Manitoba Highways

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

Sparse maintenance. Do you have proof to support your claim the P3 provider in NB is skimping on maintenance? Nova Scotia is using P3 to finance the continued twinning of the TCH. In Manitoba, nothing happens but talk and more talk.

Ironically, it was the NB government that took the P3 provider to court in 2022-23 to try to pay LESS for maintenance than what was stipulated in the P3 contract. The province lost!

This is what was built with with one of the P3 contracts:
http://conf.tac-atc.ca/english/resou...s17/Blaney.pdf

I wasn't making a statement. I was asking a question. A P3 happens due to profit incentive. These companies aren't making donations. How do they make money off public infrastructure.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

I wasn't making a statement. I was asking a question. A P3 happens due to profit incentive. These companies aren't making donations. How do they make money off public infrastructure.

These two articles may answer your question:
https://mcmillan.ca/wp-content/uploa...cture_0508.pdf
https://www.acec.ca/files/Publications/P3report.pdf

[bomberjet]

https://www.gov.mb.ca/asset_library/...erpoint_en.pdf

Presentation boards for PTH 12 and PR 210 at Ste. Anne.

FFS, I can not stand these intersection improvements. Let's through in a round-about on a divided 100km/h highway. Better yet let's put in a half R-CUT like a PTH 1/5. The half median closure it is, I guess.

I see they also have the site ready to show us what the R-CUT at PTH will look like. To be posted soon.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

https://www.gov.mb.ca/asset_library/...erpoint_en.pdf

Presentation boards for PTH 12 and PR 210 at Ste. Anne.

FFS, I can not stand these intersection improvements. Let's through in a round-about on a divided 100km/h highway. Better yet let's put in a half R-CUT like a PTH 1/5. The half median closure it is, I guess.

I see they also have the site ready to show us what the R-CUT at PTH will look like. To be posted soon.

I fully support the roundabout design. Roundabouts reduce accidents, are cheap, and safe for the environment. They also ease up traffic congestion.

I'm fully on board for more Roundabouts. In 20 years, most Manitobans will wonder how they ever commuted without these magnificent traffic circles.

Be like Europe and not the USA. But Roundabouts today!

[bomberjet]

haha even in Europe they don't have round about on the freeway mainlines. But to your point we don't have those in Manitoba so no need to worry!

I don't have a problem with round abouts in general. Just not on the highway mainline.

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

https://www.gov.mb.ca/asset_library/...erpoint_en.pdf

Presentation boards for PTH 12 and PR 210 at Ste. Anne.

FFS, I can not stand these intersection improvements. Let's through in a round-about on a divided 100km/h highway. Better yet let's put in a half R-CUT like a PTH 1/5. The half median closure it is, I guess.

I see they also have the site ready to show us what the R-CUT at PTH will look like. To be posted soon.

Moronic options.

Full median closure would be the best of those.

[anthonyk]

Originally Posted by BlackDog204

I fully support the roundabout design. Roundabouts reduce accidents, are cheap, and safe for the environment.

From the presentation boards regarding the roundabout option: "Anticipated to increase overall collision rate, but collisions expected to be less severe"

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by anthonyk

From the presentation boards regarding the roundabout option: "Anticipated to increase overall collision rate, but collisions expected to be less severe"

Studies by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety show that roundabouts provide a:

90 percent reduction in fatal crashes;
76 percent reduction in injury crashes;
30 to 40 percent reduction in pedestrian crashes; and
10 percent reduction in bicycle crashes

-----

Keep in mind, these stats are from the official State of Iowa website, so they tend to be better drivers than us.

[FactaNV]

12 and 210 seem like a good place for a roundabout to me. Similar dynamic to 207 and 213 which is way better with a roundabout imo, especially when trying to get on to 207 towards Oakbank or BHP. Slows people down for only a moment and traffic flows way better now.

[drew]

^ isn't there room to increase the diameter of the roundabout a bit?

I like roundabouts. The long term maintenance costs (in comparison to bridges etc) are also a plus - especially in perpetually poor places like Manitoba.

[bomberjet]

What are the collision stats at PTH 12 and PR 210?

I am steadfast in my dislike of said round abouts on the mainline of our twinned PTH network. Just close the access point.

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

What are the collision stats at PTH 12 and PR 210?

I am steadfast in my dislike of said round abouts on the mainline of our twinned PTH network. Just close the access point.

Cheaper [x]
Less disruptive of PTH traffic [x]
Doesn't look bush league [x]

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by drew

I like roundabouts.

Originally Posted by BlackDog204

I fully support the roundabout design.

Show me a roundabout on a dual-carriageway, 110km/h+ speed, main cross country rural highway. I'll wait.

This isn't innovation, it's inventing stupidity. Roundabouts go on local and collector roads. Not arterial or freeway/highways. Period.

[drew]

We can be innovators!

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by drew

We can be innovators!

That's the spirit!

[drew]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Show me a roundabout on a dual-carriageway, 110km/h+ speed, main cross country rural highway. I'll wait.

This isn't innovation, it's inventing stupidity. Roundabouts go on local and collector roads. Not arterial or freeway/highways. Period.

Who gives a shit what people do in other places? We have to work with what we have available here and our own constraints.

MB basically can't afford anything. Based on the reality of the current and likely perpetual meager funds we have for highways any talk of fly-overs, bridges, grade separations and the like should only be looked at on the absolute major highways (#1, 75, perimeter).

The goal in all cases should be "free flow" and safety. However flawed they may seem to be, roundabouts solve these issues while also remaining cost effective forever. They also don't prevent you in doing further improvements "down the road" should $$ ever materialize.

[anthonyk]

Originally Posted by drew

...any talk of fly-overs, bridges, grade separations and the like should only be looked at on the absolute major highways (#1, 75, perimeter).

The goal in all cases should be "free flow" and safety. However flawed they may seem to be, roundabouts solve these issues while also remaining cost effective forever. They also don't prevent you in doing further improvements "down the road" should $$ ever materialize.

For reference, PTH 12 @ 210 had an AADT of 11,180 in 2019, PTH 75 had about half that or less for most of it's length from Emerson to St. Adolphe. So, by your logic, PTH 75 shouldn't have any grade separations beyond the St. Norbert bypass.

Closing the median creates free-flow, is cost effective forever, and has even less effect on future improvements.

[optimusREIM]

Some people are just horny for roundabouts on major highways.

I myself don't have a problem with roundabouts, wish we would use them more in fact, especially for the intersections of two minor highways. Should be the standard.

I think there are certain classes of routes which should have a designation which means that any future improvements should conform with good highway design. Use the interstate standard as far as that goes. Or adopt some european standards, doesn't really matter.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by optimusREIM

Some people are just horny for roundabouts on major highways.

I myself don't have a problem with roundabouts, wish we would use them more in fact, especially for the intersections of two minor highways. Should be the standard.

I think there are certain classes of routes which should have a designation which means that any future improvements should conform with good highway design. Use the interstate standard as far as that goes. Or adopt some european standards, doesn't really matter.

This what $210M gets you in Nova Scotia for a highway project. Plus, roundabouts used as appropriate.
https://novascotia.ca/tran/highways/...-extension.pdf

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by ozabald

this what $210m gets you in nova scotia for a highway project. Plus, roundabouts used as appropriate.
https://novascotia.ca/tran/highways/...-extension.pdf

10/10