West Gatineau LRT & Downtown Loop | Proposed

[J.OT13]

Let's hope that this "énorme montant" includes studies on both sides of the river. And maybe funds to forcefully expropriate Wellington from the City of Ottawa?

«Un énorme montant d’argent» d’ici 10 jours pour le tramway à Gatineau

Par Daniel LeBlanc, Le Droit
11 juin 2024 à 15h25

Après des années d’attente, tous les signaux pointent vers une annonce du gouvernement fédéral d’ici l’amorce de l’été, dans 10 jours, au sujet du financement du projet de tramway dans l’ouest de Gatineau.

«On peut s’attendre à un montant très substantiel d’argent qui va être consacré à la réalisation des études qui sont nécessaires. [...] C’est un énorme montant d’argent», a lancé le leader du gouvernement à la Chambre des communes et député de Gatineau, Steven MacKinnon, mardi.

Ce dernier affirme que la réponse finale du fédéral dans ce dossier viendra d’ici la fin des travaux parlementaires, le 21 juin.

«Le dossier du tramway a beaucoup progressé dans les dernières années et on est à la veille d’annonce de très bonnes nouvelles», a-t-il précisé quelques secondes plus tôt.

Son collègue ministre des Transports, Pablo Rodriguez, a renchéri en disant qu’Ottawa a dit «qu’(il) serait présent, (qu)’on va être présent et on va l’annoncer très bientôt».

Ces déclarations surviennent 48 heures à peine après l’élection à la mairie de Maude Marquis-Bissonnette, fervente défenseuse du projet qui s’est elle-même décrite comme «la guerrière du tramway» pendant la campagne.

Le gouvernement du Québec et la Ville ayant depuis belle lurette annoncé leurs couleurs dans ce dossier dont le coût total est évalué selon les dernières estimations disponibles entre trois et quatre milliards de dollars, seule la participation d’Ottawa était attendue de pied ferme pour poursuivre les démarches.

À la mi-mai, des sources avaient indiqué au Droit que les gouvernements du Québec et du Canada étaient réticents à procéder à une annonce dans ce dossier d’envergure pendant la course à la mairie, mais que les détails étaient réglés dans les deux capitales.

La mairesse désignée a abordé la question avec Trudeau

Pendant ce temps, la mairesse désignée de Gatineau a aussi abordé la question avec le ministre responsable de l’Outaouais, Mathieu Lacombe, qu’elle rencontrait pour la première fois mardi pour «effleurer» quelques enjeux.

Mme Marquis-Bissonnette a fait savoir à sa sortie de cette réunion que le tramway est d’ailleurs l’unique dossier qu’elle a abordé avec le premier ministre Justin Trudeau, qui lui a téléphoné lundi soir pour la féliciter pour son élection.

«Je lui ai réitéré l’importance de ce projet-là. Tant mieux s’il y a de bonnes nouvelles qui s’en viennent. C’est un projet que ça prend pour Gatineau, pour le secteur ouest de la ville, mais qui sera bon pour tout le monde, a-t-elle lancé. Je pense qu’il saisit très bien l’importance de ce projet pour des objectifs qu’on a en commun, c’est-à-dire notamment la lutte aux changements climatiques et un meilleur transport dans la région de la capitale nationale.»

Sans spécifier si le gouvernement provincial pourrait allonger de nouvelles sommes, Mathieu Lacombe a rappelé que Québec est «depuis le départ, derrière le projet» et qu’il «continuera d’être au rendez-vous», ajoutant qu’il est rassurant de voir que les instances municipales ont des «intentions claires».

«C’est un dossier qui est complexe celui du tramway. C’est un dossier dans lequel Québec s’est engagé depuis le début, il n’y a pas d’ambigüité là-dessus, par contre, effectivement, on devait travailler avec le fédéral et cela a été fait de façon intensive dans les derniers mois pour en arriver à une entente, a spécifié le ministre Lacombe. [...] Ce travail-là a très bien avancé, alors je suis confiant que dans les prochaines semaines on sera en mesure de faire une annonce.»

Le tramway 100 % électrique projeté relierait l’ouest de Gatineau aux centres-villes de Gatineau et d’Ottawa en s’arrimant aux grands axes de transport en commun existants. Ce système, prévoit-on, permettra de répondre aux besoins de déplacements des résidents de l’ouest de Gatineau pour les 30 à 50 prochaines années.

