ATLANTA | Development Thread V

[atl2phx]

Originally Posted by simms3

An out of context example (which how do you take typed words out of context? spoken - easily, written - much more difficult): I said, referring to the MARTA girl video, that a normal blonde haired and blue eyed guy might feel uncomfortable in that crowd. I did not type, or think for those of you who read between the lines, that normal only includes blonde and blue. I just described myself as normal. It would be akin to me saying (if I were African American or gay) that I might feel uncomfortable being the only AA or gay at a white southern Baptist Convention (or lets go the exteme route and say KKK rally...I think MARTA girl situation was somewhere between the two in extremes of people).

personally, i have no reason not to believe you. i do, however, find your experience exceptional and i know for a fact it represents an outlier on the distribution of the "normal" rider experience on marta.

having said that, you're a young guy who admittedly grew up in the suburbs and is experiencing life in the city as a resident probably for the first time. what i notice in your postings are extreme examples of the typical "us vs. them" mentality. you posted the youtube video of crazy chick as a "typical" marta rider and experience....that's simply not true.

my issue is your ASSUMING your experience to be NORMAL. c'mon, an african american or a gay at a KKK rally? A R E Y O U S E R I O U S ? is that really a proper analogy? no, it isn't.

of course there are issues with marta, there are public safety issues in EVERY major transit system in the U.S. please stop being extreme and at least try to take partial ownership for your poor decisions in this case.

[gttx]

Ha.
Can we take all this nonsense to some other thread? Or you guys can all just have a pissing contest at some train station later.

plorenc - those photos of Oakland are great. It's amazing what snow can do to a place.

[cybele]

Well I wish the MARTA police would do a blotter like the regular police. That would give people a better idea of what's really going down and what's not, they only report major crimes.

[micropundit]

Atlanta Business Chronicle -
by Douglas Sams Staff Writer
Hapeville officials and Jacoby Development are looking into including a global market showplace as part of the redevelopment of the city’s old Ford plant.

The market centers proposed could offer anything from foods to mobile phones and could compete with similar marts centered near airports around the world.

The Hapeville Association of Tourism & Trade recently issued a request for proposals from consultants to study the idea.

The state is also involved in the project.

A Georgia Tourism Product Development grant is funding the nearly $20,000 study.

The grant is focused on projects with the potential to create jobs in the hospitality industry.

Jacoby Development bought the Ford plant — next to Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport — in 2008.

Jacoby Development, led by Atlantic Station co-developer Jim Jacoby, later razed the Ford plant, clearing the way to turn the factory into a 130-acre aerotropolis, a term for any development focused on aviation-oriented businesses.

Other concepts the upcoming study will consider include a world-class consulate headquarters, a museum, an entertainment complex and other tourism concepts.

The global commodity centers would be an important component of the 6.5 million-square-foot project, which still aims to create the first true office market on the city’s south side.

An international market would showcase imports that come through the airport, including flowers, foods and fabrics.

Plans for the global market centers coincide with the airport’s ambitions to increase its import volumes, including volumes of perishable items such as flowers.

The airport has developed the capacity to handle greater volumes in the future.

The redevelopment could also include an “eco mart” that showcases all things environmentally conscious, from fluorescent light bulbs to wind turbines.

“We’re talking about bringing together a marketplace for one-stop shopping,” said Jacoby Development’s Scott Condra. “The eco mart for example would offer just about anything on the green spectrum.”

Jacoby Development was inspired by successful marts around the world, including downtown’s AmericasMart, The World Market Center in Las Vegas, the Dallas Market Center and Cybermart in Shanghai, where stores offer a range of high-tech gadgets, from laptops to mobile phones.

Hapeville City Manager Bill Werner said, “We are looking at the opportunity to create a state-of-the art marketplace, and Hartsfield Jackson can bring those commodities here from throughout the world.”

Hapeville, a city of 6,500 people, takes up just 2.2 square miles, but it’s adjacent to the airport.

The redevelopment of the Ford plant is critical to the life of the city, officials there have said.

City leaders say Hapeville is at a crossroads.

