Sports in Canadian culture

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Stryker

European soccer takes up a huge audience, TFC draws almost no audience outside of the urban core of toronto, while the argos are the second team, for almost everyone coast to coast.

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You really think the Argos are everyone's second-favourite CFL team across Canada? They're probably the most disliked team overall from coast to coast.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

No question that the Argos have their work cut out for them and that they should follow the TFC/Raptor lead, but they seem to be in a weird state of limbo right now given that their current owner never really fully embraced the team and has been acting as a bit of a caretaker more than anything else. I would not expect any such initiatives to move forward under his watch, despite the fact they're sorely needed. That will be up to the new owner, whoever that ends up being.

Yeah, Argos management sucks. They wouldn't know marketing if it hit them in the face.

I am no fan of the Argos. Trust me on that.

[HomeInMyShoes]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You really think the Argos are everyone's second-favourite CFL team across Canada? They're probably the most disliked team overall from coast to coast.

They were only my second favourite team when John Candy was part of the ownership team.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You really think the Argos are everyone's second-favourite CFL team across Canada? They're probably the most disliked team overall from coast to coast.

I doubt that has been the case since Doug Flutie played there, or maybe even Rocket Ismail. These days they are mostly pitied. I'd wager that the Riders are the most disliked team, while also being the most liked team... they're sort of like the Yankees, you either love'em or you hate'em.

[Denscity]

Heres my two cents from out here. BC is not split into 2 or 3 cities like Alberta and Ontario respectively so its the entire province that watches the Lions, Whitecaps, and Canucks. A total of roughly 4.5 million people so that Lions and Argonauts game will have had tons of interior of BC viewers who are unlikely drive all the way to Vancouver to watch a Lions home game live. BC outside the Lower Mainland is approx. 2 million people. That game in Toronto had our entire province watching not to say that total viewership was from here.

[Acajack]

In fairness to TFC, their TV ratings were better when they were on CBC during the first years of the franchise. In the 100-200,000 range. Of course the team was a novelty as well.

Note than 100-200K is still way below Argos TV ratings, regardless of how you slice them. (Unless you want to do something ridiculous like attribute 99% of the viewers to the opposing team's market.)

As to the idea that TFC supporters are super-tech-savvy and don't watch TV, well the Seattle Sounders don't exactly play in a low-tech, luddite market and their local TV ratings are generally 5 to 10 to 20 times higher than the "national" ones for TFC.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

I doubt that has been the case since Doug Flutie played there, or maybe even Rocket Ismail. These days they are mostly pitied. .

The Argos are certainly not anyone's second-favourite though.

In the east, the Riders would be most people's second-favourites I'd say.

I know this feeling is not shared in the west.

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by esquire

I doubt that has been the case since Doug Flutie played there, or maybe even Rocket Ismail. These days they are mostly pitied. I'd wager that the Riders are the most disliked team, while also being the most liked team... they're sort of like the Yankees, you either love'em or you hate'em.

I'd agree with this. Prior to Saskatchewan's rise out of the depths, we were probably the second favourite almost everywhere (except perhaps Winnipeg), but then the success started on the field, in the stands, and in the financial statements... More and more fans came on board, and with more fans, you're also more likely to up the number of over-the-top fans (which tends to turn other fans off). The Riders also started cultivating some rivalries (buying billboards in opposing cities, etc), and that ups the "anti" sentiments. I believe they've been doing that in all away cities this year, instead of just some western cities like in the past: "Green is the new (insert your team's colour here)". But the more rivalries, the more "talk" happens and the stronger the league becomes overall.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

The Argos are certainly not anyone's second-favourite though.

In the east, the Riders would be most people's second-favourites I'd say.

I know this feeling is not shared in the west.

(Keep it under your hat, but I actually kind of like the Argos)

In the west, the Riders are divisive to say the least. After the 2007 Grey Cup they shook the image of being Chicago Cubs-style lovable losers. From that point on their fans became downright insufferable. A lot of the goodwill that other teams' fans had for the Riders evaporated, although if I had to wager I'd say that Rider fans would rather be in their current position as opposed to where they were 15 years ago!