Avec une fréquence de passage aux trois à six minutes aux heures de pointe, il est estimé que près de 30 000 usagers pourraient l’utiliser sur une base quotidienne, et ce, dès sa mise en service.

https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/a...EESCMGPWWW5NI/

[harls]

Tramway de Gatineau : le fédéral paiera sa part des 160 millions $ en études


https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle...ncement-etudes

More studies. And it doesn't include the Ottawa part.

[VANRIDERFAN]

The great Canadian tradition of studying things to death until all the studiers are dead continues.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by harls

Tramway de Gatineau : le fédéral paiera sa part des 160 millions $ en études


https://ici.radio-canada.ca/nouvelle...ncement-etudes

More studies. And it doesn't include the Ottawa part.

Maybe the NCC will take over the Ottawa side of the studies and include the loop?

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

The great Canadian tradition of studying things to death until all the studiers are dead continues.

These studies are necessary to finalize the route and determine the works needed for the project. It's not a study asking if it's needed, but a study that includes the final environmental and engineering work.

[Acajack]

I admit to having no knowledge of the costing for such things, but 160 million dollars seems like an enormous amount of money for... studies.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I admit to having no knowledge of the costing for such things, but 160 million dollars seems like an enormous amount of money for... studies.

It's fair if this was anywhere close to a project near to realization. This is more in the category of trying to get political credit for a project going nowhere. Let's do another cross river bridge study while we are at it.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

It's fair if this was anywhere close to a project near to realization. This is more in the category of trying to get political credit for a project going nowhere. Let's do another cross river bridge study while we are at it.

I was thinking that too, but forgot to write it in my post.

[harls]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Let's do another cross river bridge study while we are at it.

We might get another bridge by 2050 if you keep up with that kind of talk!

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Maybe the NCC will take over the Ottawa side of the studies and include the loop?



These studies are necessary to finalize the route and determine the works needed for the project. It's not a study asking if it's needed, but a study that includes the final environmental and engineering work.

I'm a fairly new citizen to Ottawa. How many studies have been made on this concept?

My frustration is aimed at Canada generally where we pile study upon study to find the 100 percent solution and nothing gets done, where the 70 percent solution would have been good enough and a project advances. Look at passenger rail for the QC to Windsor corridor or building TCH interchanges in Manitoba. These and many other issues across the land cause me to say what I said.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by harls

We might get another bridge by 2050 if you keep up with that kind of talk!

I am firmly against the bridge which has little use to the Ottawa Ontario side of the border but with the bridge off the table the 50 will need to see some capacity adjustments in the medium term. It's getting to be maybe one of the biggest choke points in the region.

[lrt's friend]

We have added hundreds of thousands of residents east of downtown since the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge opened in the 1960s, yet there is still no bridge east of downtown, which can include a rapid transit connection as well. Transportation planning in this city has become shameful. We have all heard the 'war on cars' phrase, and this is probably the most valid example.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We have added hundreds of thousands of residents east of downtown since the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge opened in the 1960s, yet there is still no bridge east of downtown, which can include a rapid transit connection as well. Transportation planning in this city has become shameful. We have all heard the 'war on cars' phrase, and this is probably the most valid example.

We aren't putting rapid transit on Kettle Island. It isn't even a part of the war on cars. It actually breaks down counter to that on this board and more generally. The only benefit to Ottawa benefits downtown so it has no suburban pro car support. Some of the no cars anywhere are happy to get them out of their backyard.

[GeoNerd]

Putting another city's suburban streetcar down Wellington Street is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Bury it or keep it out of downtown Ottawa. The Wellington surface tram only makes sense if you completely turn off your brain to every issue this would cause.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

the 50 will need to see some capacity adjustments in the medium term. It's getting to be maybe one of the biggest choke points in the region.

How is the A50 a choke point? Intercity traffic is generally free flowing on it and it is slowly but surely being widened to 4-lane divided on its entire length.

As for its service level as a peak hour urban commuter route it's even not as bad as the 417 and 174.

As always the true choke points are the connections between Gatineau and Ottawa and the approaches to them.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by GeoNerd

Putting another city's suburban streetcar down Wellington Street is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Bury it or keep it out of downtown Ottawa.

"Keeping it out of downtown Ottawa" would defeat the whole point of building it.

The Wellington surface tram only makes sense if you completely turn off your brain to every issue this would cause.

