Metro Areas by Electric Vehicle(EV) Share of New Auto Registrations, 2023-2024

[JManc]

But city streets are already lined up with parked cars everywhere. That's likely never going to change in our lifetime so why not monetize parking even further with charging stations? There's already parking meters.

[homebucket]

Replace parking meters with charging poles. It's not that difficult.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by cabasse

^that's exactly what we need more of on city streets. L2 is perfect for plugging in overnight.



tesla has been profitable for the last 4 years.

that was the reason GM gave, of course, and of course they wouldn't be profitable at such an early stage. but why sell the patents to an oil company? this is the same GM that was convicted for buying up streetcar lines in cities so they could monopolize the sales of buses to replace them - and barely got a slap on the wrist for doing so.

car makers hate EVs because they're going to hurt their bottom end when it comes to consumables and maintenance.

Is Tesla profitable from selling cars? I thought they were still relying on selling credits to other car companies.

I think there's evidence that the larger automakers jumped into the EV craze a little too fast. GM is being criticized now for not focusing more on hybrids before going all in on EVs. And EVs aren't going away by any means, but I'm very skeptical that even half of all cars sold in 10 years will be EVs.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by JManc

But city streets are already lined up with parked cars everywhere. That's likely never going to change in our lifetime so why not monetize parking even further with charging stations? There's already parking meters.

But that is changing. Cities are turning parking spots into bike lanes, parklets, restaurant terraces, playgrounds, trees, neckdowns, wider sidewalks, you name it. It's always an improvement.

[Gordo]

I'm all for turning over more space to peds, open space, etc, but even Paris and Hong Kong have street parking in many places. Some of that can be equipped with EV chargers.

[Gantz]

Originally Posted by The North One

It seems like there's a million smaller things about EVs that are worse than ICE. And it all adds up.

The technology for EVs is just clearly not here yet. People like to reprimand the old car companies for not doing EVs sooner over supposed greed or lack of innovation. But it's not some conspiracy. It made absolutely no fucking sense to push and research EVs until now, until the government started paying for most of the tab.

Another thing is that current EVs on the market, despite their torque, can't tow.
The state of the art EV pickups (Tesla/Rivian, etc) can tow a trailer for maybe 100 miles. Nowhere near enough for distances where people use trailers for.
The long range high capacity battery charging is not fast either, and not that cheap btw. The electricity cost of inefficient trailer towing with an EV can be even more expensive per mile than a diesel F150, depending on your state electricity costs.

Full disclaimer, I also think EVs are the future. Its just not the be all end all, especially with current tech.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by biguc

But that is changing. Cities are turning parking spots into bike lanes, parklets, restaurant terraces, playgrounds, trees, neckdowns, wider sidewalks, you name it. It's always an improvement.

To a certain extent yes but very little parking is being actually sacrificed generally speaking. My two frames of references are Houston and the Bay Area and both have added bike lines and the latter has gone further with parklets and restaurant terraces (both terrible btw) but street parking is still king. In SF and Palo Alto, I absolutely would refuse to eat at those street side dining spots because I don't want to breath in someone's tarted out Civic while I'm eating humus. Cool in concept but not realistic. I can see a street closed off from traffic altogether and that's becoming more common even in Houston.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by cabasse

tesla has been profitable for the last 4 years.

Tesla is NOT profitable on their own, they do not make anything on their cars without public money. Their "profit" comes from government credits that go into the accounting.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/31/inves...ity/index.html

[Gantz]

Originally Posted by The North One

Tesla is NOT profitable on their own, they do not make anything on their cars without public money. Their "profit" comes from government credits that go into the accounting.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/31/inves...ity/index.html

Why link to third rate fake news websites with an agenda?
Tesla is a publicly traded company, so their financials are public. Here is a link to their actual financial statements: https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...a-20231231.htm

For the year ended 2023 Tesla, Inc:
Total revenues: $96.77 billion
Automotive regulatory credits (government credits): $1.79 billion
Total cost of revenues: $79.11 billion
Gross profit: $17.66 billion
Net income: $14.974 billion

So if you subtract government credits you still get a net income of ~$13.2 billion.