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Nathan

But the more rivalries, the more "talk" happens and the stronger the league becomes overall.

Yeah, I'd agree. The Riders are probably the most heated rivals of any Winnipeg sports team... there is a certain electricity in the air when the Riders come to town. The Jets don't have that kind of fierce rivalry with any NHL team. I mean, there have been intense moments with some other teams, but that was set back when the Jets switched conferences... people get excited for original 6 teams because of the large fanbases they have, but I wouldn't call that a "rivalry" per se... I don't think any of the Habs or Bruins would consider Winnipeg a rival.

[SHOFEAR]

Originally Posted by esquire

... they're sort of like the Yankees, you either love'em or you hate'em.

Except the Yankees are hated because they have a few losing seasons per generation, not a few championships a generation like the Riders. Riders are hated because of their economic refugee likes fans who left their homeland in droves.

[SHOFEAR]

Originally Posted by HomeInMyShoes

They were only my second favourite team when John Candy was part of the ownership team.

I was more of a Bruce McNall fan myself.

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by SHOFEAR

Except the Yankees are hated because they have a few losing seasons per generation, not a few championships a generation like the Riders. Riders are hated because of their economic refugee likes fans who left their homeland in droves.

Almost everyone in Alberta (except for natives) is there because they (or their ancestors) went to Alberta for that same reason.

[HomeInMyShoes]

Originally Posted by SHOFEAR

Except the Yankees are hated because they have a few losing seasons per generation, not a few championships a generation like the Riders. Riders are hated because of their economic refugee likes fans who left their homeland in droves.

I think we can all be thankful that Newfoundland does not currently have a CFL team.

And you are being way too forgiving in saying a few championships a generation. At that rate they should have won about ten Grey Cups by now. They have won four. They are the not-so-loveable losers of the CFL.

[Allan83]

Originally Posted by HomeInMyShoes

I think we can all be thankful that Newfoundland does not currently have a CFL team.

And you are being way too forgiving in saying a few championships a generation. At that rate they should have won about ten Grey Cups by now. They have won four. They are the not-so-loveable losers of the CFL.

Ahem. Who are the reigning Grey Cup Champions again?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by HomeInMyShoes

I think we can all be thankful that Newfoundland does not currently have a CFL team.

Ha!

[elly63]

Originally Posted by mistercorporate

TFC has more people in seats than the Argos, over many more games, that's tangible fact.

Having a hard time with this one. Aside from this year when the Argos aren't drawing well (so far) they have outdrawn TFC, at the gate, for every year of TFC's existence, except one. And that one year TFC only gathered a few hundred more fans per game.

[Stryker]

Originally Posted by esquire

TFC ratings are tiny because their fans are too technologically advanced for TV. Now I've heard everything.

You keep projecting these sentiment that are not there.

Like somehow everything we do is in reference to another group of people.

I can tell you as a fact 95 percent of my close friends dont own TVs, its not a complicated situation.

And we are all typically very open to soccer, and not the least bit football.

You can call it an anecdote, but it is the truth, and I have no reason to believe we are unique in this.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Stryker

You keep projecting these sentiment that are not there.

Like somehow everything we do is in reference to another group of people.

I can tell you as a fact 95 percent of my close friends dont own TVs, its not a complicated situation.

And we are all typically very open to soccer, and not the least bit football.

You can call it an anecdote, but it is the truth, and I have no reason to believe we are unique in this.

Fair enough. But if there are 500,000 fans watching TFC games on their MacBooks or Android devices, how do you know that there isn't a similar number of Argo fans doing the same thing?

I doubt TFC/soccer fans are the only people to have rid themselves of television sets.

[Stryker]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You really think the Argos are everyone's second-favourite CFL team across Canada? They're probably the most disliked team overall from coast to coast.

Well favorite is a word I would use very loosely.

I think the more proper word would be default team.

If you follow the raptors and BJs your use to viewing toronto as your home team, even when its another sport.

This obviously applies to casual fans but its likely its a rather large number.