“The city feels blessed to have Jacoby,” Werner said, citing the developer’s success at turning an abandoned steel mill into Atlantic Station.

Jacoby Development has spoken to airport officials about the initial plans.

“The airport is a key,” Condra said. “It’s going to be the connection with customers who can fly in from anywhere just to come to this area and visit the markets.”

Airport spokesman John Kennedy confirmed ongoing discussions about the redevelopment.

So far, some of the focus has been on the site’s potential to offer additional airport parking once the International Terminal is completed, perhaps by 2012.

Jacoby Development made a presentation to state economic development officials about six months ago to explain its plans for the aerotropolis.

That meeting helped prompt the state to get involved in the future of the project, Condra said.

The city of Hapeville expects all the proposals to be submitted by Feb. 26.

It could pick a consultant in March.

[Stratosphere 2020]

Originally Posted by simms3

First, the FL HSR will be a huge redliner and will cost way too much money. Nobody will ride it and it won't be "High Speed" like we think of in Europe or Asia. That being said, we here in GA do not need that kind of waste. BTW Karen Handel, who I am supporting, has expressed numerous times that rail is going to be an essential part of GA's infrastructure, freight and pasenger. She also believes that heavy rail is not the future of urban transit, but I do not know exactly what option she thinks is, haven't had that talk with her. It could very well be streetcars or lightrail.

On MARTA, the biggest issue is safety. I know this from first hadn experience. I live right near the Art Center Station and ride MARTA fairly frequently, but nowadays only when I have to. This past summer (and I hate to bring race in to this, but I have to) I (having had drinking and driving violations) wanted to take MARTA to a bar, where I would meet people. This was around 11. I, thinking Art Center Station in midtown on the N-S line would be safe. Well, at that hour I was the only white person, and amidst a much lower class of people. It was not long before one was taunting me and asking me questions so I moved away. The guy continued and then when I would not give him my phone to borrow, he out of the blue socked me in the face. His posse came over and surrounded me and he proceeded to beat the crap out of me while some in the group chanted beat whitie etc. I escaped after none of the 30 or so other bystanders came to help me and I was bleeding everywhere. I found the two MARTA "cops" just coming out of the upstairs back coffee room joking and looking at me. There was no concern there. They wanted me to walk back down to the platform with them, amazingly (I was a little scared at that point because even with the cops, I was the only white person, and ATL cops have given me reverse racist remarks before), but at the time they were of no help. The guys escaped, none of the bystanders of course knew anything, even though some were talking to that posse creepy group before everything went down. I told the cops I was fine and went back to my place to clean up, but I was in great pain. After I would not stop bleeding I went to the ER the next day, had a CAT scan, received stitches on my eyebrow, and found out I had a broken nose and an orbital fracture (cheekbone). Eventually the main culprit was found, and I told authorities I wanted to prosecute when I was asked. After that, after numerous calls back to find out what I needed to do, nobody called back, nobody answered my calls.

This is a chilly reminder that there are some serious safety issues with MARTA (Im sure we all know someone who has a similar story or who has at least been mugged). This is also proof that there is just a huge problem in Atl in general. I love Atlanta and am a student at GT, and I want to stay and find work here, but when I think of some of the scary situations I have been in here, it makes me want to leave. GT students in particular have had a rough couple of years, whether on MARTA or just around the stations. It is a shame.

Very sad story. Are there no security cameras on the MARTA stations or in the rail cars? They could trace back those who hit you. I live in Rotterdam, Netherlands, every metro car has security cameras, and every entrance of the metro station has security cameras that are directly linked to metro security command center.

[Pessimistic Observer]

Originally Posted by micropundit

Atlanta Business Chronicle -
by Douglas Sams Staff Writer
Hapeville officials and Jacoby Development are looking into including a global market showplace as part of the redevelopment of the city’s old Ford plant.

The market centers proposed could offer anything from foods to mobile phones and could compete with similar marts centered near airports around the world.

The Hapeville Association of Tourism & Trade recently issued a request for proposals from consultants to study the idea.

The state is also involved in the project.

