The Canadian Electric Vehicle thread

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Chargers at Canadian Tire are not super useful. How often do you go to Canadian Tire?

They could put them outside liquor stores.
Perhaps the government should be paying for this.

[Truenorth00]

You're thinking of it from the perspective of a person who has a house with a garage. The grocery store chargers are needed for us plebes that live in condos or apartments. And this isn't a small group. Nearly a quarter of the population.

Also, for out-of-town travel... Virtually every major charging network is targeting major corridors and lots of hotels are installing L2s on their own. Those areas are seeing investment. CIB is trying to encourage investment in the areas that are lagging.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

You're thinking of it from the perspective of a person who has a house with a garage. The grocery store chargers are needed for us plebes that live in condos or apartments. And this isn't a small group. Nearly a quarter of the population.

I already accounted for that in my post.

That's why I don't think that buy-in for electric vehicles among apartment owners is particularly high right now. (Certainly a lot lower than among people with houses.)

Since public charging is very roughly about 10 times more expensive than home charging, the economics aren't nearly as good if you don't have a home charger. Especially not when you consider the vehicle is more expensive than an ICE. Though I suppose that with today's price of gas it's still not too bad.

[Truenorth00]

^ The government isn't going to be able to meet their 2030 targets and their 2035 ICE phase out goals without getting infrastructure going everywhere. And CIB has a specific mandate to provide low cost financing and grants where existing private sector investment is lacking.

It's not about now. It's about a decade from now. Which is about how long it's going to plan and build out a lot of these charging networks. Think of the years it takes to identify sites, prep them and then put chargers there. They can't wait till a few brave souls in condos start getting EVs to then start building the infrastructure. They will have to facilitate that change.

Highway rest stops, hotels, major attractions, etc are less of a problem. They are getting private sector investment. For example, every OnRoute in Ontario now has DC fast chargers.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I've had an electric car since earlier this summer.

I've never charged a single time anywhere other than my home when travelling around in the Ottawa-Gatineau metro area.
...

What kind do you have?

In a small condo like where I live, there are three EVs out of about 30 vehicles, and the expense of installing a charging station would be unfair to the rest of us. It must reach critical mass before it's worthwhile.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Architype

In a small condo like where I live, there are three EVs out of about 30 vehicles, and the expense of installing a charging station would be unfair to the rest of us. It must reach critical mass before it's worthwhile.

And it becomes a chicken and egg problem. Condo dwellers don't want to buy EVs cause they can't charge. But they can't get chargers installed because there's no critical mass.

Government could massively subsidize chargers at condos and apartments. But that's basically a subsidy for a low utilization facility that will be limited to a small population. Put it at a grocery store and anybody can use it, and lots of people will.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

And it becomes a chicken and egg problem. Condo dwellers don't want to buy EVs cause they can't charge. But they can't get chargers installed because there's no critical mass.

Government could massively subsidize chargers at condos and apartments. But that's basically a subsidy for a low utilization facility that will be limited to a small population. Put it at a grocery store and anybody can use it, and lots of people will.

What is the profit margin for a commercial venture to do this now? It seems that residential buildings with around 100 units is the approximate baseline for this at present, and many still with a very low ratio of 10% EVs or less. I also frequent larger higher end buildings full of Porches, etc. and some are just installing them now.

[Denscity]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Chargers at Canadian Tire are not super useful. How often do you go to Canadian Tire?

Location and room. Ours is on our main drag and near the main highway interchange.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Architype

What kind do you have?

In a small condo like where I live, there are three EVs out of about 30 vehicles, and the expense of installing a charging station would be unfair to the rest of us. It must reach critical mass before it's worthwhile.

Think of it as an improvement that will boost your property value.

[WarrenC12]

Rivian dropped the ball on Canadian certification:

https://driveteslacanada.ca/news/riv...s-can-reapply/

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Since public charging is very roughly about 10 times more expensive than home charging, the economics aren't nearly as good if you don't have a home charger. Especially not when you consider the vehicle is more expensive than an ICE. Though I suppose that with today's price of gas it's still not too bad.

Ten times?! Here it's more like 2-3x, depending of course since it's billed per minute not per kWh.

Welcome to the EV family.

FWIW I'm in a condo, we have 1 shared L2 charger that about 12 residents use. Some also have 110V at their parking stall that they can use too. It's not the end of the world for condo dwellers. I never use local DCFC, only road trips.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Think of it as an improvement that will boost your property value.

It's really hard to convince most owners. Especially in buildings full of older folks (I'm in this situation) or in condos full of rentals (where landlords don't want to see condo fees go up).

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Ten times?! Here it's more like 2-3x, depending of course since it's billed per minute not per kWh.
.

Just going roughly based on what hydro rates are here in Quebec.

Not sure how much you pay in BC.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Just going roughly based on what hydro rates are here in Quebec.

Not sure how much you pay in BC.

2.39 per litre for gas in Vancouver today, by contrast our electric rates, while higher than Quebec's, are some of the lowest in North America.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by whatnext

2.39 per litre for gas in Vancouver today, by contrast our electric rates, while higher than Quebec's, are some of the lowest in North America.

He's talking about home charging vs. DC fast charging (or Supercharging). Electricity vs electricity.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

FWIW I'm in a condo, we have 1 shared L2 charger that about 12 residents use.

How does this work in reality? Are you texting your neighbours to get access to the charger? or ?

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

How does this work in reality? Are you texting your neighbours to get access to the charger? or ?

No you just plug in when it's available. The rule is, you must move your car when it's done charging.

I don't think we can handle too many more drivers without people getting annoyed, but it does show that you don't need one L2 charger per vehicle.

Having one in your own parking spot would be more convenient of course, but it's not a capacity issue per se.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Chargers at Canadian Tire are not super useful. How often do you go to Canadian Tire?

I'd like to introduce you to my father
About 30 Saturdays a year my brother and I would go with him on Canadian Tire runs. granted my Dad tinkered with woodworking (baseboard trim, making curio cabinets, etc) but it was a ritual. I thought it was normal as a child lol

Originally Posted by Acajack

I've had an electric car since earlier this summer.

Acajack, I've probably asked before, but which car did you end up buying?
My Pops has a Sorento PHEV. It only gets 52km pure electric but he loves it.

Originally Posted by Denscity

Location and room. Ours is on our main drag and near the main highway interchange.

this. The largest Canadian Tire store in Niagara (one of the largest in Canada) was built in Welland near a busy highway interchange of 406. It's 10,220 square metres (110,000 square feet)
Surrounded by a sea of parking and Molson's dreaded "SmartCentres" (those f------ penguin family statues) "big box fart" stores

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

And it becomes a chicken and egg problem. Condo dwellers don't want to buy EVs cause they can't charge. But they can't get chargers installed because there's no critical mass.

Government could massively subsidize chargers at condos and apartments. But that's basically a subsidy for a low utilization facility that will be limited to a small population. Put it at a grocery store and anybody can use it, and lots of people will.

Government subsidies are already available (and over-subscribed). Iinm, you need "buy-in" of 20 units to qualify.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

How does this work in reality? Are you texting your neighbours to get access to the charger? or ?

There are tons of apps for your phone for charging stations.

You can probably sign in and get an alert on your phone when the charger is free.