Canadian University Thread

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Ivy League is a specific finite group of hsitoric US universities.

It does not just apply fast and loose to any old prestigious university. Especially not in another country.

Ivy League mostly refers to older prestigious university in the US northeast, and usually just references their undergraduate programs. In the US, the old boys club runs strong and runs deep, so it means a lot to corporate recruiters if you went to Harvard or Yale. It is a shorthand for "you are the right sort of person for the job" (old money, from the right families, well connected).

A small group of primarily undergraduate eastern Canadian universities have tried to get on this bandwagon by creating the "Maple League of Canadian Universities." This includes Acadia, Saint Francis Xavier, Mount Allison, Bishop's and I believe Trent). The Maple League has not caught on in the same ways as the Ivy League has.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Ivy League mostly refers to older prestigious university in the US northeast, and usually just references their undergraduate programs. In the US, the old boys club runs strong and runs deep, so it means a lot to corporate recruiters if you went to Harvard or Yale. It is a shorthand for "you are the right sort of person for the job" (old money, from the right families, well connected).

A small group of primarily undergraduate eastern Canadian universities have tried to get on this bandwagon by creating the "Maple League of Canadian Universities." This includes Acadia, Saint Francis Xavier, Mount Allison, Bishop's and I believe Trent). The Maple League has not caught on in the same ways as the Ivy League has.

All liberal arts schools, no?

[wave46]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Ivy League mostly refers to older prestigious university in the US northeast, and usually just references their undergraduate programs. In the US, the old boys club runs strong and runs deep, so it means a lot to corporate recruiters if you went to Harvard or Yale. It is a shorthand for "you are the right sort of person for the job" (old money, from the right families, well connected).

A small group of primarily undergraduate eastern Canadian universities have tried to get on this bandwagon by creating the "Maple League of Canadian Universities." This includes Acadia, Saint Francis Xavier, Mount Allison, Bishop's and I believe Trent). The Maple League has not caught on in the same ways as the Ivy League has.

The elitism that defined the Ivy League Universities and Cambridge/Oxford never really got traction here.

Not sure if our culture wasn't right for it or that having another level of it to our south and across the pond made it redundant.

"I went to Queens/McGill" is not anywhere near as prestigious as "I went to Harvard/Oxford" in Canada.

[The Macallan]

The word league in “Ivy League” is literal and specific. It is a sports conference, of football in the first place, of prestigious older universities in the American north east. Like most other things, this could also be used metaphorically, even, I suppose, of schools in another country such as Canada.

The nearest equivalent in Canada was the league of Queens, Western, McGill and Toronto. A reorganization in the sixties put an end to that conference and damaged its historic rivalries. For students at “Varsity “ slightly older than I am, the trip to Montreal for the McGill game was the stuff of legends.

If we are talking about university rivalries, however, there is nothing quite like Oxford vs Cambridge. The “trash talking” extends all the way back into the Middle Ages and surfaces even in Chaucer’s Canterbury Tales!

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

All liberal arts schools, no?

Indeed, and all primarily undergraduate.

Again, the prestige of entrance to Ivy League schools refers to their undergraduate programs, not necessarily their graduate programs.

[The Macallan]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Indeed, and all primarily undergraduate.

Again, the prestige of entrance to Ivy League schools refers to their undergraduate programs, not necessarily their graduate programs.

The graduate programs of the Ivy League schools are pretty darn prestigious too! One example: on th US Supreme Court only the recently appointed Amy Coney Barrett is not a graduate of Harvard or Yale Law Schools. Maybe in some field, in some Ivy League university, there is a programme which is not held in high esteem. But I can’t think of any, and I do have experience in doctoral level admissions.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Ivy League is a U.S. thing as others have pointed out, but I still get your point. Ottawa's Universities are generally not well viewed. Very middle of the road. Carleton's reputation has improved significantly over the years. The journalism program has always been well regarded. The architecture program is good as far as I know. uOttawa has always had potential as the central university, but never quite reached it, even with backing from big names like Alex Trebek.

