Mobile Development Thread

[Bogue]

Yeah, I suspect the part going between Daphne the mall would get the biggest traffic. It would take a huge amt. of money to just get that leg up and running (esp. given the geography & geology to get across the bay). I just included the airport b/c I thought it might drive up use of the airport if folk on the Eastern Shore could get a quick drop-off at a train stop at the Eastern Shore Center or at the Bass Pro Shop area & a straight shot out to the airport. It also might make it easy for folk living in Midtown & Downtown to take a quick shopping trip across the bay. They wouldn't have to worry about traffic. This also lessens the impact on I-10 during rush hours. It might also be feasible to have the leg going from downtown out to the airport in streetcar style. That might be the way to get around the route planning through the historic neighborhoods of Midtown.

[MobiMan]

What about and aerial Tram system from DT to the eastern shore, have a drop off, pick up point on both sides of course so it can come and go, actually make it 2 so one can go as one is coming,(they could design it like an old DT trolly to match the historic DT) then taxis, trollies, the Wave whoever can take them wherever they wanna go from there. Some run on Batteries and solar power together, so they are green, that would help put us in the green zone... we could also use Bio Diesel fuel for our trollies and the wave sysytem... it cost around $1 to make a gallon of bio fuel, it is one part alcohol (methane) to 5 parts cooking oil and a tbl spoon of a catalyst, you mix it together and then let it settle then you pour the Bio Diesel off the sediment and pour it in your tank... its that simple... the city could make a contract with restaurants and pick up their old oil, or anyone could... Get some 55 gallon drums mix it up use a hand pump or electric and there you go... your own little Bio Fuel Station... you could supply Bio Fuel to the city, and any company thats wants to go somewhat green... you will need a lot of 55 gallon drums or a very large tank... the thinking behind this is to help relieve the traffic problems at the tunnels, i doubt it would solve it completely but it would help, and wouldnt it be cool

[Bogue]

I think economic situations are more at fault for what's going on w/ lower income folk and crime than attractions, but I agree that education can play a key role in changing that situation for the better. There's always going to be a few folk who think the alternate is better, but there's no harm in working to fix as much of the problem as able.

[Bogue]

The aerial tram system is an interesting take. It would probably go down in a hurricane, though... but maybe they can reinforce the towers so that all that would need to be replaced is the cables.

I believe an aerial tram is used to link an island in NYC to the rest of the city.

Not sure it would be a viable transport link, though, b/c it wouldn't significantly lessen travel time. It'd be a tourist thing mainly it would seem, but a pretty cool tourist attraction.

[MobiMan]

Sorry about the post i seperated everything and then when i posted it, it all came out ran together...

As far as Attractions helping with crime and poverty, that wasn't what i meant, i just got carried away and ran all that together.
But actually it can help, it generates more tax money for the city,
which in return can and would in part be used for Education ,more police officers, more job's, and if and only if our local Government would set up some kind of mandatory assistance for these people, and a time frame on how long people can stay on foodstamps, welfare, and as far as low housing give them a time frame on how long they can stay living off tax payers, say a single mother of 2 children, husband left she's uneducated, unemployed and has no where to go, so she put herself and her kids in the system, ok they set it up where she gets free day care, foodstamps, a place to live, and with that come's mandatory job training or college classes, paid for by local Government and private donation's, maybe even some local colleges can take a few for free, i know they have some if not all this stuff now, but it should be mandatory and regulated, we have tomany people here that have been on welfare for years and years, they were raised on it and they are now raising their kids on it, and some even have men living in the public housing with them not paying a dime, and selling dope on street corners driving $50,000 dollar cars with 22's, living and eating on our tax money, and living better then those of us that are working a real job, those on welfare aren't regulated like they should be and most these women have more kids, and that just add's to what they get every month, hell i was in wal-mart on the Beltline and the lady in front of me had, what looked like 6 inch finger nails, long fake hair, pedicure, and about a $300 coach purse that she pulled an EBT Foodstamp card out of to pay for her groceries... ok im getting carried away again



Ok now i also made a mistake on the Aerial Tram saying it would help with traffic at the tunnels... ok that was going to far, they usually only carry around 20 to 40 people at a time, although im sure it would have a very small impact on the traffic problem, but not a big one, It would be exciting for those of us that want to have fun DT and then afterwards would like to shop accross the bay, and those from the Easter Shore that would like to come here, im sure it would draw huge crowds at first then it would drop down and go to being more managable and comfortable, it would be worth looking into, and both sides of the bay could put in on it, the only thing i ask is do it with style and class, i can't stand seeing these modern day boxes hanging from a wire

[pboo74]

Mobiman I'am glad you said all of those things it's very true and if someone can say this stuff in the city meetings this week for downtown that will be awesome.I wondered why they stopped the horse and carriage that was neat for the city.They need to bring it back.

