Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW)

[DTcrawler]

Originally Posted by MountainView

Pre-clearing in YOW and going via ORD is so much better than AC via YYZ. Is this your experience too? Makes the connection at ORD a lot more smooth/simple.

Completely agree. I'm always preaching to friends/family that it's better to pre-clear at YOW and connect via ORD, EWR, IAD etc. for TB destinations, instead of connecting via YYZ/YUL. I've noticed many infrequent travellers I know opt for the latter just out of familiarity with AC (despite UA being a *A partner) and I guess an affinity for Canadian airports. People are used to choosing the option with YYZ or YUL involved without taking a second to realize that there are better options. Same goes for clearing CAN customs upon return - the NEXUS / ArriveCan pre-declaration queues at YOW are a breeze, vs trying to do that at YYZ/YUL with a tight onward connection to YOW.

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by MountainView

WestJet is also flying YYC up to 4x daily. I'm wondering if the cuts to YVR come on the days where they have 4x to YYC.

I agree that AC and UA know the numbers on YOW-California. I think its one or the other, if they start the route. They could also grab connections to Asia and the Pacific via SFO/LAX though (but this would take away YOW connections via YVR).

Porter is definitely in a unique situation, where they can start YOW-LAX (for example) and have feed from numerous Maritime & Ontario stations. I believe Porter's CEO (or another senior manager), said that a YOW-Cali route would need some feed to make it work.

Does anyone know if the demand for the LAX/SFO markets are similar year round, or is demand higher in our winter season?

SFO is a massive business market for AC. They are waiting for the 321 XLR's, when they come expect lay flat seats between SFO and YYZ and YUL. They will own the business market with that. Even from Ottawa.

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by DTcrawler

Completely agree. I'm always preaching to friends/family that it's better to pre-clear at YOW and connect via ORD, EWR, IAD etc. for TB destinations, instead of connecting via YYZ/YUL. I've noticed many infrequent travellers I know opt for the latter just out of familiarity with AC (despite UA being a *A partner) and I guess an affinity for Canadian airports. People are used to choosing the option with YYZ or YUL involved without taking a second to realize that there are better options. Same goes for clearing CAN customs upon return - the NEXUS / ArriveCan pre-declaration queues at YOW are a breeze, vs trying to do that at YYZ/YUL with a tight onward connection to YOW.

For most flights Toronto and Montreal are the best options for the average Canadian based on total flight times and price. Frequencies are the big thing and it makes life easier doing those flights.

Heck its why Americans now use Montreal and Toronto to connect to Europe so much, certain flights have more Americans than Canadians when going to Europe.

[YOWflier]

Total flight times are mostly a wash and frequencies are way better from US hubs to everywhere in the US. Plus, pre-clearing in Ottawa is an infinitely better experience.

Selling cheap basic fares to Americans destined for Europe has indeed been a good market for AC.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

As was posted on the General Aviation thread, WG is going to operate as a standalone airline in Winter 2024-25 with integration into WS coming after that. I wonder if they'll add more frequencies on MBJ and CUN to cover WS pulling that service. I'd be surprised if they end up adding MCO, though.

I'd be very surprised if they were to add frequencies to cover for the WS cuts. MCO would be very surprising.

Today’s departure count: 79

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 1

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

Total flight times are mostly a wash and frequencies are way better from US hubs to everywhere in the US. Plus, pre-clearing in Ottawa is an infinitely better experience.

Selling cheap basic fares to Americans destined for Europe has indeed been a good market for AC.

I am booking 4 trips to the USA for work this week. Looking at it, almost all of them the shortest trip is through YYZ. By hours.

The issue with the USA connections is YOW doesn't have the greatest connections to them so you have to wait. YYZ is also the cheapest option.
So, for most people, its the shortest time and cheaper. So people will continue to use YYZ and YUL.

Pre Clearing really isn't hard anywhere in Canada. I know People here like to say it is, but as someone who travels 1-2 times a month for work I have not done any pre clearance or customs coming back to Canada that took over 20 minutes since last summer. (I have used Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal and Calgary).

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I am booking 4 trips to the USA for work this week. Looking at it, almost all of them the shortest trip is through YYZ. By hours.

The issue with the USA connections is YOW doesn't have the greatest connections to them so you have to wait. YYZ is also the cheapest option.
So, for most people, its the shortest time and cheaper. So people will continue to use YYZ and YUL.

Pre Clearing really isn't hard anywhere in Canada. I know People here like to say it is, but as someone who travels 1-2 times a month for work I have not done any pre clearance or customs coming back to Canada that took over 20 minutes since last summer. (I have used Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal and Calgary).

Agree on pre-cleraance. Have also done Montreal, Vancouver and Toronto and all are fine. Generally prefer Newark or Chicago. Canadian customs is much better in Ottawa. If you are in the front of the plane and checked baggage free you can be in your taxi within 20 minutes of landing. While true our frequencies right now aren't great to the US hubs you generally benefit from frequent US connections.

YYZ connections being cheaper would suggest the preference must lie elsewhere no?

[phil235]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I am booking 4 trips to the USA for work this week. Looking at it, almost all of them the shortest trip is through YYZ. By hours.

The issue with the USA connections is YOW doesn't have the greatest connections to them so you have to wait. YYZ is also the cheapest option.
So, for most people, its the shortest time and cheaper. So people will continue to use YYZ and YUL.

I had the same experience looking for L.A. I aim to avoid YYZ wherever possible, but the options just weren't there. I'm hoping that transiting through Terminal 3 with Porter will be easier.

[Tesladom]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Heck its why Americans now use Montreal and Toronto to connect to Europe so much, certain flights have more Americans than Canadians when going to Europe.