In no particular order, we think of UofT, Queens, McGill, Dalhousie, McMaster, Laurier, UBC, Western and a few others as Canada's premier institutions. Ottawa's universities have never been up in those ranks, which is surprising, and disappointing, for the upper-middle class Capital of Canada.

And on the Quebec side, UQO, has been severely neglected by the Province making it a very minor institutions with only a few very basic programs.

I have never seen a list of elite Canadian Universities that included Laurier. Dal is a great school but doesn't rank in the top ten.

On the other hand, Waterloo and Uof/deOttawa have been steadily rising up the rankings. For sure, UofA is in the elite university squad, and I would also add UdeM. UofSk is usually just out of the top10 list.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

I have never seen a list of elite Canadian Universities that included Laurier. Dal is a great school but doesn't rank in the top ten.

On the other hand, Waterloo and Uof/deOttawa have been steadily rising up the rankings. For sure, UofA is in the elite university squad, and I would also add UdeM. UofSk is usually just out of the top10 list.

I'll admit my list might have been a little off.

[Harrison]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

I have never seen a list of elite Canadian Universities that included Laurier. Dal is a great school but doesn't rank in the top ten.

On the other hand, Waterloo and Uof/deOttawa have been steadily rising up the rankings. For sure, UofA is in the elite university squad, and I would also add UdeM. UofSk is usually just out of the top10 list.

Agreed, I'd include UWaterloo before Laurier (aka the 'high school down the street' by us UW alumni).

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by The Macallan

The graduate programs of the Ivy League schools are pretty darn prestigious too! One example: on th US Supreme Court only the recently appointed Amy Coney Barrett is not a graduate of Harvard or Yale Law Schools. Maybe in some field, in some Ivy League university, there is a programme which is not held in high esteem. But I can’t think of any, and I do have experience in doctoral level admissions.

Just a quibble. Law schools aren't technically graduate programs (although most do offer graduate programs in law).

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by wave46

The elitism that defined the Ivy League Universities and Cambridge/Oxford never really got traction here.

McGill/Toronto grads give it their best shot.

The Ivy League gloating has nothing on STFX grads that wear those stupid rings.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

I have never seen a list of elite Canadian Universities that included Laurier. Dal is a great school but doesn't rank in the top ten.

On the other hand, Waterloo and Uof/deOttawa have been steadily rising up the rankings. For sure, UofA is in the elite university squad, and I would also add UdeM. UofSk is usually just out of the top10 list.

Laurier is a decent school, but in no way “elite”. Waterloo is definitely “elite”, but in a niche way (a BA from Waterloo has no special cachet).

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by The Macallan

The word league in “Ivy League” is literal and specific.

Yes, it's very specific. There are 8 of them: Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Penn, Princeton, and Yale.

I do remember a Canadian version they dubbed (quite nauseatingly) the 'Canadian Ivies': Waterloo, Alberta, McGill, Montreal, Toronto, British Columbia, McMaster, Calgary, Western, Queens, Dalhousie, Ottawa, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Sherbrooke. If they're really serious about branding and choosing the elite schools they'd be wise not to include so many.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Yes, it's very specific. There are 8 of them: Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Penn, Princeton, and Yale.

I do remember a Canadian version they dubbed (quite nauseatingly) the 'Canadian Ivies': Waterloo, Alberta, McGill, Montreal, Toronto, British Columbia, McMaster, Calgary, Western, Queens, Dalhousie, Ottawa, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Sherbrooke. If they're really serious about branding and choosing the elite schools they'd be wise not to include so many.

If there were such a grouping, I don’t see how Calgary, Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Ottawa, or Sherbrooke would be part of it. Waterloo would be a special case, relating to its specific areas of strength.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

If there were such a grouping, I don’t see how Calgary, Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Ottawa, or Sherbrooke would be part of it. Waterloo would be a special case, relating to its specific areas of strength.

