Phoenix | Derby | 240' | 21 Floors

[CrestedSaguaro]

My record's request finally came in for Derby. They are however the submitted plans from 2017 and don't show anything that may have changed. The plans are barely legible, so not going to post them. But it looks like it may have not change much except probably ground floor level.

[azsunsurfer]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

My record's request finally came in for Derby. They are however the submitted plans from 2017 and don't show anything that may have changed. The plans are barely legible, so not going to post them. But it looks like it may have not change much except probably ground floor level.

Does it still show retail on the ground floor?

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

Does it still show retail on the ground floor?

Shows 2 spots - 2,052 SF for general retail space facing 2nd St and 1,992 for restaurant space fronting both 2nd and McKinley.

[muertecaza]

400' obstruction evaluation for Derby crane.

Overview
Study (ASN): 2020-AWP-1018-OE
Prior Study:
Status: Work In Progress


Received Date: 01/24/2020
Entered Date: 01/24/2020
Map: View Map
Construction Info Structure Summary
Notice Of: CONSTR
Duration: TEMP (Months: 15 Days: 0)
Work Schedule: 03/01/2020 to 06/01/2021


Structure Type: Crane
Structure Name: Derby
FCC Number:

Structure Details Height and Elevation
Latitude (NAD 83): 33° 27' 24.00" N
Longitude (NAD 83): 112° 04' 17.00" W
Datum: NAD 83
City: Phoenix
State: AZ
Nearest County: Maricopa


Proposed
Site Elevation:
1085
Structure Height:
400
Total Height (AMSL):
1485

Frequencies
Low Freq High Freq Unit ERP Unit

[ASU Diablo]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

400' obstruction evaluation for Derby crane.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

400' obstruction evaluation for Derby crane.

A little overkill on the crane app. Derby is only 245', lol. But will be nice to see this looming over AT for the next year and a half

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

A little overkill on the crane app. Derby is only 245', lol. But will be nice to see this looming over AT for the next year and a half

Maybe its increased?

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Maybe its increased?

The max height for that lot is 255' I believe. Plus, I didn't get anything else in my public record's request. I think it would have been in there if the height had increased. But ya never know, so I'll dig a little bit. Matt would probably have an aneurysm if it were increased to 350'.

[PHX31]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

The max height for that lot is 255' I believe. Plus, I didn't get anything else in my public record's request. I think it would have been in there if the height had increased. But ya never know, so I'll dig a little bit. Matt would probably have an aneurysm if it were increased to 350'.

That lot is north of the sky harbor height limit zone maps. So does that mean its height isn't governed by the airport? But maybe the zoning or something limits the height in the area?

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by PHX31

That lot is north of the sky harbor height limit zone maps. So does that mean its height isn't governed by the airport? But maybe the zoning or something limits the height in the area?

It's governed by Phoenix. Pretty much the entire Roosevelt Row/Evans Churchill area is maxed at 255'. There's a Phoenix height zoning map somewhere. I'll try and find it. This was probably done to keep local opposition down I'm sure. But it doesn't mean it's not changeable where FAA limits would not be. Phoenix could approve height increases as in the case of Garfield House where the developer is asking for an increase to 285'. I think the 255' height is going to be slowly increased over the next decade as more and more height goes up around the area.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Found it. This is the city height zoning for everything South of Hance. So looks like 250', not 255' as I stated earlier.

[PHX31]

/\Thanks!

I imagine someday that will be done away with (or heavily updated).

[Obadno]

I still find these height restrictions absurd, Washington is almost a half mile north of the north Runway, There shouldn't be any height restrictions north of Fillmore or maybe even north of Van Buren

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by Obadno

I still find these height restrictions absurd, Washington is almost a half mile north of the north Runway, There shouldn't be any height restrictions north of Fillmore or maybe even north of Van Buren

I've been saying it for years. If you watch the flight paths in Vegas, you will see many planes frequently departing 19R/19L that will bank left and will fly directly over the strip. This area of the strip is where some of the tallest casino's are located (Palazzo @642', Encore @641, Wynn @614, Trump @623 and the soon to be completed Resorts World @679).

These buildings are all 1.7 miles from the north end of 19L and 19R for a flight banking left and flying over them. If you measure a straight line following the runway alignment (which I just did on Google Maps, lol), a plane departing North is approx. 1.5 miles from Wynn.

