The Post | 67m | 27 fl | Completed

[scryer]

Originally Posted by rofina

Fantastic news for our City!

Vancouver is truly starting to join the bigs.

Exciting/Scary times.

Now would be a great time for some forward looking leadership on ambitious infrastructure projects that the city will surely need over the coming decades.

I agree.. I spy with my little eye some parking structures nearby that should get redeveloped. Maybe something more techy?

[osirisboy]

It would be nicer if the additions (it's hard to call them towers) would incorporate something from the original post office. They just seem like two glass boxes plunked down on top.

And the city has to reexamine the ridiculous view comes. Maybe the next council will be more open to that.

[rickvug]

There is a rumour comment on Reddit that I think deserves to be cross posted here for discussion. See https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/c...about/dy87hdv/. The commentator has really started to put the pieces together. I added my own fairly lengthy summary on this same thread (in the quoted text).

I think this is part of something really big for the city that most haven't clued into just yet. There's so much redevelopment that's going to happen along Georgia, starting at The Bay and reaching all the way to the waterfront, spilling out into the new NEFC neighbourhood. Sure, there's a lot of rumour and speculation in this thread. A good portion of it might not happen but ultimately the writing is clearly on the wall. With Amazon and the viaduct removal as the catalysts the transformation could happen very rapidly. This will be Vancouver's South Lake Union transformation.

username0121 17 points 12 hours ago*
This is the tip of the iceberg. Rumours are that this is part of a major Amazon campus at the east end of Downtown Vancouver. Almost everything between Georgia and Dunsmuir from Richards to Beatty, and possibly down into the new False Creek north development. Potential for well over 10,000 employees - whether it is HQ2 or not.

myporcupine 5 points 8 hours ago
Any sources on that? First I've heard of it. I can't see the Queen E Theatre going anywhere.

username0121 10 points 8 hours ago
No sources that I can refer you to. Just a network of industry folks. There was a mad dash by two separate developers to get developments approved. Developer A then went mysteriously silent. Developer B did get their development rushed through by saying that it had to be complete ASAP for a potential sole-occupant (20+ storey tower). They are even building it out of steel to expedite construction.

Developer A is who this thread is about (The Canada Post building), and Developer B has started construction on their building and publicly states they do not have a key tenant. If they don't have a key tenant, why aren't they even advertising the space for lease? Today, no commercial builder would build such a space at that end of downtown without at least one key tenant signed, and would certainly be pushing the leases!

WRT the Queen E (and Playhouse), I would also add into that mix the replacement Vancouver Art Gallery. I think we'll see a massive new arts complex built at the vacant Larwill Park site that incorporates the Queen E Theatre, the "Amazon Playhouse", the new Vancouver Art Gallery, with Amazon offices and condos in towers above it. Amazon would provide some much needed funding for the VAG and naming rights on one of the theatres. The wins? An amazing neighbourhood ecosystem with Amazonians feeding the arts, a situation that is aligned with Amazon's values that supports the "campus cluster", and the entire city will get some pretty amazing arts facilities.

Of course, this frees up the land you were concerned about on which the Queen E and Playhouse sit... which of course would be developed into more campus buildings and condos.

Now, although I mentioned Richards to Beatty... there is also an entire block between Dunsmuir and Georgia, Richards and Seymour that is primarily owned by one group. On that land stands the Hudson Bay parkade, some empty land, and the long vacant and decrepit Salvation Army building. Lots of chatter around that little parcel too. Who knows - maybe the Amazon campus will run from Beatty to Seymour.

rickvug 1 point 12 minutes ago
u/username0121 Are you able to elaborate even a little bit on where you might be hearing this "chatter" from, how solid this is, and where you're getting the 10k number from? For what it is worth I think you're on to something really big that should be on more people's radar. Let me unpack this a bit as well.