[mobile]

Originally Posted by pkp

I never said not to think outside of the box. But, I for one really don't want to be just another sprawling sunbelt city. If I wanted Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas, I would move there. I want to be bigger and better. But just copying what everyone else (sports, zoo, aquarium, etc...) has is not thinking outside of the box. You are working to copy something that other cities (with much greater resources) already have. Let's be progressive, let's be smart. Let's focus on transportation, culture, education, arts. I can guarantee you, unless we are looking at a 3MM MSA, forget about pro sports. And why would that make us a better city anyway? I think B'ham is a great city, but their leadership's pursuit of a domed stadium and a pro sports team is the biggest waste of time and resources I think I have ever seen. If I was looking to spend $500 - $600MM on something, how about something that creates well paying jobs and better opportunities - not something that provides a $7 per hour concession stand job or a $8 an hour retail job. Create real economic development and these things will come.
How about the Portland of the South, with better food and more interesting culture of course.

U don’t have to tell me that you’re not thinking outside the box its obvious u are not. I never said anything about Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas????? But those cities do have a lot more to do than we do.

I would take a baseball team over whatever u are talking about anyway of the week. Do u understand how much more exposure that would give us??? No were not ready for it now but I’m said in the future of Mobile. And are MSA doesn’t have to be 3million to get a sports franchise. Example, Green Bay’s MSA is less than 300,000. Putting a baseball team here would put much more wealthy people in our are than whatever u are talking about.

And Portland who thinks of Portland when it comes to big Cities? I would much rather live in Atlanta, Houston, or Dallas…. O or Phoenix than Portland.

Just my 2 cents

[Bogue]

The carriage rides would be cool.

[Bogue]

Portland has a NBA franchise (the Trailblazers) and they are considered a great place to live... too cold for my liking, of course.

It has a ton of things going for it in terms of things to do, many would prefer it over the sprawling metropoli that have sprung up over the last 20 years.

[mobile]

Originally Posted by pkp

Why would you want it to? Phoenix is a shit hole, urban waste land with some god spas and golf courses that are draining the CO river dry. If you want to be big, think NYC, Chicago, European cities, etc... not one of the most sprawling cities in the world. Growth for the sake of growth is pointless. "Good" growth is a different story.

WOW really man, really??? U just gonna throw someone’s city un the dumps like that. Harsh words to call that City A Shit Hole!!! Just because u don’t like doesn’t make it a shit hole. I would prefer to live in Phoenix than NYC or Chicago or any European City. But this is coming from the same guy who is always bashing Baldwin County as well. Do you think that your ideas are just the best and everyone else should agree with what ever shit that spews out of your mouth? Not everyone is going to agree with you.

Newsflash: Some people may prefer to live in Baldwin or west Mobile. Not everyone wants to live the same life style.

[mobile]

Originally Posted by Bogue

Portland has a NBA franchise (the Trailblazers) and they are considered a great place to live... too cold for my liking, of course.

It has a ton of things going for it in terms of things to do, many would prefer it over the sprawling metropoli that have sprung up over the last 20 years.

I know that Portland has a basketball team but so does ATL, Dallas, Phoenix, and Charlotte. And I would prefer to live in any of those places and I bet they have more things to do than Portland does. Anyway I never said Mobile should try to be like Phoenix.

I just said that if Phoenix can grow like it did so can Mobile if we do the right things to make it happen! If you build it they will come, so we just need to start building. JMO

[Bogue]

Charlotte's a decent city... Atlanta, Phoenix, & Dallas are just covered in sprawl is my only major problem w/ them. I'm far from being against development. I just don't want that kind of sprawl.

[mobile]

This is the list I want Mobile on. O and I want us on top of this list.


