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  #221  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2024, 3:00 AM
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Williamoforange Williamoforange is offline
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They posted the panels, not half bad design on a quick glance....It might actually be better then Rockcliffe, but will have to wait for density mapping & ROW widths.....though I'd rather see this on the Greenbelt research farm then way out in the boonies.

https://www.tewin.ca/news-events/
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  #222  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2024, 1:24 PM
Jay31 Jay31 is offline
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
What I'd really like to know is if this is an actual planned community or just several hundred sh*tty townhouses on curvy streets?
I assume this is because people who buy in the suburbs want to feel like they live in the suburbs - that is, streets that have very little traffic because the roads are so windy that the only reason you would drive there is because you live there. I assume this is valued more than walkability and being near transit hubs. Some developers put shortcut walking paths between properties to help, but not always....and it doesn't help the fact that most properties will not be close to transit. It's what people want though.

Of course, the further out you build to satisfy the demand for suburban living, the higher the infrastructure costs...and the more ongoing maintenance cost, which politically, we're not willing to make property owners eat. Thus, politicians keep giving what voters want, even though it's financially unsustainable, and the city's infrastructure rots from the inside outward.
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  #223  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 1:12 PM
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Tewin land project doesn't add up, and it's not just about cost
Bruce Deachman says Tewin is paying for city staff to work on its development proposal. That's odd — and raises questions beyond how taxpayer dollars are spent.

Bruce Deachman, Ottawa Citizen
Published Jun 24, 2024 • Last updated 3 hours ago • 4 minute read


The Tewin development consumed much of the discussion at city hall last Thursday, as a joint planning and environment committee accepted the city’s $2-billion Infrastructure Master Plan, which will govern how Ottawa manages drinking water, sewers and stormwater runoff in the coming decades.

And no wonder there was so much discussion. Tewin has never made economic sense for the taxpayer. Close to $590 million will be spent servicing the water needs of the development, a contentious 445-hectare satellite community to be built near Carlsbad Springs that was proposed by a partnership between the Algonquins of Ontario and Taggart Investments. It was approved and adopted into the city’s official plan by the last council in 2021.

Of that amount, just over half, or about $313 million, will come from Tewin, with another $97 million or so covered by development charges. The city could be on the hook for about $160 million, a big ask of taxpayers given that city staff, when it was initially looking at where urban expansion should take place, determined that the Tewin land was too far away from the urban area and didn’t score high enough to even warrant a thorough assessment. Before approving the city’s plan, the province also questioned the Tewin project, noting it didn’t appear to align with some of the city’s goals, including creating 15-minute communities and developing close to rapid transit.

Even the ameliorating notion that expanding the city’s boundaries and approving Tewin was an act of Indigenous reconciliation is questioned by other Algonquin Nations, who say that it wasn’t reconciliation and that they weren’t consulted.

Regardless, it’s shaping up to be too expensive a project, reconciliation or no, and the city should explore ways of expanding instead to some of the West Carleton/March lands that scored much higher on staff assessments and are closer to existing infrastructure.

Meanwhile, the nighttime clear-cutting of 70 hectares of trees by Tewin a year ago, which Taggart first defended as necessary to clean up after the derecho, then subsequently added it was allowed in order to enable farming on the property, was an unsavoury event, even though the city agreed it had the right to do it.

Another questionable aspect was revealed Thursday: Tewin is funding the salaries and benefits of three senior city staff members whose responsibilities are solely to work on the Tewin project.

According to a September 2022 memorandum of understanding between the city and Tewin, a community designer, transportation planner and infrastructure planner — all employees of the city — are paid for by Tewin. Additionally, the memorandum notes that with regard to the latter two positions, “If the City is unable to hire a new dedicated Senior FTE … the Tewin Landowners will fund an outside consultant to fulfil these responsibilities.”

Additionally, if parts of the work plans of the latter two positions require outside consultants, Tewin will fund those, too, and their contracts will be subject to Tewin’s approval.

This project smells like a fish market on a hot day.

Questioned Thursday by Knoxdale-Merivale Coun. Sean Devine, city staff said that such hiring was not common practice and they were unaware of any similar arrangements at the city. Further pressed by Devine, staff said that city management would be unable to reassign any of the three to different files if it wanted, making it easy to wonder if they really fit the definition of city employees.