As you stated, the office building being built at Homer and Georgia is for Amazon. This has been widely rumoured (http://dailyhive.com/vancouver/400-w...tbank-approved). It makes complete sense given these other developments right next door. That's 4 buildings clustered right together, all planned in quick succession. Here's a tally of the total office space we know about so far:

Telus Garden: 91,000 sqft
Post Building: 416,000 sqft
400 West Georgia (across from the VPL): 375,000 sqft
402 Dunsmuir Street: 150,000 sqft
Total: 1,032,000 sqft of office space (that we know of so far)

Then you have the WeWork deal for the Hudson Bay office space a block over and the possibility of the building itself suddenly being put up for sale (https://www.straight.com/news/988296...ay-be-put-sale). Then in between with the parkade and vacant buildings has been fully assembled. Then you point out the VAG lands. Note that The Post's overall size will be 1.13 million square feet (as per the Quadreal announcement ), of which Amazon is taking 35%. As a rough rule of thumb it's interesting to think of each block having 1M square feet of potential. With the possibility of entire blocks redeveloping around here Amazon could grow to 2-3M sqft of office space if they make all, or even most, of the deals being speculated about here. I'm reading that most offices have 150-350 sqft per employee so 1M sqft which roughly lines up with the 5000 jobs announced so far. 2M - 3M square feet is 10k - 15k employees. I'd potentially go even further. We're not yet considering that there are more possible development sites along Georgia such as the CBC building, the district energy building (conveniently owned by Westbank / Ian Gillespie) or the new Georgia gateway towers envisioned in the North East False Creek plan. If Amazon doesn't take them someone else is likely to do so considering that everything else in the direct vicinity is redeveloping. Within the next decade or so we're likely to see the complete transformation of this section of Georgia, with a new VAG, offices effectively pushing right out to Rogers Arena, and completely new waterfront neighbourhood at the end of it.

I know this is bullish prediction but if you read the tea leaves it's all there, even if Amazon isn't the only big player. Overall there's already a massive office building boom at the moment. Employees filling these spaces means tens of thousands of new office jobs. Most job growth has been in tech. Many skilled workers are going to move to Vancouver. That in turn will create big spin-offs and ripple effects. As a frame of reference read about how Amazon is impacting Seattle: http://www.businessinsider.com/amazo...seattle-2017-4. 30k+ Amazon employees in downtown Seattle is next level but even 1/4 of that number in Vancouver would still have an outsized impact. Based on all of this it's easy to envision Vancouver's business environment changing significantly in the next decade. We're going to transform from a mid-sized fairly laid back city to a major hub with the opportunities that come along with it. While I'm very excited about this transformation personally it will also be painful. Change in Vancouver will not be slowing down. If anything it will be speeding up.

[a very long weekend]

^ If Amazon had firm expansion plans, you'd think they'd take the second tower in this post office project, not something at the VAG site. Remember, this office won't open until 2022, so any future expansion plans would be even further out, which seems unlikely.

That said, the needle has shifted so much in the US on immigration that expansion of programs like H1B or an increase in the number of employment based green cards seems unlikely for years to come, even if the Dems control the Congress for the rest of Trump's presidency. So, it makes sense for Amazon and other companies to send all their US-educated Indians up to Vancouver and promote the exceptional ones down to Seattle or DC after a few years. Canada itself also has an impressive well of affordable talent, as the graduating Canadians and the giant number of skilled immigrants coming in every year keep salaries for highly skilled people well below what they'd be on the other side of the border where immigration controls restrict the worker pool.

Man, if Vancouver would just upzone all those inner single family home neighborhoods to get the housing even remotely affordable, the economy would probably explode into a once in a 100 years expansion, as US companies flooded in. The rents are just too high to fully capitalize on the gift the US is handing the city. Whenever the US finally liberalizes highly skilled worker visas and the demand for Vancouver collapses, it'll be because the cost of housing was too high to ever get the right sort of infrastructure/ecosystem going to make Vancouver competitive with Seattle, the Bay Area, LA, etc. Hopefully, your new council gets that, or the Province steps in and takes the toys away from baby in sandbox.

[rofina]

Originally Posted by a very long weekend

^ If Amazon had firm expansion plans, you'd think they'd take the second tower in this post office project, not something at the VAG site. Remember, this office won't open until 2022, so any future expansion plans would be even further out, which seems unlikely.