By the way, their gross profit margin was 19.4% per car, 18.2% gross profit margin for automotive services, and 18.9% profit margin for their energy business, in case you were wondering.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by Gantz

Why link to third rate fake news websites with an agenda?
Tesla is a publicly traded company, so their financials are public. Here is a link to their actual financial statements: https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...a-20231231.htm

It's CNN Business... not some obscure source.

Because I'm not an accountant or a Tesla enthusiast and I'm not about to sit here and pull sec documents and run numbers over an internet argument.

Their profits went down 55% last year while credits still went up so it's hard for me to believe much has changed since 2021. Creative accounting is a thing, especially for Tesla.

If true then great, lets stop giving them public money then.

[JManc]

Tell that to the government who is motivated to incentivize the public to move away from ICE to EV's...not simply propping up Tesla out of the kindness of their hearts.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by JManc

Tell that to the government who is motivated to incentivize the public to move away from ICE to EV's...not simply propping up Tesla out of the kindness of their hearts.

Sure let me go write my congressman.

Seems it isn't working though, since dealerships are full of unsold EVs right now.

[badrunner]

Tesla laying off thousands of employees while giving their CEO a 50 billion dollar payday while asking for tax payer funded government handouts.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by Gantz

Why link to third rate fake news websites with an agenda?
Tesla is a publicly traded company, so their financials are public. Here is a link to their actual financial statements: https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/d...a-20231231.htm

Found a pretty insightful comment on Reddit about their Q1 2024 profits that I think is too good to not share.


u/Charming-Tap-1332

1. Tesla reported $1.1 billion in net income for Q1 2024.
   
2. $442 million of that net income came from federal carbon credits.
   
3. 386,000 Teslas were sold in Q1 2024, and the overwhelming majority were the Model 3 and Model Y, which are each eligible for the $7,500 Federal EV tax credit.
   
4. In addition to the $7,500 Federal EV tax credit, many states have EV rebates that can be stacked onto the federal credit.

Even if you were to assume only a ridiculously small percentage of the 386,000 EV buyers qualified for the $7,500 EV rebate, that collective rebate amount would overwhelm the remaining $658 million in net income.

For example, assuming only 40% of the buyers of the 386,000 Teslas that were sold in Q1 received the $7,500.00 rebate, that would total $1.155 billion, which alone amounts to more than 100% of Tesla's total net income.

The bottom line is that carbon credits and EV rebates (both provided for by the federal government) are responsible for over 100% of Teslas' net income.

The US taxpayers are the ones keeping Elon Musk in the black. There is no other single person in American history who has received more financial benefit from Washington DC handouts than Elon Musk and Tesla. He is certainly the king of socialist handouts.

https://www.reddit.com/user/Charming-Tap-1332


So the federal tax credits stack on top of the carbon credits and whatever else they're getting. All Tesla profits still come from public money. I think US taxpayers have every right to not be okay with this. Nothing about it is "fake news".

[cabasse]

the standard range Model Y and 3 are not eligible for the 7500 tax credit. https://www.tesla.com/support/incentives#new-vehicles

$7,500 Tax Credit for Each 2024 Vehicle (MSRP caps apply):

Model 3 Performance
Model 3 Long Range All-Wheel Drive
Model Y Performance
Model Y Long Range All-Wheel Drive
Model Y Long Range Rear-Wheel Drive
Model X All-Wheel Drive

AGI Limitations

$300,000 for married couples filing jointly
$225,000 for heads of households
$150,000 for all other filers

a lot of techbros out on the west coast are way past being eligible for these credits... tesla or otherwise. also - car sales are always lowest in Q1.

i am not a fan of musk or tesla at all in 2024 but to try to argue that they aren't profitable (while excusing the bailouts given to the legacy automakers 20yrs ago and also excusing subsidies for the oil industry) is really quite unfair.

[cabasse]

Originally Posted by The North One

Tesla is NOT profitable on their own, they do not make anything on their cars without public money. Their "profit" comes from government credits that go into the accounting.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/31/inves...ity/index.html

this article is from 2/2021...

[badrunner]

Tesla is still profitable but the company has definitely been on the downswing as of late.

On Tuesday, the company reported that its global sales in the second quarter fell 4.8 percent from the same period a year earlier, after an 8.5 percent drop in the first three months of the year.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/02/b...sla-sales.html

This article blames some of it on Elon Musk's political views but it's probably more to do with dated product, poor quality control and increased competition.