Issues such as?

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We have added hundreds of thousands of residents east of downtown since the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge opened in the 1960s, yet there is still no bridge east of downtown, which can include a rapid transit connection as well. Transportation planning in this city has become shameful. We have all heard the 'war on cars' phrase, and this is probably the most valid example.

How in Hades is the proposed Kettle Bridge in any way a battle in the Great Patriotic War on Cars?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

I'm a fairly new citizen to Ottawa. How many studies have been made on this concept?

I believe this will be the third, maybe the fourth. So the first was determining a rough route and transportation mode options (BRT vs Tramway), the second confirmed that the tramway was the option of choice and this one is engineering and environmental works.

My issue isn't as much with the number of studies, but the long time gap between studies and the Feds' commitment issues. It didn't help the the former Mayor Belisle was always against the tramway (despite her campaign promise and voting in favour of it) and didn't release the last studies until a year+ after they were complete.

Originally Posted by YOWetal

I am firmly against the bridge which has little use to the Ottawa Ontario side of the border but with the bridge off the table the 50 will need to see some capacity adjustments in the medium term. It's getting to be maybe one of the biggest choke points in the region.

The biggest benefit will be removing truck traffic from King Edward. It will also better balance out traffic in general to relieve congestion Downtown and could provide the opportunity to reduce the number of bridge lanes Downtown to restore, for example King Edward, to something resembling its past glory.

Originally Posted by GeoNerd

Putting another city's suburban streetcar down Wellington Street is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Bury it or keep it out of downtown Ottawa. The Wellington surface tram only makes sense if you completely turn off your brain to every issue this would cause.

We are one region. Our transit system should be better integrate it and this is the way to go. There are certainly some challenges (protests and Canada Day, for example), but there are ways to mitigate that by ending the Line at Lyon on those days.

The tunnel sounds like a nice option, but it would be exorbitantly expensive. Might have worked a decade ago, but not now.

[danduc]

Originally Posted by Acajack

How is the A50 a choke point? Intercity traffic is generally free flowing on it and it is slowly but surely being widened to 4-lane divided on its entire length.

As for its service level as a peak hour urban commuter route it's even not as bad as the 417 and 174.

As always the true choke points are the connections between Gatineau and Ottawa and the approaches to them.

I live in Gatineau and peak hours are really bad, even worst that pre-covid. Traffic goes up my street in winter (I'm in Limbour). My commute time at 7h30 could be as long as 1h20 (for 15km) corner of St-Laurent/Innes. Leaving at 9AM takes me 18 mins. on a good day. Granted, the access to the only bridge linking Gatineau East to Ottawa are bad.

The tramway will never be built. They should stick with a rapibus in the west. STO spokesperson today suggest that French cities with similar population (Grenoble and Nantes) have streetcar!!!!! Comparing Gatineau to Grenoble ??

[CanadaGoose]

Originally Posted by danduc

I live in Gatineau and peak hours are really bad, even worst that pre-covid. Traffic goes up my street in winter (I'm in Limbour). My commute time at 7h30 could be as long as 1h20 (for 15km) corner of St-Laurent/Innes. Leaving at 9AM takes me 18 mins. on a good day. Granted, the access to the only bridge linking Gatineau East to Ottawa are bad.

The tramway will never be built. They should stick with a rapibus in the west. STO spokesperson today suggest that French cities with similar population (Grenoble and Nantes) have streetcar!!!!! Comparing Gatineau to Grenoble ??

The chokepoints are kind of obvious, 3 lanes of traffic trying to get onto an one-lane ramp from A-50 to A-5 sud, 3 lanes of highway speed traffic slowed down to a 30km/h zone waiting for a left turn signal every 3 minutes at St Patrick, etc.

Expanding the A-50 makes no sense, when the whole traffic system slowly falls apart due to a few bottleneck ramps / traffic lights.

[CanadaGoose]

Originally Posted by GeoNerd

Putting another city's suburban streetcar down Wellington Street is one of the dumbest ideas I've heard. Bury it or keep it out of downtown Ottawa. The Wellington surface tram only makes sense if you completely turn off your brain to every issue this would cause.

It doesn't seem worse than a bus system that stops serving Ottawa completely every major marathon summer weekend or Canada Day.

I miss when the proposed routing for Ottawa was to use either:
Prince of Wales bridge to Bayview and the Alexandra Bridge to Rideau