That said, the needle has shifted so much in the US on immigration that expansion of programs like H1B or an increase in the number of employment based green cards seems unlikely for years to come, even if the Dems control the Congress for the rest of Trump's presidency. So, it makes sense for Amazon and other companies to send all their US-educated Indians up to Vancouver and promote the exceptional ones down to Seattle or DC after a few years. Canada itself also has an impressive well of affordable talent, as the graduating Canadians and the giant number of skilled immigrants coming in every year keep salaries for highly skilled people well below what they'd be on the other side of the border where immigration controls restrict the worker pool.

Man, if Vancouver would just upzone all those inner single family home neighborhoods to get the housing even remotely affordable, the economy would probably explode into a once in a 100 years expansion, as US companies flooded in. The rents are just too high to fully capitalize on the gift the US is handing the city. Whenever the US finally liberalizes highly skilled worker visas and the demand for Vancouver collapses, it'll be because the cost of housing was too high to ever get the right sort of infrastructure/ecosystem going to make Vancouver competitive with Seattle, the Bay Area, LA, etc. Hopefully, your new council gets that, or the Province steps in and takes the toys away from baby in sandbox.

Yes!

This is a once in a generation opportunity where a major house price decrease might actually prove bullish for the City.

We have other rapidly growing industries and need to get off our addiction to real estate speculation. This is such a remarkable opportunity to diversify and move away from that and parlay all the effort into Tech and Film.

I sincerely hope someone with influence is actually thinking about this.

[connect2source]

Guess this project isn't actually call The Post any longer, wasn't that the marketing term for the previous concept?

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by connect2source

Guess this project isn't actually call The Post any longer, wasn't that the marketing term for the previous concept?

No, the branding hasn't changed. 'QuadReal welcomes Amazon to the Post' [April 30th 2018]

[Changing City]

For what it's worth, I think the 10,000 Amazon employees conversation on Reddit is wild speculation. Somebody is adding 2 and 2 and making 22.

It seemed to me that Amazon looked at Westbank's 400 W Georgia and instead chose the Post. Simpler and more flexible floorplates, although not available until mid 2023. It's not clear if Westbank have someone lined up for 400 W Georgia or not; they seem to do their own commercial leasing these days. One scenario would be for one or more of their Telus building tenants to move, leaving space for Amazon to expand for a while in the Telus tower.

Vancouver Centre II on Seymour is due for 2021 completion. When it first started construction (well, demolition), six months ago, there were no prelease deals, and GWL are apparently also using their own leasing agency. There's a vacant site between Telus and 400 W Georgia that could see another 350,000 sq. ft. plus office building, so there are other available sites nearby with no development yet indicated. The latest suggestions for the development of the Westbank Creative Energy site is that it will be all commercial too, so that's another potentially available significant office space.

The Theatre block is very, very unlikely to redevelop, The theatres are a civic asset, it's a heritage building, it's had major upgrades in recent years and there are far easier opportunities for some years to come. The VAG / Larwill site is expected to have a significant office component at the northern end. It's hard to see how there would be objections to that being a larger office project with the Art Gallery provided as part of the package, like the Seattle Art Museum, but it's entirely not what VAG have been trying to get. They want their stand-alone starchitect box, and mixing it with office space is an entirely different scenario. However it proceeds it would probably need a developer - so far Amazon are taking leases, not developing buildings, so someone else would have to take the lead.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It seemed to me that Amazon looked at Westbank's 400 W Georgia and instead chose the Post. Simpler and more flexible floorplates, although not available until mid 2023. It's not clear if Westbank have someone lined up for 400 W Georgia or not; they seem to do their own commercial leasing these days.

It looks as if Feathered Friend has an update on the leasing of 400 W Georgia - he quotes Norn Taylor of CBRE saying 54% is leased, and 33% under offer. That suggests more than one tenant - and it's unclear if Amazon has an interest in any of it.

[officedweller]

If Amazon outgrows its Telus Garden space, I could see it moving to 400 West Georgia, that would allow more conventional offices like BHT to expand at Telus Garden (and for which 400 West Georgia would be unworkable).
It's also closer to The Post and 400 Dunsmuir
(but I could see delivery issues between Amazon @ 400 West Georgia and 400 Dunsmuir)

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It seemed to me that Amazon looked at Westbank's 400 W Georgia and instead chose the Post. Simpler and more flexible floorplates, although not available until mid 2023.