Definitely replace Sherbrooke with Laval if we are going there.

[NetMapel]

Originally Posted by CivicBlues

LOL, maybe he was referring to Richard Ivey school of Business, but then that's in UWO.

You, friend, have tipped off your age group by referring to Western University as UWO That's what the young and hip people know the school as! You have no idea how much I despite that name change

[svlt]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

I have never seen a list of elite Canadian Universities that included Laurier. Dal is a great school but doesn't rank in the top ten.

On the other hand, Waterloo and Uof/deOttawa have been steadily rising up the rankings. For sure, UofA is in the elite university squad, and I would also add UdeM. UofSk is usually just out of the top10 list.

I feel like the Top 5 have been pretty stably U of T, McGill, UBC, ((gap)), U of Montreal and U of A for some time now, I can't recall. I've been checking for interest for a decade of releases and those always seem to be roughly the positions. The next five which also seems like it hasn't changed much are McMaster, Waterloo, Western, Queen's & UCalgary. I suppose U of O could be interchanged with one these given its location.

Any of these names I think should be fairly well respected domestically, but the latter half of this list would likely be an afterthought anywhere outside of this country.

I think only the top three of U of T, McGill & UBC can be in any way considered a globally prestigious University and I'd cap it there if someone wanted to make a (poor taste) list of "Canadian Ivy's", given our much smaller base of population; heck 3 might be too many if the US has 8 but it's the minimum for a list.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by svlt

I feel like the Top 5 have been pretty stably U of T, McGill, UBC, ((gap)), U of Montreal and U of A for some time now, I can't recall. I've been checking for interest for a decade of releases and those always seem to be roughly the positions. The next five which also seems like it hasn't changed much are McMaster, Waterloo, Western, Queen's & UCalgary. I suppose U of O could be interchanged with one these given its location.

Any of these names I think should be fairly well respected domestically, but the latter half of this list would likely be an afterthought anywhere outside of this country.

I think only the top three of U of T, McGill & UBC can be in any way considered a globally prestigious University and I'd cap it there if someone wanted to make a (poor taste) list of "Canadian Ivy's", given our much smaller base of population; heck 3 might be too many if the US has 8 but it's the minimum for a list.

In general, the only 3 universities to rank in the Top 100 worldwide are:
1. University of Toronto
2. University of British Columbia
3. McGill University

The next tier is:

- University of Alberta
- McMaster
- Western
- Queen's
- University of Calgary

Like I said before, being a grad from the top 3 isn't necessarily a free ticket to the upper class compared to some lower ones in this country. Especially in comparison to the ticket handed to people who graduate from the elite of the US and UK.

Our largest and most prestigious institutions are surprisingly accessible to the masses.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by wave46

Like I said before, being a grad from the top 3 isn't necessarily a free ticket to the upper class compared to some lower ones in this country.

Mostly because the undergrad experience at the top 3 in Canada is not that distinct from other decent universities. Enrollments are large and spending per student is nowhere near what it is at the top US schools. There is nothing wrong with UBC and it is one of the larger schools with a large research output but the median undergrad there is not getting anything incredible compared to the supposed next tier down of schools. It doesn't seem like any of these schools have a monopoly on the top students either. Among the major Canadian universities the degree and grades are likely to be a much better predictor than the institution.

[SaskScraper]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Yes, it's very specific. There are 8 of them: Brown, Columbia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Harvard, Penn, Princeton, and Yale.

I do remember a Canadian version they dubbed (quite nauseatingly) the 'Canadian Ivies': Waterloo, Alberta, McGill, Montreal, Toronto, British Columbia, McMaster, Calgary, Western, Queens, Dalhousie, Ottawa, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and Sherbrooke. If they're really serious about branding and choosing the elite schools they'd be wise not to include so many.

Sherbrooke is a bit random for 'Canadian Ivies'