New Interchanges and Bypasses in MB / SK

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by Spocket

This caught my eye : The northwest and north east are the two slowest-growing quadrants of the city. It's been that way for decades and nothing has changed.

While I could be wrong the enrollment numbers in Seven Oaks School Division (north-west Winnipeg) are hard to ignore as they are at or beyond capacity in most of their buildings with the Amber Trails area showing no signs of slowing down. There has also been a huge housing boom in north Transcona/Habour View South area that is one of the big pushes behind the Plessis Rd upgrade/replacement with significant more housing planned there.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by CoryB

.In terms of priority projects in the city for new major roads the next few years on focused on the fastest growing areas of the city aka the north west, north east and Waverly West. The west extension of Bishop, the south extension of Kenaston (both with will eventually meeet the Perimter), the west to CentrePort extension of Cheif Peagus Trail are all near term projects. After that the north/south road in Transcona which may be a Plessis overhaul, and Cheif Peagus from Lag to "Plessis" are the focus projects. In terms of interchanges inside the Perimiter, Bishop/Kenaston is likely top priority as work has already been done there. Lag/Regent is also very high on the wish list. As for Bishop/Fermor, not sure the plan there but it would not surprise me if they did something to just resue the Fermor/Plessis interchange in place of a new Bishop/Fermor one. Bishop/St Marys is also likely ahead of Bishop/Lag. Basically the inner priority routes are likely to be Chief Peagus, Bishop, Lag and Kenaston, any intersection those have is fair game for an interchange or being closed (ie Renders, River, Pipeline, Tayor, etc).

So does any actual plan exist for upgrading some of these major intersections along the inner beltway with grade separations? Some upgrades along Bishop would be a great start...that street is becoming worse and worse for traffic congestion as south Winnipeg grows. Is the city even seriously contemplating anything in this regard? Or is this just a silly pipe dream on my part?

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by Reignman

So does any actual plan exist for upgrading some of these major intersections along the inner beltway with grade separations? Some upgrades along Bishop would be a great start...that street is becoming worse and worse for traffic congestion as south Winnipeg grows. Is the city even seriously contemplating anything in this regard? Or is this just a silly pipe dream on my part?

Bishop @ Kenaston and Lag @ Regent are both in some level of planning stage however keep in mind a full interchange for Lag @ Perimeter has been in the planning stages for 40+ years now. Anything outside those two is likely on the ten year or more list currently with CenterPort/Chief Peagus likely being higher priority than Bishop due to the strategic transporation initative policies attached to CenterPort's development.

[bomberjet]

So is Lag and Regent actually in planning stages? Like has something actually been looked at by the City other than saying something needs to be done there? Or is it just wishful thinking. The speed limit was reduced last year from 80 km/h to 70 km/h through the intersection.

I know it's gets mentioned in all the planning studies, etc. that have taken place for the Transcona West developments. And seeing how the City is just completing repaving of Lag (north of Reenders mind you), I would say it's probably going to be a while before anything happens there.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

So is Lag and Regent actually in planning stages? Like has something actually been looked at by the City other than saying something needs to be done there? Or is it just wishful thinking. The speed limit was reduced last year from 80 km/h to 70 km/h through the intersection.

I know it's gets mentioned in all the planning studies, etc. that have taken place for the Transcona West developments. And seeing how the City is just completing repaving of Lag (north of Reenders mind you), I would say it's probably going to be a while before anything happens there.

Seems like wishful thinking to me. The costs for a Lag/Regent interchange would be astronomical when factoring in land acquisition costs, buying out three strip malls, Moxies, etc. Likely can't even add a third lane on each side without buying out some or all of these businesses. Which is what I imagine the city will do with Bishop eventually..triple it instead of strategic interchange construction. Guessing adding 2 or 3 interchanges would cost near the same as adding a third lane from Lag to Kenaston (and beyond each direction soon enough) and provide better traffic flow (in all directions) than a 3rd lane would. Considering the amount of unnecessary and poorly synchronized lights along that "expressway". I hope I am wrong but favouring lane additions over grade separations seems to be the Winnipeg way.

[bomberjet]

Likely wouldn't be any loops at the Regent/Lag one, just a diamond. But yeah, costs would be high.. It would also make sense to do the Reenders diamond at the same time. But again, likely wishful thinking.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Likely wouldn't be any loops at the Regent/Lag one, just a diamond. But yeah, costs would be high.. It would also make sense to do the Reenders diamond at the same time. But again, likely wishful thinking.

I would think they would have to do Reenders at the same time with the trenching that would be required.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by Biff

I would think they would have to do Reenders at the same time with the trenching that would be required.

You would think. Looking at the Plessis underpass though, the Dugald intersection will be lowered by like 10' or something. Reenders is much further away. However, Plessis is budget constrained. As we've discussed before.

