leagues and teams. Yes the fawn over the NHL but the CFL is a red headed stepchild and other leagues like CEBL, NLL, CPL, USports and Junior Hockey are unknown bastard children as far as the Toronto Media is concerned.
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  #254  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 1:46 PM
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I stand to be corrected but I'm convinced that most people, including young ones, are watching sports mainly on TV.
I'd take this bet. I'd say the vast, vast majority of younger viewers stream, and of those a good chunk are illegal streams. Older diehead CMNT fans will find a way to watch regardless, and getting younger fans on board is easier with streaming than traditional.

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Locking away this event to an app that almost no one has is a great way to ensure continued obscurity.
We need to get over this notion that, in 2021, a streaming service is any more of a paywall than traditional TV (cable) is. Plenty of young people are willing to pay for things like Netflix and Amazon Prime - they also pay for things like DAZN and OneSoccer. These days i'd say it's more of a hassle to set up cable than streaming. If people are hesitant to sign up for a streaming service then I say 'tough', I guess, because things won't be getting any easier for you in the future as traditional tv is slowly phased out entirely.

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I mean, I realize Canada Soccer has to take what it gets to a certain extent and it can't call the shots, but surely it can do better than this?!
I think Canada Soccer played its cards right when it reorganized its rights into a single streaming package. It's essentially taken the initiative from two different sports bodies (MLS and F1) and combined it into one.
  • MLS rights are packaged under SUM, meaning that all marketing, TV rights, etc. are in-house. If MLS plays a game SUM is a part of it, if USMNT plays a game SUM is a part of it. MLS owners get a chunk, revenues are shared, and everything is consolidated under one roof.
  • F1 rights are increasingly moving online after their purchase by Liberty. Until a few years ago F1 had literally no online presence - no social channels, no streaming, no youtube - nothing. They went on to build F1TV, a dedicated streaming platform and service for all things F1, available around the world including in countries that already have TV deals (TSN's deal ends at the end of this year). It's a more immersive package and i'm giving my money directly to F1 instead of to TSN.

The issue that the CPL faced upon startup was deciding whether or not they wanted to depend on broadcasters to get their product to market or if they would be better off partnering with a video/streaming company, creating and owning that product directly, and then selling it off that way. It was a choice between seeing if a broadcaster would show interest or simply creating the broadcast themselves. When CPL rights began to be packaged together with CMNT/CWNT rights it became obvious that Canada Soccer Business (CSB) was attempted to emulate what was happened in the US with SUM. Every time there's a game on OneSoccer, Canada Soccer gets some sort of piece of it, and when i'm paying for OneSoccer my money is going to MediaPro/Canada Soccer instead of being filtered through TSN. You're essentially cutting out the middle man in the entire exercise.

If TSN/CBC wants to cover games then OS can provide them the feed as they did during Nations League, but as it stands the streaming platform that can be controlled in-house was the wiser decision to make instead of hoping and praying that a broadcaster stepped forward. It gives CPL/Canada Soccer creative control over broadcasts and doesn't mean they're waiting around for broadcasters they can't control to show their product. Combine this with audiences shifting more to streaming and voila.

Like, yes, i'm not ignorant to the fact that traditional TV still has a big audience, but once you start looking at market share trending, audience makeup (demos), and the hurdles of partnering with broadcasters it becomes plainly obvious why OneSoccer exists as it does today and why it wouldn't have made sense for CPL/CMNT to sell their soul and, for the sake of CMNT, get down on their knees and beg for their games to be broadcast as was the case in the past.

tl;dr Canadian broadcasters are shit at covering Canadian sports so CPL/CMNT became their own broadcaster instead.

---

As for the match itself last night, Canada did...fine in the first half? Shaky, could have had better distribution, but on the whole definitely looked stronger than the depleted Haiti team. We actually have a pretty good shot at qualifying for 2022 if things align well in the Ocho. We need to confirm results against Honduras, Panama, and El Salvador, we need wins against Costa Rica and Jamaica, and we need draws against Mexico and the US. It's possible to finish third in this group with the players we have at the moment, but either way playing fourteen meaningful games against strong opponents will be nothing but good for the program.

Now the fun of people arguing that games should be played outside of Toronto and Vancouver.

Last edited by JHikka; Jun 16, 2021 at 1:58 PM.
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  #255  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 2:26 PM
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I don't think saying that TV is on its way out and that streaming is the future is a satisfactory explanation for why coverage of the national team is that crappy and hard to access for such a huge share of the population today (and probably still will be going forward for a few years).

That's just letting broadcast (CBC, CTV) and specialty (TSN, SN) networks off way too easy for their generally piss-poor coverage of Canadian sports.

And none of this has anything to do with Canada being more avant-garde and ahead of the curve.

If TV is a useless dying dinosaur, then why does basically *every single* country have their all of their national team's WC qualifying, Euro or Copa America games broadcast on some sort of reasonably accessible TV channel?
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  #256  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 3:22 PM
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I don't think saying that TV is on its way out and that streaming is the future is a satisfactory explanation for why coverage of the national team is that crappy and hard to access for such a huge share of the population today (and probably still will be going forward for a few years).

That's just letting broadcast (CBC, CTV) and specialty (TSN, SN) networks off way too easy for their generally piss-poor coverage of Canadian sports.

And none of this has anything to do with Canada being more avant-garde and ahead of the curve.

If TV is a useless dying dinosaur, then why does basically *every single* country have their all of their national team's WC qualifying, Euro or Copa America games broadcast on some sort of reasonably accessible TV channel?
All good points.

I don't want to hijack the discussion about last night's game, but then I didn't see last night's game because I don't have onesoccer so I don't have much to add there anyway.

