[Moncton] Downtown Developments

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by jonny golden

Depending on what & when the first phase is, could Ashford work on both that and a Robinson Street building at the same time? And who knows if they'd even be interested in acquiring this extra property.

I think when the time comes, and Ashford starts work on the Downing Street project, that they will be fully invested in seeing that through, and would not have any time to deal with anything else in the downtown core.

This is a generational, transformational project for the city of Moncton, encompassing a full (large) city block, with multiple multi storey buildings, including a signature tower. This project will take 5-10 years to build out.

I doubt that Ashford will be interested in the former Galco site. Similar with ICON. They will be invested in the Infinity Tower. Lafford still has the Third Sister and the Gateway Towers (let alone the former Timmies site).

All three of these developers have their hands full. It will have to be someone else.

[jonny golden]

CBC:

The vote will see the city complete the repurchase in October. However, the city may not own it for long.

Let's hope that there is good interest in the property and that we get a nice development added to our downtown. 6-8 floors would make a great impact.

Galco's proposed building required the committee to approve eight bylaw variances.

City council had previously approved several variances, so hopefully that will make the property somewhat more desirable.

So if not ICON, Ashford, or Lafford, then who would be the probable contenders?

[josh_cat_eyes]

A few options that come to mind:

Quest (who has several developments in Dieppe)
Corey Craig Group
Killiam Properties REIT
The developer of the buildings along Millennium Blvd.
The developer of Junction Urban Village
The developer of the Tomato building
The developer of St. Bernard’s Square
APM (unlikely, but they are a large developer in PEI)
There is a lot of developers in Halifax that could step up and buy this lot as well.

[jonny golden]

I'm not sure what's going on with Thrive Properties, but as far as scale goes, this project would be an appropriate sized building for them to undertake.

[Riberview]

Originally Posted by jonny golden

I'm not sure what's going on with Thrive Properties, but as far as scale goes, this project would be an appropriate sized building for them to undertake.

Doubt you'll see them involved in much, sadly.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

A few options that come to mind:

Quest (who has several developments in Dieppe)
Corey Craig Group
Killiam Properties REIT
The developer of the buildings along Millennium Blvd.
The developer of Junction Urban Village
The developer of the Tomato building
The developer of St. Bernard’s Square
APM (unlikely, but they are a large developer in PEI)
There is a lot of developers in Halifax that could step up and buy this lot as well.

Has Killam ever actually built anything from scratch? Around SJ they seemed to just buy existing properties......and even that seems to have come to a halt in recent years.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Has Killam ever actually built anything from scratch? Around SJ they seemed to just buy existing properties......and even that seems to have come to a halt in recent years.

Ditto for Moncton.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Ditto for Moncton.

I was wondering about Killam the other day. I owned some shares (then units) for quite awhile. Seems like they grew like gangbusters for some time and then sort or stopped.

[jonny golden]

Another question if I may. What are the odds of a developer from another city acquiring this lot? Does the city have somebody who would actually reach out to other developers in the region, or do they just put out the request for proposals and wait?

[josh_cat_eyes]

Originally Posted by sailor734

I was wondering about Killam the other day. I owned some shares (then units) for quite awhile. Seems like they grew like gangbusters for some time and then sort or stopped.

They own quite a few properties and certainly have the financial resources to build a project of their own, however I believe they have not build something for quite some time and more so focus on buying buildings after somebody else builds them. A good example would be the 10 storey apartment complex in Dieppe. Also speaking on that building, does anyone recall who built it? They could be another potential developer for the Robinson lot.

[NBNYer]

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

They own quite a few properties and certainly have the financial resources to build a project of their own, however I believe they have not build something for quite some time and more so focus on buying buildings after somebody else builds them. A good example would be the 10 storey apartment complex in Dieppe. Also speaking on that building, does anyone recall who built it? They could be another potential developer for the Robinson lot.

I'm fairly certain it was Sira developments who also built Mapleton Village apartments and Emma Place on Mountain rd. I think the owner has since retired and I don't think they are much active as a developer anymore.

[Monctoncore]

I know last I heard Killam was actually trying to sell off some of their properties. I know they sold a large percentage of what they owned on PEI. Also some in NB and NS, I forget the exact reason but some of it had to do with current costs to maintain and run some was just to much. I assume they are holding of on new builds and purchases until they see the markets and costs ease a bit more.

[Riberview]

Originally Posted by jonny golden

Another question if I may. What are the odds of a developer from another city acquiring this lot? Does the city have somebody who would actually reach out to other developers in the region, or do they just put out the request for proposals and wait?

This will go out as a request for proposals for purchase and deployment. Similar to the north west corner of Main and Vaughn Harvey.

As an RFP, it's likely open to any and all developers anywhere.

[jonny golden]

Galco would still like to be the developer. But if they haven't been able to do anything for 7 years, I can't see that happening. The city wants a builder to come to the table and develop the property.

"I want to push forward with this development and I'm disappointed," Gallant said. "But you know, we'll see what happens tomorrow."

[sailor734]

Sounds like the lot has enough issues that they make it unattractive to develop from a financial POV. Maybe it will sit empty until more of the low hanging fruit is gone.

[MonctonRad]

Apparently the former Hakkim Optical building on St George St. has been leased. The new tenant will be a “nationally branded drug store.”

The information is solid (provided by the listing agent). An announcement is forthcoming.

There is already a Shoppers and a PJC in the neighbourhood. It will be interesting to see which brand this is.

[jonny golden]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Sounds like the lot has enough issues that they make it unattractive to develop from a financial POV. Maybe it will sit empty until more of the low hanging fruit is gone.

Hopefully not. The re-purchase by the city is supposed to happen in October, then the request for proposals sometime after that. The very best we could hope for is to see construction starting in 2025, and that's an optimistic outlook.

"From a project that barely was sustainable from the beginning, we ended up having a project that just didn't make financial sense," Gallant said.

I'm just wondering if a 6 floor building was "barely sustainable" could a developer come along and design a 7-8 floor building? Would the lot support such a project?

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by jonny golden

I'm just wondering if a 6 floor building was "barely sustainable" could a developer come along and design a 7-8 floor building? Would the lot support such a project?

The footprint is relatively small and oddly shaped, This makes on site parking difficult. If you increase height, then you would have to look at a multilevel parking garage, or, go ahead and build with reduced parking requirements (also a possibility), especially if you are going for affordable bachelor units and one bedroom apartments.

[drewber]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Apparently the former Hakkim Optical building on St George St. has been leased. The new tenant will be a “nationally branded drug store.”

The information is solid (provided by the listing agent). An announcement is forthcoming.

There is already a Shoppers and a PJC in the neighbourhood. It will be interesting to see which brand this is.

London Drugs perhaps?

[jonny golden]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

The footprint is relatively small and oddly shaped, This makes on site parking difficult. If you increase height, then you would have to look at a multilevel parking garage, or, go ahead and build with reduced parking requirements (also a possibility), especially if you are going for affordable bachelor units and one bedroom apartments.

True. The 6 storey building had underground parking, so a 7th floor with a partial ground floor indoor parking garage would surely be more than enough parking space. That would still leave area for ground floor commercial. But would that be enough to make it viable from a cost vs revenue perspective. I'm thinking it would have to be 8 floors - but I'm no expert on the subject.

All I know is that a 6-8 floor building on that parking lot would make a major impression on that area of downtown.