AUSTIN | The Independent | 690 FEET | 58 FLOORS | Complete

[austlar1]

Abbott is just going to be an ornery critter with a lot of ideas that may or may not gain traction in the legislature. It is not clear that the state can currently pass laws that would forbid municipalities from enacting regulations pertaining to plastic bags, etc. I think the impacted cities would have redress in the courts, but I could be wrong, as I have no idea what the state constitution has to say about that. At any rate, his pet peeves don't necessarily translate into policy unless there is enabling legislation to create that policy. I am impressed that he sounds gung-ho (at least at this juncture) to investigate one of the probably crooked crony deals implemented by the Perry administration. I am speaking about the alleged fraud in the 21 CT contract with the state Department of Health and Human Services. One rather hopes that any irregularities might lead back directly to Rick Perry and his sleazy no-bid crony (donor) handouts. Abbott may have a little "pay back" in his heart with regards to Perry and Co. More will be revealed.

[ToTheSky]

Hello fellow skycraper lovers! First time poster, loooooong time lurker on this forum. Thought this would be an excellent opportunity for my first comment on this forum to call BS on mklunder13's absurd post here. You guys have already nailed it with your responses about why this is a ridiculous concept, and I'm in full agreement.
I will say that after having been back and forth from San Antonio since the mid 90's and observed the growth there and here, I'd wager that if there is one thing about Austin versus San Antonio that might discourage more businesses or people from moving here it would be our roads and traffic. San Antonio's freeway system most definitely tops ours, due to reasons that are too lengthy to entertain in this thread, however Austin is attempting, slowly, to address that issue. That said, so far our traffic issues haven't stopped people from moving here in any sort of measurable or noticeable numbers that I'm aware of currently.
I would also bet that that one reason mklunder13 doesn't want to see The Independent built is because he/she probably has very high hopes that the proposed Frost tower in SA gives that city a new tallest, and possibly tops Austin's current tallest, depending on how that project develops. If The Independent does come to fruition as we all hope it does, we'll have a new tallest that will hold up against potential new SA competition.
The growth of our entire region is fantastic however, and I'm all for new tallest buildings and hi-rises wherever they can put them up in a sensible fashion.

Originally Posted by mklunder13

I think this project is ridiculous. This city is digging its own grave developing this quick. It's out of control, property taxes are skyrocketing, as is cost of living, and businesses are starting to consider elsewhere due to this city becoming so expensive because of the uncontrolled development. San Antonio is doing it right, controlling the development and businesses see that as being attractive and also much cheaper. San Antonio is the up and coming city. Austin is just the childish little sibling who doesn't know how to control itself.

[Jdawgboy]

I really hope we hear more about this project soon. I don't like it when some news comes out about a proposal and then it's months before we hear anything more. I guess it's really down to the individual developers and such. There are those like Manchester that get a roller-coaster of articles between months of silence over a 2 or 3 year period. Then there are the projects like 5th & West that seem to pop up out of nowhere with little to no extended wait time before construction begins.

99 Trinity and Waller Park Place are also good examples of a long drawn out hear some news then hear nothing. The only thing that may be a legitimate reason why neither has moved is that they are waiting for the waller tunnel to be finished which according to the most recent news should be in June.

[austlar1]

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy

I really hope we hear more about this project soon. I don't like it when some news comes out about a proposal and then it's months before we hear anything more. I guess it's really down to the individual developers and such. There are those like Manchester that get a roller-coaster of articles between months of silence over a 2 or 3 year period. Then there are the projects like 5th & West that seem to pop up out of nowhere with little to no extended wait time before construction begins.

99 Trinity and Waller Park Place are also good examples of a long drawn out hear some news then hear nothing. The only thing that may be a legitimate reason why neither has moved is that they are waiting for the waller tunnel to be finished which according to the most recent news should be in June.

Not to be a party pooper, but I suspect that the Waller Center project is in "wait and see" mode. McCourt and his deep pocketed partners are very involved in some super expensive NYC developments. He and his Guggenheim Partners associates are also eager to build something spectacular on the Chavez Ravine property surrounding Dodger Stadium in LA. According to more than one article I read recently, McCourt has several junior ("freshly minted MBAs") new hires putting together deals outside of NYC and LA. I am not sure that the Waller Center project is his highest priority right now. That would help explain why things seem to have stopped moving there. They have not even completed the demolition of several buildings at the site of the proposed project.