Fastest-growing metro areas
St. George, Utah has added more people than any other area; Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia has lost the most.
By Les Christie, CNNMoney.com staff writer
October 16 2006: 10:43 AM EDT


NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- St. George, Utah had the biggest gain in population in the United States during the past six years, according to a U.S. Census report released Tuesday.

The city in the southwestern corner of the state grew 31.6 percent to 118,885 between April 1, 2000 and July 1, 2005. St. George nosed out the former leader, the Greeley, Colorado metro area, which has gained 26.6 percent over the same period.

A metropolitan area is defined as one that has a core urban area and a population of 50,000 or more.

Most of the fastest growers were medium to smaller metro areas and six of the top 10 were located west of the Mississippi. Only one of the four eastern cities in the top 10 - Raleigh, North Carolina - was outside Florida.

In sheer numbers, Atlanta has added more people, 669,699, than any other metro area. It grew by 15.8 percent during the period. Other big gainers included Dallas (657,957), Riverside-San Bernardino (655,133) and Phoenix (613,201).

Quite a number of places lost population. Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia decreased 4.6 percent, a greater rate than any other metro area. Numerically, the biggest loser was Pittsburgh, where the population dropped 45,013.

The Census Bureau also published stats for micropolitan areas, those with populations between 10,000 and 50,000. Palm Coast, Florida, is the fastest growing of these places; it gained 53.3 percent.

Losing the highest percentage of its population was Pecos, Texas, which dropped 11.4 percent

[mobile]

I would also like to see mobile on top of this list.

best places to live.

Mobile, AL $43,412 9.00% 2.00%-5.00% $2,064 -1.65%
1 Fort Collins, CO $64,623 6.70% 4.63%-4.63% $2,194 6.13%
2 Naperville, IL $112,258 6.75% 3.00%-3.00% $2,006 12.14%
3 Sugar Land, TX $101,168 8.25% n/a $2,490 30.53%
4 Columbia/Ellicott City, MD $96,082 5.00% 2.00%-4.75% $2,813 11.58%
5 Cary, NC $98,360 7.00% 6.00%-8.25% $2,203 16.14%
6 Overland Park, KS $89,792 7.53% 3.50%-6.45% $2,108 10.07%
7 Scottsdale, AZ $84,747 7.95% 2.87%-5.04% $2,588 8.75%
8 Boise, ID $58,489 5.00% 1.60%-7.80% $1,738 12.11%
9 Fairfield, CT $113,429 6.00% 3.00%-5.00% $2,505 4.05%
10 Eden Prairie, MN $105,177 6.50% 5.35%-7.85% $2,173 7.33%
Best places average $76,893 6.55% 2.74-6.46% $2,207 10.97%

[NitekKetin]

Originally Posted by mobile

I would also like to see mobile on top of this list.

best places to live.

Mobile, AL $43,412 9.00% 2.00%-5.00% $2,064 -1.65%
1 Fort Collins, CO $64,623 6.70% 4.63%-4.63% $2,194 6.13%
2 Naperville, IL $112,258 6.75% 3.00%-3.00% $2,006 12.14%
3 Sugar Land, TX $101,168 8.25% n/a $2,490 30.53%.....

These numbers are meaningless without context. I hope it isn't equating high income with quality of city life and other factors.

[NitekKetin]

Originally Posted by mobile

This is the list I want Mobile on. O and I want us on top of this list.


Fastest-growing metro areas
St. George, Utah has added more people than any other area; Hinesville-Fort Stewart, Georgia has lost the most.
By Les Christie, CNNMoney.com staff writer
October 16 2006: 10:43 AM EDT

Mobile and the Central Gulf Coast is not going to *rocket* to the top of that list without a substantial reason for it to do so. We need strong school systems, a couple of top notch institutes of higher learning, cultural venues and quality infrastructure. Trendy professional sports teams and low density suburban planning are not steps in the right direction.

[pkp]

mobile-
St. George, UT and Sugar Land, TX. Really shooting for the stars, huh?