A Georgia Tourism Product Development grant is funding the nearly $20,000 study.

The grant is focused on projects with the potential to create jobs in the hospitality industry.

Jacoby Development bought the Ford plant — next to Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport — in 2008.

Jacoby Development, led by Atlantic Station co-developer Jim Jacoby, later razed the Ford plant, clearing the way to turn the factory into a 130-acre aerotropolis, a term for any development focused on aviation-oriented businesses.

Other concepts the upcoming study will consider include a world-class consulate headquarters, a museum, an entertainment complex and other tourism concepts.

The global commodity centers would be an important component of the 6.5 million-square-foot project, which still aims to create the first true office market on the city’s south side.

An international market would showcase imports that come through the airport, including flowers, foods and fabrics.

Plans for the global market centers coincide with the airport’s ambitions to increase its import volumes, including volumes of perishable items such as flowers.

The airport has developed the capacity to handle greater volumes in the future.

The redevelopment could also include an “eco mart” that showcases all things environmentally conscious, from fluorescent light bulbs to wind turbines.

“We’re talking about bringing together a marketplace for one-stop shopping,” said Jacoby Development’s Scott Condra. “The eco mart for example would offer just about anything on the green spectrum.”

Jacoby Development was inspired by successful marts around the world, including downtown’s AmericasMart, The World Market Center in Las Vegas, the Dallas Market Center and Cybermart in Shanghai, where stores offer a range of high-tech gadgets, from laptops to mobile phones.

Hapeville City Manager Bill Werner said, “We are looking at the opportunity to create a state-of-the art marketplace, and Hartsfield Jackson can bring those commodities here from throughout the world.”

Hapeville, a city of 6,500 people, takes up just 2.2 square miles, but it’s adjacent to the airport.

The redevelopment of the Ford plant is critical to the life of the city, officials there have said.

City leaders say Hapeville is at a crossroads.

“The city feels blessed to have Jacoby,” Werner said, citing the developer’s success at turning an abandoned steel mill into Atlantic Station.

Jacoby Development has spoken to airport officials about the initial plans.

“The airport is a key,” Condra said. “It’s going to be the connection with customers who can fly in from anywhere just to come to this area and visit the markets.”

Airport spokesman John Kennedy confirmed ongoing discussions about the redevelopment.

So far, some of the focus has been on the site’s potential to offer additional airport parking once the International Terminal is completed, perhaps by 2012.

Jacoby Development made a presentation to state economic development officials about six months ago to explain its plans for the aerotropolis.

That meeting helped prompt the state to get involved in the future of the project, Condra said.
The city of Hapeville expects all the proposals to be submitted by Feb. 26.

It could pick a consultant in March.

Why does the states involvement worry me

[plorenc]

CITY OF ATLANTA CROSSING ITS FINGERS FOR STREETCAR FUNDS

By Maria Saporta

The city of Atlanta and MARTA should find out by Wednesday whether it will receive federal transportation funds for its streetcar proposal.

A public-private partnership between the city, MARTA, Central Atlanta Progress and the Midtown Alliance applied for nearly $300 million to build a streetcar line from Five Points to Midtown, and a line from Centennial Olympic Park and the Georgia Aquarium to the King Center.

Atlanta is facing stiff competition because it is one of dozens, if not hundreds, of cities in the running for $1.5 billion to be awarded nationally. As a way to improve its odds, the city’s application had scaled down proposals, including one for about $100 million.

Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed has been working hard to improve the city’s chances to win the streetcar funds. He has been up to Washington, D.C. several times to meet with top elected leaders and transportation officials.

“I think the streetcar’s prospects are looking much better,” Reed said in a recent interview.

Reed said the city’s streetcar application was “elevated” because Yvette Taylor, the Region IV administrator of the Federal Transit Administration has recommended that the project be approved.

“Prior to us going to Washington, our project had not been recommended by the regional leaders, which is essential to government funding,” Reed said.

A.J. Robinson, president of Central Atlanta Progress, said this particular program calls for the federal government to pay for 100 percent of the cost of the project, which would be a major win for the city.