While what you said above is true, and the Reddit discussion is using faulty logic, through sheer luck it seems their conclusion is correct. Amazon is likely to continue to expand in this area, with a total build out much closer to 1 million sqft vs their existing total announced of 750,000.

Originally Posted by officedweller

If Amazon outgrows its Telus Garden space, I could see it moving to 400 West Georgia, that would allow more conventional offices like BHT to expand at Telus Garden (and for which 400 West Georgia would be unworkable).
It's also closer to The Post and 400 Dunsmuir
(but I could see delivery issues between Amazon @ 400 West Georgia and 400 Dunsmuir)

For all we know Amazon has rights on the remaining tower at the post. Given the size of their tenancy I'd be surprised if they didn't. They could wrap up their Telus gardens tenancy in 2025 and move another big chunk into their campus in the Post.

[jlousa]

Yes 400 W Goergia has an anchor tenant, it should be announced shortly. And 2+2 is still just 4 as the anchor tenant can attest too.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

For all we know Amazon has rights on the remaining tower at the post. Given the size of their tenancy I'd be surprised if they didn't. They could wrap up their Telus gardens tenancy in 2025 and move another big chunk into their campus in the Post.

That makes sense.

Originally Posted by jlousa

Yes 400 W Goergia has an anchor tenant, it should be announced shortly. And 2+2 is still just 4 as the anchor tenant can attest too.

Are you suggesting there's a reason the renderings of The Post don't have a Deloitte sign like Feathered Friend's model pics
(i.e. as LeftCoaster suggests, Amazon had more bargaining power so Deloitte couldn't get renewal rights at The Post, so walked?)?
We know EY is moving to Oxford's Melville Tower (isn't it?).
Maybe KPMG is leaving 777 Dunsmuir?

But that floorplate!?!

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Are you suggesting there's a reason the renderings of The Post don't have a Deloitte sign like Feathered Friend's model pics
(i.e. as LeftCoaster suggests, Amazon had more bargaining power so Deloitte couldn't get renewal rights at The Post, so walked?)?
We know EY is moving to Oxford's Melville Tower (isn't it?).
Maybe KPMG is leaving 777 Dunsmuir?

But that floorplate!?!

KPMG isn't leaving 777, not any time for the next 3-4 cycles that's for sure!

Deloitte has been rumoured to be in final stage negotiations with 400 W Georgia, even though it wasn't their preferred location. It does match well with the green credentials their RE group strives for though.

[Vin]

http://dailyhive.com/vancouver/amazo...conomic-impact

The mall atrium will be fronting Homer Street.

[logan5]

But when this space is combined with Amazon’s, there will be 7,000 office jobs within this redevelopment alone, making the old Canada Post building the largest office building project in the history of the city.

A huge game changer for the area. There are some fantastis old blocks to the east of The Post that will come alive with such a huge daytime population moving in. The Larwill Park site will add to this.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by logan5

A huge game changer for the area. There are some fantastis old blocks to the east of The Post that will come alive with such a huge daytime population moving in. The Larwill Park site will add to this.

Yep. Even for Vancouver, it's pretty dead in that area. This may not be the sexiest development that the city has seen but it will definitely be an anchor and a fertile foundation for some jaw-dropping redevelopments.

[csbvan]

Is QuadReal going to be landlord for the mall portion? If so, they may want to consider a large donation to help get the new VAG built and add a huge influx of foot traffic to the area.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by csbvan

Is QuadReal going to be landlord for the mall portion? If so, they may want to consider a large donation to help get the new VAG built and add a huge influx of foot traffic to the area.

Yes they will. I bet Quadreal would be actively involved in promoting the new gallery, but even they wont spend the kind of money needed to get that white elephant off the ground.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

Yes they will. I bet Quadreal would be actively involved in promoting the new gallery, but even they wont spend the kind of money needed to get that white elephant off the ground.

White elephant; so true. Geez, I hope they go with a different design. But that's another thread, excuse me. This is not intended as trolling; the new VAG is integrally part of that 'hood.