Phoenix gets ripped off on it's height limits

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

I've been saying it for years. If you watch the flight paths in Vegas, you will see many planes frequently departing 19R/19L that will bank left and will fly directly over the strip. This area of the strip is where some of the tallest casino's are located (Palazzo @642', Encore @641, Wynn @614, Trump @623 and the soon to be completed Resorts World @679).

These buildings are all 1.7 miles from the north end of 19L and 19R for a flight banking left and flying over them. If you measure a straight line following the runway alignment (which I just did on Google Maps, lol), a plane departing North is approx. 1.5 miles from Wynn.

Phoenix gets ripped off on it's height limits

The answer is : The Vegas Casino industry can afford much better lobbyists than the few and minor land developers in downtown Phoenix.

As a city we have begun to push back on the FAA recently, hopefully you will see those efforts increase as more money flows into Downtown and some real players desire to develop taller in the area.

[PHXflyer]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

I've been saying it for years. If you watch the flight paths in Vegas, you will see many planes frequently departing 19R/19L that will bank left and will fly directly over the strip. This area of the strip is where some of the tallest casino's are located (Palazzo @642', Encore @641, Wynn @614, Trump @623 and the soon to be completed Resorts World @679).

These buildings are all 1.7 miles from the north end of 19L and 19R for a flight banking left and flying over them. If you measure a straight line following the runway alignment (which I just did on Google Maps, lol), a plane departing North is approx. 1.5 miles from Wynn.

Phoenix gets ripped off on it's height limits

As for Vegas, those planes are actually departing 1L/R. Flying over the buildings isn’t the issue as long as all engines are working. The issue is when they have an engine failure and reduced climb performance which requires a certain clear way at the end of the runway otherwise the departing aircraft will suffer increased penalties on takeoff weight.

This is also why the buildings in San Diego aren’t an issue....unless the airport departs runway 9 towards the east, which is incredibly rare.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by PHXflyer

As for Vegas, those planes are actually departing 1L/R. Flying over the buildings isn’t the issue as long as all engines are working. The issue is when they have an engine failure and reduced climb performance which requires a certain clear way at the end of the runway otherwise the departing aircraft will suffer increased penalties on takeoff weight.

This is also why the buildings in San Diego aren’t an issue....unless the airport departs runway 9 towards the east, which is incredibly rare.

Correct on the runway numbers, my bad. Still, McCarran is in much closer proximity to much taller buildings than Phoenix is to Sky Harbor. Heck, just a quick Google measurement shows it's 2.28 miles the closest runway point at Sky Harbor to Summit which I think is the closest downtown tower to Sky Harbor flight paths.

As for San Diego, I believe the entire Downtown area is under a 500' limit...even down to the ballpark which is nearly 2 miles South from the airport runway (more fodder as to why Vegas seems to get away with it).

Either way, not wanting to turn this into another "why we don't have taller buildings thread". We all already know why...height limits and the demand is just not there yet. But when the demand ever does get there, I hops some of these height limits are addressed someday and Phoenix can grow taller when it will need it.

[CrestedSaguaro]

CPO permit issued for potholing (a way to confirm where underground utilities are located). Either way, seems like work is imminent.

[ljbuild]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

Found it. This is the city height zoning for everything South of Hance. So looks like 250', not 255' as I stated earlier.

IT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE SOME "CRANES" IN THE 600 STRIP
I have mentioned this awhile ago, that DTWN. PHOENIX NEEDS TO EXPAND WEST AND N.W. to get further away from SKY HARBOR AIRPORT.
Once the planes are past I-17 they should be a minimum 2000 ft up in the air.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by ljbuild

IT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE SOME "CRANES" IN THE 600 STRIP
I have mentioned this awhile ago, that DTWN. PHOENIX NEEDS TO EXPAND WEST AND N.W. to get further away from SKY HARBOR AIRPORT.
Once the planes are past I-17 they should be a minimum 2000 ft up in the air.

I personally think as the towers start clustering North of Fillmore, Phoenix will end up raising the bar for taller towers in the long run. The 250' tall zone is going to become outdated at the pace towers are creeping northwards towards Roosevelt.