And Atlanta could use a win. Georgia has come up short in recent rounds of federal transportation funding for high speed rail projects. Florida and North Carolina both scored big in those funding rounds.

Ray LaHood, secretary of the U.S. Department of Transportation, has said that cities will be notified by Feb. 17 on whether they’ve won the grants.

If Atlanta loses out on the streetcar funding, Robinson said that the good news is that now the project is ready to go forward if other transportation funds become available.

We'll know by the 17th.

[cybele]

Originally Posted by plorenc

We'll know by the 17th.

Well that's tomorrow! I sure hope it comes through, the old A-town could use some good news.

[briantech]

Apparently its now illegal for strip clubs in fulton county to sell alcohol.

http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/fulton-wins-ruling-in-308043.html

[Pessimistic Observer]

Originally Posted by briantech

Apparently its now illegal for strip clubs in fulton county to sell alcohol.

http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/fulton-wins-ruling-in-308043.html

its not illegal yet the judges sent it back to a federal judge

this just means the strip clubs have to come up with an argument better than freedom of speech to go against fulton counties overwelming evidence

[ATLaffinity]

relax. it won't affect The Cheetah or other Atlanta clubs. It's Fulton County courts.

[ATLaffinity]

Atlanta loses streetcar grant

Georgia gets zero money.

Really, do you expect this administration to support this redneck state???

List of grants:

http://www.dot.gov/documents/finaltigergrantinfo.pdf

[UVAsuperman]

Atlanta loses streetcar grant

Frankly, I see this as a blessing in disguise. The Streetcar idea just doesn't make sense from the perspective of traffic on Peachtree. The road is bad enough when it drops to 2 lanes through midtown and downtown with frequent Marta bus stops and a host of people who feel like the right lane is an ok place to park a FedEx/UPS truck, UHaul trailer, taxi, or car waiting on someone.

Workable solutions to mass transit in Atlanta need to focus on moving suburban residents from the suburbs to the inner city working areas (downtown, midtown, buckhead, perimeter, emory, decatur), where MARTA already provides a decent rail infrastructure (though it needs expansion). That's why the Lovejoy line, the Brain Train, and high speed rail are much more important and where the city and state leadership should be focused.

I just don't see more street surface transportation as a solution to anything. So, I don't mind failing on the streetcar. Of course, city and state leadership are currently failing on the rest as well.

[Pessimistic Observer]

Originally Posted by UVAsuperman

Frankly, I see this as a blessing in disguise. The Streetcar idea just doesn't make sense from the perspective of traffic on Peachtree. The road is bad enough when it drops to 2 lanes through midtown and downtown with frequent Marta bus stops and a host of people who feel like the right lane is an ok place to park a FedEx/UPS truck, UHaul trailer, taxi, or car waiting on someone.

Workable solutions to mass transit in Atlanta need to focus on moving suburban residents from the suburbs to the inner city working areas (downtown, midtown, buckhead, perimeter, emory, decatur), where MARTA already provides a decent rail infrastructure (though it needs expansion). That's why the Lovejoy line, the Brain Train, and high speed rail are much more important and where the city and state leadership should be focused.

I just don't see more street surface transportation as a solution to anything. So, I don't mind failing on the streetcar. Of course, city and state leadership are currently failing on the rest as well.

and what are the chances commuter rail will get funding were there any applications in regards to federal funding for those. I doubt theres much chance the state will fund commuter rail cause that would meen spending money on something that doesnt exist yet and isnt a road

the only good news about this is some of the road projects that other counties in georgia put in for didnt get funding either

[ATLiteRail]