Streaming is awesome if you have some obscure niche product with a small hardcore fanbase willing to pony up. Fantastic if you're into watching a very specific junior B hockey team or maybe scat porn. But something as mainstream as the most mainstream of all sports worldwide should be on broadcast TV. The fact that you need a streaming subscription to see Team Canada means there is a failure somewhere along the line. It's a bug, not a feature.

It's great for the hardcore fans out there who pony up for onesoccer, they'll be there no matter what. But without broadcast TV you lose a lot of cultural relevancy. For instance, my kid likes soccer... he plays it IRL, he plays FIFA, it's always Haaland this, Mbappe that. You can bet that if the game last night was on TSN he probably would have put it on. I'm sure I would have sat down and watched too. But we didn't. The game last night basically didn't happen in my world. Multiply this by however many thousands of similar cases and that's a lot of exposure that is being missed.

I realize Canada Soccer is doing the best it can to play the hand that it was dealt, but the end result is still pretty lousy. It's hilarious that cable packages around here include the Big Ten Network so we can watch riveting college baseball games between Nebraska and Michigan State (on now, I checked) but nothing that includes coverage of our literal national soccer team.
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  #257  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 5:29 PM
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It'll be tough to qualify. I think there are three tiers in the ocho:

Tier 1: Mexico & USA
They'll almost assuredly finish one-two. They're by far the best teams in the confederation.

Tier 2: Costa Rica, Honduras, Jamaica, Canada
Really it's a battle here for spots 3 & 4, and all four of these teams could realistically do it. Honduras & Costa Rica are on their way down, while Jamaica & Canada are on their way up. That said, Honduras and Costa Rica know how to navigate this final stage of qualifying and have qualified recently which surely benefits them. I think Canada is an underdog to qualify but it wouldn't surprise me if we did.

Tier 3: Panama & El Salvador
Not much to say here really. If either of them qualify, they've over-performed I think.
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  #258  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 5:57 PM
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All good points.

I don't want to hijack the discussion about last night's game, but then I didn't see last night's game because I don't have onesoccer so I don't have much to add there anyway.

Streaming is awesome if you have some obscure niche product with a small hardcore fanbase willing to pony up. Fantastic if you're into watching a very specific junior B hockey team or maybe scat porn. But something as mainstream as the most mainstream of all sports worldwide should be on broadcast TV. The fact that you need a streaming subscription to see Team Canada means there is a failure somewhere along the line. It's a bug, not a feature.

It's great for the hardcore fans out there who pony up for onesoccer, they'll be there no matter what. But without broadcast TV you lose a lot of cultural relevancy. For instance, my kid likes soccer... he plays it IRL, he plays FIFA, it's always Haaland this, Mbappe that. You can bet that if the game last night was on TSN he probably would have put it on. I'm sure I would have sat down and watched too. But we didn't. The game last night basically didn't happen in my world. Multiply this by however many thousands of similar cases and that's a lot of exposure that is being missed.

I realize Canada Soccer is doing the best it can to play the hand that it was dealt, but the end result is still pretty lousy. It's hilarious that cable packages around here include the Big Ten Network so we can watch riveting college baseball games between Nebraska and Michigan State (on now, I checked) but nothing that includes coverage of our literal national soccer team.
Definitely agree. Surely the reliance on onesoccer by Soccer Canada isn't a snub towards TSN et al. à la "screw you, we don't need you guys!"

As mentioned earlier, I don't see any major sports going to all-streaming at the moment.
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  #259  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 6:10 PM
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It's great for the hardcore fans out there who pony up for onesoccer, they'll be there no matter what. But without broadcast TV you lose a lot of cultural relevancy. For instance, my kid likes soccer... he plays it IRL, he plays FIFA, it's always Haaland this, Mbappe that. You can bet that if the game last night was on TSN he probably would have put it on. I'm sure I would have sat down and watched too. But we didn't. The game last night basically didn't happen in my world. Multiply this by however many thousands of similar cases and that's a lot of exposure that is being missed.
I genuinely don't get this. Your son definitely knows how to watch video online, and one of you probably know how to type onesoccer.com into a browser, and surely the small amount of money it costs to subscribe to OneSoccer would be worth the slate of CMNT games that are going to be shown now and into the future.

If you son wants to watch Mbappe or Haaland these days he has to stream it on DAZN or online illegally anyway, so what's the difference with OneSoccer? I genuinely don't understand the mental hurdle that some have for going to a website or opening an app to watch something. If I want to get cable today I have to call Bell/Rogers, have a technician come, install a box, set up cable to a TV...but one streaming option for all soccer in Canada is too much?

It doesn't matter anyway, because TSN/SN will come crawling to OS to be able to show Davies & co. on TV when they play the US and Mexico, because only then is it beneficial for them to give a shit about sport in this country. I'd say the games should be on CBC these days but they don't have the funding to have anything make sense these days.
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  #260  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2021, 6:24 PM
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It'll be tough to qualify. I think there are three tiers in the ocho:

Tier 1: Mexico & USA
They'll almost assuredly finish one-two. They're by far the best teams in the confederation.

Tier 2: Costa Rica, Honduras, Jamaica, Canada
Really it's a battle here for spots 3 & 4, and all four of these teams could realistically do it. Honduras & Costa Rica are on their way down, while Jamaica & Canada are on their way up. That said, Honduras and Costa Rica know how to navigate this final stage of qualifying and have qualified recently which surely benefits them. I think Canada is an underdog to qualify but it wouldn't surprise me if we did.

Tier 3: Panama & El Salvador
Not much to say here really. If either of them qualify, they've over-performed I think.
Pretty much agree with this though I'd probably put Panama in Tier 2.

Canada could end up 7th as much as it could end up 3rd.
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