I don't know what to think about the 99 Trinity proposal. I have always wondered whether they have the financial muscle to pull this off, and it could be that they are arriving at the party kind of late in the current development cycle, maybe too late to put together the financing needed to proceed.

[Jdawgboy]

Originally Posted by austlar1

Not to be a party pooper, but I suspect that the Waller Center project is in "wait and see" mode. McCourt and his deep pocketed partners are very involved in some super expensive NYC developments. He and his Guggenheim Partners associates are also eager to build something spectacular on the Chavez Ravine property surrounding Dodger Stadium in LA. According to more than one article I read recently, McCourt has several junior ("freshly minted MBAs") new hires putting together deals outside of NYC and LA. I am not sure that the Waller Center project is his highest priority right now. That would help explain why things seem to have stopped moving there. They have not even completed the demolition of several buildings at the site of the proposed project.

Well I have one thing to say to Mr McCourt and his partners. Don't string Austin along like it's second fiddle. That's great they have projects in NYC and LA that they want to get going and all but Austin is no podunk backwoods waterhole that they can just decide to put their project here on the back burner. Austin is red hot and if these guys can't get moving on this project then they should sell it to developers that will spend the time and effort in a market such as ours.

[GoldenBoot]

I'm sorry...I thought this thread was pertaining to The Independent. My mistake!??!

[Jdawgboy]

Originally Posted by GoldenBoot

I'm sorry...I thought this thread was pertaining to The Independent. My mistake!??!

Yea it is but with no more news about this project I simply stated my concern about projects that take a long time from when they are announced before we hear anything else about it. In that regard it is relevant to the Independent. We could go ahead and lock this thread or let it fall off the first page until we hear something more if that is what you prefer.

[KevinFromTexas]

As long as it doesn't go too overboard with off topic chit chat. By the way, I saw Greg hovering over the model of this building with a big grin on his face.

Hopefully once this baby gets going we'll have a good source for info. I can't wait to see what the final height is.

[paul78701]

This could be a rough idea of what The Independent might look like:
http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...y-block-9.html

[wwmiv]

That would be absolutely f*ing awesome.

[pscajunguy]

Originally Posted by paul78701

This could be a rough idea of what The Independent might look like:
http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...y-block-9.html

heh, heh. I enjoy the comments, though. Especially the ones complaining about it being another 400 footer that is going to make SF look like a Vancouver-type building plateau. They seem to share a lot of the same concerns in SF that we share here in Austin.
But then again, it can't be all bad that we are competing with San Francisco instead of, say, Oklahoma City! And add another 200-300 feet on top of it, and it might not just be that bad!

[Jdawgboy]

So I'm assuming this is all office space but here is SF tallest with the same exact floor count as the Independent. 1,000+ footer....

http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...rce_tower.html


Even if the Independent is all residential, I still don't see how a 61 floor tower would be shorter than the Austonian. It just doesn't add up and I hope I'm wrong but watch the final design end up being fewer floors if the height is indeed 675 or whatever.

I am aware the Austonian is actually 60 floors including mechanical levels. So then is the Independent going to be 61 habitable floors or is the 61 count including mechanical as well? The Austonian was announced as a 56 story tower so I would think the floor count would be habitable only.

[KevinFromTexas]

scraperwill said it'll have 61 occupied floors, plus an amenity level, which I take as meaning it'll be the gym facility. He also said it'll have one more level - and that is the mechanical one.

Originally Posted by scraperwill

Lobby/Retail 1 14'
A/G Parking 7 9'
Office 4 15'
Amenity 1 10.75'
Residential 48 10.75'
Mech Penthouse 1 10.75'

I'm also skeptical on the floor count compared to the height, but then again the model still seems to show it at around 200 feet taller than the roof of 360 - so around 675 feet. Also, office buildings always have higher floor to height ratios. New York's Citicorp Center is 915 feet tall and it only has 59 floors. Of course, this building is supposed to have at least some office, so I would expect it to be taller than it's being stated.