And on Phoenix, my point is that just because a city triples in size in ten years does not make it better. I feel like a broken record, but this IS and urban living forum. If I liked sprawling cities, I would have joined stripmall.com, or parkinglot.com, or 25laneinterstate.com. People are certainly entitled to like what ever kind of city they want - it takes all kinds. But, as someone who actually lives in the city, I have my opinions on the direction I would like to see it take. And on Baldwin County, I've got a place there at the beach too. There are good things about it. The beaches are nice, and there is still some nice rural land there. However, if its sprawl (like the majority of the ES and even moving as far East as Loxley), I'm not going to like it no matter where it is. You kids just don't get it. I really don't understand why you are on this forum if all you are concerned with is having 10MM residents even if it means turning into just another sprawling sunbelt city. In addition, I would love to see us have 10 pro sports teams and 5 aquariums and a dozen zoos and 20 more shopping malls with a Gap. But guess what - lets spend some that capital on better schools (especially the community college system), public safety, transportation, real economic development, etc... These things are great, but other than the construction jobs, you are talking about a bunch of minimum wage jobs that are not going to increase the living standards here. There is certainly nothing wrong with working at a concession stand at a stadium or being a cashier at a store, but wouldn't you rather have some jobs paying $50,000 a year with full benefits than jobs paying $12,000 with nothing else? Good jobs are what make places grow. I think we can work to provide these while growing our city (and region) in a smart, sustainable manner.

[MobiMan]

We take this Forum all over the place...PKP you are right we do need Economic Development, and so far they are doing pretty good at bringing better higher paying jobs to Mobile, We have 2000 people from here working at Northrop Gruman in Pascagoula, we have our own shipyards, Benders, Atlantic Marine, Austal(which is exspanding and will bring in another 1000 jobs)TK 2500 jobs not sure about wages i went to their meeting and they arent set on wage prices yet but somewhere in the $50,000 range.
Hopefully we will be building the new Tanker, those will be in the $50,000 to low $60,000's. and also we haven't been hit by the new Vendors that will relocate or atleast open up shop here once TK is finished...And if we get the Tanker deal we will be hit by even more Vendors setting up shop, Those could bring in another few hundred to a few 1000 new job's, those things should Create a small boom in population, TK is bringing in 35000 workers for their project, maybe some of those people will like here and stay, ofcourse they would probably live out of city limits, but you never know
Good things are coming to Mobile we just need to be patient,
and prepair ourselves for whats about to come,
also if you have unique Business ideas that you feel will provide a good service, you need to make a business plan and start working on putting the finances together...
Mobile is gonna grow, we wont hit 1mm in our lifetime and if we did it would be to sudden, we wouldn't be ready, we need to be around 300,000 residents,
not more poor people but middle class or higher, so we can get those big name store's everyone want's here, and even with the extra 100,000 people in the city we would have to build, a few Highrise condos and apartment buildings...

one thing that gets me is our land is so limited here in Mobile, and instead of apartment and condo builders or owners building up they build out, retail also, Colonial mall is the largest Mall on the gulfcoast, i never undertood why they didint build up atleast 2 or 3 stories, they would have used less land, had more parking and more out parcels, its an indoor Mall so up would have been ideal, And they could have built it with style

We have to have positive Growth, we need upper class higher paying jobs, when those big stores look for new locations for their stores
they don't only check to see how many people you have living in the area
they wanna know what the median income is as well... if there is not enough people making a certain amount of money they are not going to locate a store here.even if we have 300,000 people


And whats the deal with dollar stores they are on every corner in mobile
i stopped counting after 30,
they are less than a mile apart in some areas, Amazing
Mobile= Wal-Marts and Dollar stores
and those jobs dont pay shit, but atleast people are working i guess
Minumum wage went up and so did the cost of living, food and gas prices went up right after
as soon as big retailers find out they have to pay more they charge more and claim that item they buy from china for a dollar and sell you for $25 cost them $24 after freight, stocking it, advertising, payroll, and so and so on

let me stop before i get way off topic

[phoenixboi08]

Originally Posted by mobile

I know that Portland has a basketball team but so does ATL, Dallas, Phoenix, and Charlotte. And I would prefer to live in any of those places and I bet they have more things to do than Portland does. Anyway I never said Mobile should try to be like Phoenix.