I have really enjoyed reading this forum and seeing Atlanta grow in the last few years I have lived here. Some great photos (the Oakland Cemetery ones in the snow were beautiful) and some smart and lively comments on projects both built and proposed.
I fear the lack of these projects has spun the forum into a bad tangent that does nothing to help the city. I also fear the failure to secure Federal Funds for the Peachtree Road Streetcar line was a killing blow for any furthur transit projects for Atlanta. I have been active with a company seeking to build new street cars lines in the inner cities of some of the great cities of America.
Our faliure to help Atlanta weighs heavily on me and it is with sorrow and regret that I must now depart Atlanta for Charlotte, NC , a city that has shown it is serious about transit needs and growth.
I know all issues are local but I must make a comment about the direction the State of Georgia has taken in the few years I have been here. I believe the Governor and most of the State Legislature is so negative about Atlanta and the future of Atlanta that it will having lasting and grave effects on the city of Atlanta for years to come. And frankly , the candidates for Purdue's replacement are just as backward as he is. So I wish Atlanta all the luck in the world as I think you will really need it badly.

[STrek777]

Originally Posted by ATLaffinity

Atlanta loses streetcar grant

Georgia gets zero money.

Really, do you expect this administration to support this redneck state???

List of grants:

http://www.dot.gov/documents/finaltigergrantinfo.pdf

What an uneducated comment. Did you even read that PDF you attached? Each of the projects approved were in some way connected to an already existing project. NOTHING exist for the streetcar... absolutly nothing. Washington gave us 80 million for a rail project and not one red cent of that money has been touched in a decade. So why should washington believe us when we say "we'll build a street car... honest"! It has nothing to do with this administration. If it did then how did so many red states get tens of millions and Texas got almost 2 billion! Seriously educate yourself before you start spewing nonscense. Thanks

[scpatl4now]

Originally Posted by STrek777

What an uneducated comment. Did you even read that PDF you attached? Each of the projects approved were in some way connected to an already existing project. NOTHING exist for the streetcar... absolutly nothing. Washington gave us 80 million for a rail project and not one red cent of that money has been touched in a decade. So why should washington believe us when we say "we'll build a street car... honest"! It has nothing to do with this administration. If it did then how did so many red states get tens of millions and Texas got almost 2 billion! Seriously educate yourself before you start spewing nonscense. Thanks

What the PDF also showed was that most if not all of these projects had some sort of matching funding provided which proved they were serious. We have no such matching funds. In fact as noted above we cant even come up with 15 million over 8 years to make the Lovejoy rail project happen ( a less than 20% match). I think its a condemnation of Sonny and the GA legislators for failing to have vision, hell, failing to do ANYTHING (except of course if you own the local fishin' hole).
What is really sad is that we are at a critical crossroads in the future of this city. The economic policies of the GA republicans (they are in power) will stunt growth, cause job loss, and reduce quality of life. I read where Chip Pearson (R-Dawsonville) says that they need to be "Wise Stewards" of the publics money...like they have done such a bang up job so far. They dont want to LET the public decide what to do with that tax money or this wouldn't be an issue. Hell its taken 3 yrs just to let MARTA use their money as they see fit

[ATLBlaxican]

I agree with both sides and think it is a little of both. Either way it comes down to Atlanta doesn’t have its shit together and thus wasn’t taken seriously and subsequently left out. Sad, I know . What is really kind of sad is to think that Atlanta is starting to get left behind literally. My friend just got back from the All Star Game in Dallas and fell in love with the city. She kept saying that she was shocked to see the difference in the culture that the city shared that we seem to lack. Some of the things she loved were how they had the “Texas Star” everywhere in the concrete medians and walls that lined the highway. I too remember in Houston how they had the interstate # painted on the street and the pedestrian bridges we cool looking or in the Valley-area they had cool insets in the construction of the highways. I wondered why Atlanta and Georgia couldn’t put a little more effort into the aesthetics and visual appeal in some of our road projects. Look at the bridge they built in Boston, that could have been 17th street or how the Brooklyn Bridge is a signature piece in NYC. Just think what a statement that would be for Atlanta in postcards and video footage of the city. Instead we got a big ugly yellow yet “functional” building. Perception becomes reality and I think Atlanta could really step up its game and start trying to make a visual statement that says “We are Atlanta!” You don’t see CEO’s wearing Wal-Mart clothes, taking clients to Subway for lunch and picking up clients from the airport in a minivan (I’m speaking figuratively, so for those who do just skip to my point lol). My point is if Atlanta wants to be taken seriously and play with the big boys then they need to start walking the walk and start putting more effort in creating an identity for the city. The rest will come into place after that. Atlanta will see more jobs, more funding, more attractions, gasp; maybe even an identity. You have to start somewhere and if you don’t believe in yourself (in this case know who you are) how can you expect anyone else to. Come on Atlanta, I love my city…we need to STEP OUR GAME UP!!!