I asked the city’s media office for an explanation, but none came by my deadline.

It’s possible there’s nothing untoward here. Perhaps Tewin just writes the cheques and the three employees go about their business unaware that it’s a developer, not taxpayers, footing their salaries. The optics, however, are terrible, and the perceived impropriety of having a developer pay the salaries of city employees working on their projects is a black mark against both Tewin and the city.

Meanwhile, Capital Coun. Shawn Menard proposed a motion to have staff determine what the Master Plan costs would be if Tewin were removed from the equation. The motion narrowly failed, but the 9-8 outcome suggests that not everyone is comfortable with the burden Tewin will add to taxpayers’ bills. (Conversely, you could argue it also shows a reluctance to re-open this can of worms.) Bear in mind, the cost figure is even before roads and transit to service the development are calculated and factored in.

The joint committee’s approval of the master plan isn’t a financial commitment on the part of the city, and, according to the legal counsel, there’s no financial risk if the city changes it. According to Kitchissippi Coun. Jeff Leiper, there remain off-ramps from the deal if councillors choose to take them.

They ought to at least consider doing so, as these and other costs come to light. For while I understand the reluctance to relitigate decisions made by previous councils, a point made Thursday by Stittsville Coun. Glen Gower, it’s equally the responsibility of elected officials to re-evaluate the city’s path as details and costs become clearer. Too many questions remain about Tewin to simply forge ahead.

bdeachman@postmedia.com

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...t-cost-opinion
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  #224  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 4:33 PM
stolenottawa stolenottawa is online now
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Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
[B][SIZE="4"]
Another questionable aspect was revealed Thursday: Tewin is funding the salaries and benefits of three senior city staff members whose responsibilities are solely to work on the Tewin project.

According to a September 2022 memorandum of understanding between the city and Tewin, a community designer, transportation planner and infrastructure planner — all employees of the city — are paid for by Tewin. Additionally, the memorandum notes that with regard to the latter two positions, “If the City is unable to hire a new dedicated Senior FTE … the Tewin Landowners will fund an outside consultant to fulfil these responsibilities.”

Additionally, if parts of the work plans of the latter two positions require outside consultants, Tewin will fund those, too, and their contracts will be subject to Tewin’s approval.
Ugh, WTF?
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  #225  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 5:25 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is offline
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Ugh, WTF?
Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
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  #226  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 5:29 PM
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Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
People keeping saying this but it's closer to downtown than Kanata is.
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  #227  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 7:02 PM
stolenottawa stolenottawa is online now
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Originally Posted by YOWetal View Post
Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
Don't disagree.

I'm guessing the people who will defend the optics of this on council will be the same ones who poopooed the optics of the developer ward donations (which also looked bad.)

I just finished reading The Power Broker and it's shocking how little things change, you see the same types of tactics used in Ottawa and Ontario that Robert Moses used in New York. It's clearly different but the patterns are there.

I suppose it's part of the cost of getting things done...but it always has to be done on the cheap here in Ottawa. Which ends up being expensive long term.
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  #228  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 3:06 PM
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From the presentation on their website:



https://www.tewin.ca/news-events/
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  #229  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 3:45 PM
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Great. 4 neighbourhoods that you have to drive (or bus) between to accomplish your 15-minute neighbourhood tasks.
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  #230  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 9:54 PM
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If we have a main street, what is the chance that we include BRT on that corridor or will it just be another car based plan with token transit. There will be zero chance that we include effective transit from Day 1.
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  #231  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 10:05 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is offline
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Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
Great. 4 neighbourhoods that you have to drive (or bus) between to accomplish your 15-minute neighbourhood tasks.
Yeah there is going to be a bus betwenn nodes

We can barely build not suburban housing somewhere like Oblates land where still the ground based housing sells first. This is obviously a 2-3 car per family development.
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  #232  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 10:36 PM
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We know that this whole idea will be blown away when neighbouring land is also developed and it just becomes another suburb and the original concept goes out the window. I am old enough to remember that Kanata had special design features when it was first developed, and has later became watered down with each subsequent phase. Just like Greenboro, which was never copied into other adjacent Hunt Club neighbourhoods. Everybody loved these special design features except subsequent developers who can make more money with cookie cutter traditional suburban designs focused on autos rather than people.
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