[pscajunguy]

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy

So I'm assuming this is all office space but here is SF tallest with the same exact floor count as the Independent. 1,000+ footer....

http://www.socketsite.com/archives/2...rce_tower.html


Even if the Independent is all residential, I still don't see how a 61 floor tower would be shorter than the Austonian. It just doesn't add up and I hope I'm wrong but watch the final design end up being fewer floors if the height is indeed 675 or whatever.

I am aware the Austonian is actually 60 floors including mechanical levels. So then is the Independent going to be 61 habitable floors or is the 61 count including mechanical as well? The Austonian was announced as a 56 story tower so I would think the floor count would be habitable only.

Actually, if you took away the flag masts from the top of 345 California, and the spire away from the top of the Transamerica Pyramid, San Francisco would only have one building taller than the top of the Austonian's top mechanical floor, 555 California (the old Bank of America Tower). And it is only 52 floors and 779 feet. It will be at least 2 1/2 years before the Sales Force Tower in San Francisco surpasses the height of the Austonian, but they have several other buildings planned in the same vicinity that will be just short of a thousand feet. Until quite recently, San Francisco seemed to be comprised of huge numbers of "Kathy Tovos", who wielded considerable power, until people opened up their eyes and saw little future in a San Francisco that fought development, tooth and nail! Thankfully, for them, that time is over. But of course the Salesforce Tower will have 13 foot office floors (not including the floor plates) and two floors of very impressive Lobbies with very high ceilings. And their decorative crown will also add about 150-200 feet to the building. It will also be nice to be one block over from the northern terminus of the High Speed Rail to LA at the Transbay Terminal and Park, someday. Jerry Brown just broke ground for the San Francisco Terminal for the High Speed Train at the $1.9 Billion Transbay Transit Center on January the 6th. 6,000 workers will be employed on this project until the opening of the Transbay Transit Center in 2017, so you can just imagine what might be in the offing sometime in the future for this part of Austin when the right people finally come together with plans to build something quite amazing to San Antonio and Dallas/Ft. Worth.
Are you listening, Ms. Tovo?

[KevinFromTexas]

Speaking of new San Francisco skyscrapers - have you guys seen this one? It's going to be America's Bank of China.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=137164

[pscajunguy]

Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas

Speaking of new San Francisco skyscrapers - have you guys seen this one? It's going to be America's Bank of China.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=137164

I actually kind of enjoy reading the posts, though. A lot of those people sound just like the people in here, and it makes me realize how outdated all my info is about what's going on there, like how a couple of near 1000 footers are all of a sudden turning into a plethora of 1300 footers, how the new 650 foot residential towers are soon going to get blocked out of view by even bigger buildings, and how all of a sudden the $1.9 Billion Transbay Transit Center is the $3.4 Billion Transbay Transit Center. And you know what? I'll bet SF's America's Bank of China is going to be a lot more appealing than LA's America's Bank of Mexico which will probably look much like the very unexciting Pemex Executive Center in Mexico City, which is about what ALL the buildings in downtown LA already look like, except for the US Bank Tower! I wonder how much it would cost to jack up the Frost Tower about 500 feet and complete the bottom half of the building that they forget to build. Now THAT would be nice!
It just goes to show that someday fairly soon, we all might be laughing about the time we were wondering about when we would ever get out of that 400 foot time warp!
Because you know that the time is coming soon where there will only be one way to go, and that is UP, hopefully starting soon with the Independent and Waller Place! I'm kind of getting excited that the Greenwater, Seaholm and North Shore developments are going to look nice along the lakefront with a lot of other buildings rising even taller behind them.

[oberthewhat]

From The Independents Facebook page. getting ready to open the sales center.

[KevinFromTexas]

This is from their Facebook page:


The Independent Austin - https://www.facebook.com/independent...type=1&theater

[Syndic]

"Iconic design".

Oh Lord, that's the kind of language people who build eyesores use. I'm equal parts nervous and excited about this one. I really hope they don't fuck this up. They need to build something that fits in with Austin.

[GoldenBoot]

Just curious...iyo, what does "fits in with Austin" mean?

I agree with you about the use of the term "iconic." However, I truly hope this is an iconic, non-conformist tower. AND, Austin's new tallest at over 750'.