When I flew SFO to YUL last summer, I would say that around half the plane were people connecting to Europe via YUL. We were diverted since it was the day of the tornado and half the flight were in panic about missing connections

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I am booking 4 trips to the USA for work this week. Looking at it, almost all of them the shortest trip is through YYZ. By hours.

The issue with the USA connections is YOW doesn't have the greatest connections to them so you have to wait. YYZ is also the cheapest option.
So, for most people, its the shortest time and cheaper. So people will continue to use YYZ and YUL.

Pre Clearing really isn't hard anywhere in Canada. I know People here like to say it is, but as someone who travels 1-2 times a month for work I have not done any pre clearance or customs coming back to Canada that took over 20 minutes since last summer. (I have used Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal and Calgary).

What US cities are you heading to?

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I am booking 4 trips to the USA for work this week. Looking at it, almost all of them the shortest trip is through YYZ. By hours.

The issue with the USA connections is YOW doesn't have the greatest connections to them so you have to wait. YYZ is also the cheapest option.
So, for most people, its the shortest time and cheaper. So people will continue to use YYZ and YUL.

Pre Clearing really isn't hard anywhere in Canada. I know People here like to say it is, but as someone who travels 1-2 times a month for work I have not done any pre clearance or customs coming back to Canada that took over 20 minutes since last summer. (I have used Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal and Calgary).

If you provide concrete examples we can look at it. The discussion yesterday was centred around San Francisco and LA. There are around 10-11 daily flights on United between Chicago and SFO. Almost ditto for LAX. It doesn't matter when you leave Ottawa you’re never waiting long and any misconnect is inconsequential on a routing like that.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

If you provide concrete examples we can look at it. The discussion yesterday was centred around San Francisco and LA. There are around 10-11 daily flights on United between Chicago and SFO. Almost ditto for LAX. It doesn't matter when you leave Ottawa you’re never waiting long and any misconnect is inconsequential on a routing like that.

I've even used IAD to get to SFO. With a well timed connection, it's painless to do, even with the slightly longer journey. Of course PD nonstop to SFO would be far easier. It's coming with PD. It's just a matter of when. Probably summer 2025.

For this winter, I would hazard a guess PD will add out of YOW: a 2nd daily MCO, TPA, RSW, LAS and CUN. TPA/RSW could be a 4x/3x weekly split and ditto LAS/CUN as both are of a similar distance. Outside chance of MIA too. Hopefully YYT gets bumped to year-round as a lot of Newfoundlanders go to Florida.

[YOWflier]

I will just add that 20 minutes to (pre)clear is an eternity when you’ve got a 15 min walk on either side to get to/from your gates.

Things may get worse here if all those additions come and YOW doesn’t improve bandwidth during peak times/seasons. But for now it’s dreamy.

[sseguin]

Hello, does anyone know what they plan to build on the first floor pre-security at the Airport? There is construction walls up with signage for a Relay type store. Pre-renovations, there was a lot more available pre-security compared to the current, which is one Relay type store , Subway and Tims on the 3rd floor.

Also very much missing the public viewing area that was removed due to the relocation of the security screening.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by sseguin

Hello, does anyone know what they plan to build on the first floor pre-security at the Airport? There is construction walls up with signage for a Relay type store. Pre-renovations, there was a lot more available pre-security compared to the current, which is one Relay type store , Subway and Tims on the 3rd floor.

Also very much missing the public viewing area that was removed due to the relocation of the security screening.

Supposed to be a Bridgehead with a much-needed level 1 seating area getting added in.

Today’s departure count: 81

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 1

As can be seen, it's just a question of when before 81's broken.

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 69

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 0

Is today the last WS departure to CUN?

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Today’s departure count: 69

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 0

Is today the last WS departure to CUN?

Last one is next Saturday, which will be the last non-CDG international flight until the end of October.

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 77

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 1

[antresenect]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

Total flight times are mostly a wash and frequencies are way better from US hubs to everywhere in the US. Plus, pre-clearing in Ottawa is an infinitely better experience.

Selling cheap basic fares to Americans destined for Europe has indeed been a good market for AC.

In 2018 or 2019 I was flying the evening DCA-YOW and it was around 45 minutes late. They let off 6-8 people first that were connecting to YOW-LHR and worried about missing their connection.

For those that aren’t familiar DCA is just across the river from DC and on the metro line but IAD or BWI with direct flights to London are an hour or so out of the city. I wouldn’t want to be stuck in Ottawa though if things went wrong.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by MountainView

I had a flight book on the August civic holiday, YWG-YOW on Porter, and they have changed the original 12:30 departure to 06:00.
Not a fan of that... might switch to the AC flight unfortunately.

Not sure when the switch happens, but seems to operate at 12:25 in May and 11:50 throughout early June at least.

Was just poking around the schedule and noticed AC has moved the YWG-YOW flight to depart at 0645 for the rest of summer season starting August 1. Other option is WS departing at 1715.

The YOW-YWG timing is unchanged (as are all the other flights currently served by CR9s), so might be other schedule changes coming. Typically the eastbound frame has done YWG-YOW-YUL, and the frame that does the westbound flight has a busy day of YUL-YOW-DCA-YOW-YQB-YOW-YWG. The 1010 arrival from YWG is far too tight to turn to DCA at 1040 to do all the CR9 flying in one shot. So as of now, that frame would sit on the ground at YOW for a good five hours before heading to YUL at 1520. If AC really wants to play ball with Porter, could easily fit a round trip to YYG or BOS in there. Or the more likely scenario is they push everything else back 20 minutes and have one frame do all the non-YUL CR9 flying.