Perimeter Highway | Winnipeg

[BuildUpWpg]

Originally Posted by esquire

The study notes that the freeway upgrade was recommended back in 1988 yet there was literally no progress for 30+ years until they started closing down some of the median openings last year.

There is no excuse for not doing it this time.

Probably because the province noticed that Saskatchewan is leaping well ahead of us in freeway building...

[esquire]

Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg

Probably because the province noticed that Saskatchewan is leaping well ahead of us in freeway building...

That's the same way we'll eventually get an LRT... construction will commence a year after Saskatoon's first line opens

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by esquire

That's the same way we'll eventually get an LRT... construction will commence a year after Saskatoon's first line opens

More like our politicians will consider one LRT line only once Saskatoon and Regina both have a fully built out LRT system with high speed trains connecting the two cities and with daily service to Edmonton and Calgary.

Much like how Regina got a full freeway system for 3/4 around the city and Manitoba says "Here's a singular diamond interchange because we need to look like we're spending stimulus money"

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by esquire

That's the same way we'll eventually get an LRT... construction will commence a year after Saskatoon's first line opens

LOL! Funny but true, but you just know Winnipeg would only send a contingent to Saskatoon to study the feasibility of an LRT before commencing a long term study or two!

[The Jabroni]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

LOL! Funny but true, but you just know Winnipeg would only send a contingent to Saskatoon to study the feasibility of an LRT before commencing a long term study or two!

And have two more studies on top of other studies, just to make sure it is completely feasible, while cross-referencing previous studies made 10 years before, that cross-referenced previous studies 50 years before.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by WildCake

More like our politicians will consider one LRT line only once Saskatoon and Regina both have a fully built out LRT system with high speed trains connecting the two cities and with daily service to Edmonton and Calgary.

Much like how Regina got a full freeway system for 3/4 around the city and Manitoba says "Here's a singular diamond interchange because we need to look like we're spending stimulus money"

How did Saskatchewan finance such an expensive highway project? It's not likely that Manitoba politicians would deliberately avoid a vote-winning project like Perimeter Highway improvements if the financial means to pursue it actually existed.

[Dengler Avenue]

P3. Pay back later over decades.

[Glenn99]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

The 'initial' phase is based on 2048 traffic flows. So 30 years out from 2018 when the study was actually done. So pretty much ya they'll be doing 1 project at a time type thing forever.

I don't think it actually says anything that it will take until 2048. Just based on 2048 volumes. It also says timing of the ultimate phase s uncertain. By that time I'd presume they will have already reassessed based on actual traffic volumes. 30 years is a long time.

Funding is a big problem. Make it a toll road like the 407 and you'd have it done in 10 years. Of course there would be a change in government in that time and the whole thing would be cancelled.

[Dengler Avenue]

Don’t
toll
existing
roads.
Headingley and Deacon’s Corners Bypass, maybe, but not this.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Don’t
toll
existing
roads.
Headingley and Deacon’s Corners Bypass, maybe, but not this.

I agree. Doing this as a P3 would be a simple solution. Does MB have actual plans for the road and interchanges?

Sometimes I wonder if MB (provincial government) has convinced itself that only one interchange can be built at a time. Money can't be the only issue. There's never going to be a better time to build than now. Interest rates are going to be super low for years and construction costs will probably never be this low again.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

I agree. Doing this as a P3 would be a simple solution. Does MB have actual plans for the road and interchanges?

Sometimes I wonder if MB (provincial government) has convinced itself that only one interchange can be built at a time. Money can't be the only issue. There's never going to be a better time to build than now. Interest rates are going to be super low for years and construction costs will probably never be this low again.

Bingo!

[esquire]

It really is weird. I would like to hear the explanation why normal, routine infrastructure in other places, like diamond interchanges on major highways, is some kind of insurmountable challenge in this province. Which it must be, since there aren't any actual diamond interchanges here.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by esquire

It really is weird. I would like to hear the explanation why normal, routine infrastructure in other places, like diamond interchanges on major highways, is some kind of insurmountable challenge in this province. Which it must be, since there aren't any actual diamond interchanges here.

Winnipeg is the economic driver of Manitoba and where highway infrastructure dollars need to be spent with 80% of the province’s population, 1) continue Canada Way west and connect to the TCH west of Headingly, 2) bypass around St. Norbert lined up with Kenaston, 3) South Perimeter free flowing with two interchanges at St. Anne’s and St. Mary’s with all other access points closed off 4) overpass at Elie, 5) overpass and interchange at TCH and Yellowhead Hwy. 6) continue divided TCH to Ontario border 7) overpass on TCH at one of the Brandon access points....

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by esquire

It really is weird. I would like to hear the explanation why normal, routine infrastructure in other places, like diamond interchanges on major highways, is some kind of insurmountable challenge in this province. Which it must be, since there aren't any actual diamond interchanges here.

That is so weird that MB has no diamond interchanges given that they're the cheapest type of interchange to build in the vast majority of cases.

I was just looking up a major road project in Calgary to see if there's a progress report on it and came across some interesting info. For the current phase of the project they applied for funding from the feds under the National Trade Corridors Fund and ended up receiving $50 million which covers just shy of 1/3 of the cost ($153.35 million). The City, province and Calgary Airport Authority are covering the rest of the cost. Has Winnipeg and/or the province of MB applied for such funding? The Perimeter Highway should qualify if this fund still exists. With some initiative and thinking outside the box (P3) there's no reason why a major stretch of that highway couldn't be turned into a proper freeway within about five years if there are design plans in place.

[DavefromSt.Vital]

National Trade Corridors Fund info (funding until 2028):

https://tc.canada.ca/en/programs/nat...corridors-fund

Projects already funded:

https://tc.canada.ca/en/programs/pro...corridors-fund

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

Has Winnipeg and/or the province of MB applied for such funding? The Perimeter Highway should qualify if this fund still exists. With some initiative and thinking outside the box (P3) there's no reason why a major stretch of that highway couldn't be turned into a proper freeway within about five years if there are design plans in place.

We have a Premier who thinks accepting federal money is a sign of weakness. If we can't do it ourselves, it isn't happening. Somewhere along the line Pallister became a major adherent of North Korean juche principles of self-reliance. 주체 主體!!!

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by esquire

We have a Premier who thinks accepting federal money is a sign of weakness. If we can't do it ourselves, it isn't happening. Somewhere along the line Pallister became a major adherent of North Korean juche principles of self-reliance. 주체 主體!!!

$2.5 B in equalization payments to MB the past couple years says otherwise!

https://www.canada.ca/en/department-...transfers.html

[esquire]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

$2.5 B in equalization payments to MB the past couple years says otherwise!

https://www.canada.ca/en/department-...transfers.html

So explain to me why he'll accept federal money for social programs (outlined in the page you linked to) but not for infrastructure?

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by esquire

So explain to me why he'll accept federal money for social programs (outlined in the page you linked to) but not for infrastructure?

Two easy answers. He can't refuse the funds outlined, and they don't require him to provide matching funds.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

Two easy answers. He can't refuse the funds outlined, and they don't require him to provide matching funds.

He also thinks everything is an intrusion into provincial jurisdiction. So fair enough, he can stand his ground and not yield to Ottawa. But in the meantime little gets done, and we continue to drive around on our 1970s highway network.