I just said that if Phoenix can grow like it did so can Mobile if we do the right things to make it happen! If you build it they will come, so we just need to start building. JMO

I was born and raised in Phoenix. I've been living in Mobile for about 4 1/2 years, since I was about 15, And am begining to see some of the same threads of boom!
However, PHX was booming even before I was born, '90. That city has one of the, if not THE, STRONGEST real estate markets in the country. I've had friends whose parents worked in LA and commuted back and forth. People like to have the benifits of being in a slower enviornment than what they're used to. They just don't want to give up all the amenities. PHX has had AMAZING development, although, you ABSOLUTELY have to have a car to live there. The bus system is great and they just finised a light rail system, but it's just TOO big. It's like...take Mobile, and multiply it by three. That's about right, I think (area of course). It's the SECOND largest capital city in area, Not to mention the LARGEST capital city in pop (No.5 in the country). All that's great, but has an economy that Mobile doesn't have. This city won't be able to support an infrastructure that big for a while. That's why I'm SOOOO against sprawl. I wouldn't want Mobile to become that big (well, not if it isn't smart growth, but a completely different story)
I know I'm going on and on, but my point is that Mobile isn't going to have an pop. explosion. Don't get me wrong. The economy will explode and the pop. will grow dramatically in a short time...If you lived in Phoenix for a year, or even 6 months, you'd know what I mean when I say explosion. That pace wouldn't be good for Mobile.

[phoenixboi08]

Originally Posted by pkp

mobile-
St. George, UT and Sugar Land, TX. Really shooting for the stars, huh?

And on Phoenix, my point is that just because a city triples in size in ten years does not make it better. I feel like a broken record, but this IS and urban living forum. If I liked sprawling cities, I would have joined stripmall.com, or parkinglot.com, or 25laneinterstate.com. People are certainly entitled to like what ever kind of city they want - it takes all kinds. But, as someone who actually lives in the city, I have my opinions on the direction I would like to see it take. And on Baldwin County, I've got a place there at the beach too. There are good things about it. The beaches are nice, and there is still some nice rural land there. However, if its sprawl (like the majority of the ES and even moving as far East as Loxley), I'm not going to like it no matter where it is. You kids just don't get it. I really don't understand why you are on this forum if all you are concerned with is having 10MM residents even if it means turning into just another sprawling sunbelt city. In addition, I would love to see us have 10 pro sports teams and 5 aquariums and a dozen zoos and 20 more shopping malls with a Gap. But guess what - lets spend some that capital on better schools (especially the community college system), public safety, transportation, real economic development, etc... These things are great, but other than the construction jobs, you are talking about a bunch of minimum wage jobs that are not going to increase the living standards here. There is certainly nothing wrong with working at a concession stand at a stadium or being a cashier at a store, but wouldn't you rather have some jobs paying $50,000 a year with full benefits than jobs paying $12,000 with nothing else? Good jobs are what make places grow. I think we can work to provide these while growing our city (and region) in a smart, sustainable manner.

I HATE to double post, but...
Okay I'm not fond of sprawl either, but you have to take into context that every city isn't New York, Chicago, etc...Phoenix, for instance is a YOUNG city (it is older than the state itself, but that's beside the point). The development in the city is logical and makes sense. You don't have to drive cross city to get to good retail, dining, entertainment. I mean look at the new stadium (2008 Super Bowl) They built that in Glendale. An area that's comparable in distance from their downtown as our downtown is to Causey Middle School (probably a little further)
My point is, urban development isn't always tall skyscrapers, ect (though I willfully admit that IS the name of this website ). There are other components. I mean think about it. With a city of over 1.5 million people, you're going to get some sprawl, but the city has managed a GREAT infrastructre. You should really chenck out the cities thread. There are MANY MANY urban developments planned and already built all over the city. Having lived there for so long I can easily say that it isn't just suburbs. There are many urban qualities to the city. And the downtown area is never too far away. I lived over
The highway and street layouts are efficient. I've rarely EVER been stuck in bad traffic despite the number of people.


And it isn't exactly growth THEN a strong economy. Phoenix is a huge manufactoring center. There are 2 army bases. not to mention that it currently home to seven major Fortune 1000 companies, several Fortune 500 companies, and the greater Phoenix area is a $50 billion marketplace driven by technology. World-leading companies such as Intel, Avnet, Motorola, AlliedSignal, Honeywell and Boeing Company have chosen Phoenix for their corporate and regional headquarters. Industry giants such as American Express, Phelps Dodge, Sumitomo Sitix, Prudential, Charles Schwab and Mayo Clinic have major operations in Phoenix
The government is also very efficient and open to propositions and ideas
..IDK, I guess to each his own, right?

http://www.efineliving.com/vs_location.asp?PHX