[ATLBlaxican]

Another debate/food for thought is how much of the disbursement of funds is based on politics and how much is on regional culture?In other words do you think politicians simply look at the facts in terms of what a region needs to grow or do they factor in a regions history, whether it be the citizens favor the current administration, live a more simple life, are car-centric, etc. Or could it be a combination of both??

I’m asking because it seems like some people think it is because Georgia is stuck in its "past" and others say it just comes down to strictly "facts."


The topic reminds me of a personal story. My dad is from this little small sleepy town in North Florida and they are frozen in time. My family tells me that for years developers wanted to move into the city and build out resorts on the lake and build other developments that would bring the city up to date, but the citizens shot it down. They liked their way of life and weren’t willing to change, thus the money left and now they are the same old town as I remembered when I was a child. Atlanta (more so Georgia) seems to have the same thing going on. People are still not ready to give up their old beliefs and way for living in exchange for a more updated lifestyle. Look what happened in Gwinnett when MARTA got shot down again or this notion that functionality out ways aesthetics. If I’m not mistaken isn’t America the birthplace of “image is everything?” Now I’m not saying no one wants to change, but the majority is happy with the way Georgia is (going by how Georgia overall votes). So from a political stand point, I agree with other forumers when they say that Washington (politics/money) sees this and say why even bother. It is quite an oxymoron for Atlanta to be so progressive compared to the rest of the south, but is still rooted in the old south mentality. Maybe Atlanta should just become its own state and then we can get what we want hahaha…just j/k!

[TarHeelJ]

Originally Posted by ATLBlaxican

I agree with both sides and think it is a little of both. Either way it comes down to Atlanta doesn’t have its shit together and thus wasn’t taken seriously and subsequently left out. Sad, I know . What is really kind of sad is to think that Atlanta is starting to get left behind literally. My friend just got back from the All Star Game in Dallas and fell in love with the city. She kept saying that she was shocked to see the difference in the culture that the city shared that we seem to lack. Some of the things she loved were how they had the “Texas Star” everywhere in the concrete medians and walls that lined the highway. I too remember in Houston how they had the interstate # painted on the street and the pedestrian bridges we cool looking or in the Valley-area they had cool insets in the construction of the highways. I wondered why Atlanta and Georgia couldn’t put a little more effort into the aesthetics and visual appeal in some of our road projects. Look at the bridge they built in Boston, that could have been 17th street or how the Brooklyn Bridge is a signature piece in NYC. Just think what a statement that would be for Atlanta in postcards and video footage of the city. Instead we got a big ugly yellow yet “functional” building. Perception becomes reality and I think Atlanta could really step up its game and start trying to make a visual statement that says “We are Atlanta!” You don’t see CEO’s wearing Wal-Mart clothes, taking clients to Subway for lunch and picking up clients from the airport in a minivan (I’m speaking figuratively, so for those who do just skip to my point lol). My point is if Atlanta wants to be taken seriously and play with the big boys then they need to start walking the walk and start putting more effort in creating an identity for the city. The rest will come into place after that. Atlanta will see more jobs, more funding, more attractions, gasp; maybe even an identity. You have to start somewhere and if you don’t believe in yourself (in this case know who you are) how can you expect anyone else to. Come on Atlanta, I love my city…we need to STEP OUR GAME UP!!!

If you can't see Atlanta's unique identity throughout the city then you aren't looking very closely. There are signs of it everywhere. Of course it isn't going to be the same as the star in Texas - then it wouldn't be unique.

The last two rounds of stimulus funds have been tragic for Atlanta, but it's not the end of the world. Atlanta has risen from the ashes a few times in the past...I think it can easily happen again.