Edit: Looks like the plan changed for the Dugald intersection. Slight lowering but not 10' anymore.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

You would think. Looking at the Plessis underpass though, the Dugald intersection will be lowered by like 10' or something. Reenders is much further away. However, Plessis is budget constrained. As we've discussed before.

Edit: Looks like the plan changed for the Dugald intersection. Slight lowering but not 10' anymore.

With the CN line being what, maybe 100 yards from Dugald Rd, and now that Plessis has been mentioned as the eastern leg of inner beltway, why would a diamond not be constructed at Dugald/Plessis at the same time? Perfect opportunity...much or all of the earth required for a diamond will be removed for the underpass.

[northern_hoser]

I thought I read somewhere about an idea to sink Lagimodiere between the CN overpass to the south and the north side of Almey. Have diamond interchanges (similar to I29 in Fargo) at Regent and Reenders with both of those two streets as overpasses and have Almey as an basic overpass into the Rona parking lot, with adjustments. I'm sure the costs would be pretty significant and odds are the tallheads over at City Hall probably wouldn't even consider it, but it would be something to dream about.

[Biff]

I think I showed this before, my idea of what to do at Regent & Lag. My only question is how to connect to Almey properly (because I am no civil engineer)

[Biff]

It should be just like this construction in Calgary by Chinook Centre. The dimensions are very comparable.

[rypinion]

Originally Posted by Biff

I think I showed this before, my idea of what to do at Regent & Lag. My only question is how to connect to Almey properly (because I am no civil engineer)

Am I seeing it correctly that you have no "left turns" at Reenders? Just right turns and across?

(Note, I like that)

[CoryB]

I think the answer for the Almey properties is fairly simple, you have a yield from north bound Lag onto the street/CU and the exit is only to north bound Lag. Running the access street just east of Lag seems like a non-starter as it would connect too close to the Lag/Renders intersection and likely also be too close to the front door of the Olive Garden. Losing access to/from south bound Lag would benefit the residents of Almey in the long term by significantly reducing the amount of traffic using the street as a shortcut to points east with the trade off being they lose some access.

I have said it before, if Winnipeg is going to get serious about improving the flow of traffic on our existing streets people will need to be willing to give up the shortest path from their house to an "expressway" like Lag or Bishop.

[harls]

If (ever) the province decides to make some sort of interchange at the Perimeter with hwy 2 and 3, what's going to happen with that Petro-Can/Humpty's place.. will they have to be expropriated? No big loss as their pancakes suck.

I would close the access from 2 entirely.. feed it into the new 3/perimeter interchange.

[bomberjet]

Olive Garden has to go, there is no other answer. Almey is being closed as of Jan. 1, 2015, when the Reenders extension will be open. So the Credit Union will be stuck in it's own little island. I'm pretty sure they're taking down the lights at some point as well and making it a right in/ right out thing. So there would really be no option for the credit union. The land across Almey from the CU is also up for sale/development. So seems like the Olive Garden has to go, IMO.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by CoryB

I have said it before, if Winnipeg is going to get serious about improving the flow of traffic on our existing streets people will need to be willing to give up the shortest path from their house to an "expressway" like Lag or Bishop.

This. Couldn't agree more Cory. I understand everybody wants direct, easy access from residential areas to these "expressways". However if streets like Lag, Bishop are to ever truly function as intended it will take compromise by residents and the political will to see these infrastructure improvements through. The latter seems to be the toughest part!

I really like Biffs idea for Lag...would be a huge improvement over the current mess. Next up would be what to do with the Grassie/Springfield/CPT nightmare. Honestly with CPT now open I can't believe Springfield @ Lag is still a signalized intersection. Is the plan to cut Springfield access eventually?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Reignman

This. Couldn't agree more Cory. I understand everybody wants direct, easy access from residential areas to these "expressways". However if streets like Lag, Bishop are to ever truly function as intended it will take compromise by residents and the political will to see these infrastructure improvements through. The latter seems to be the toughest part!

The problem is that councillors can meddle in the process and override the decisions of planners and engineers who understand how these things are supposed to work.

Originally Posted by Reignman

I really like Biffs idea for Lag...would be a huge improvement over the current mess. Next up would be what to do with the Grassie/Springfield/CPT nightmare. Honestly with CPT now open I can't believe Springfield @ Lag is still a signalized intersection. Is the plan to cut Springfield access eventually?

I doubt access to Springfield will be cut... it is too important of a route to carve off. The little stub west of Lagimodiere could be relegated to using DeVries as an access route, but the the eastern portion is a moderately major route and there would be an outcry if it were blocked. I guess if an interchange were ever built at McIvor, maybe then Springfield traffic could be directed to Norris Road. I don't see that happening for decades, though... get used to the traffic light there.

Apart from the interchange issue though, I can't believe that Lag is still only 4 lanes the way it was in the 70s. How has there not been any discussion about turning it into a 6 lane road? The congestion between Marion and the north Perimeter is so bad it makes me feel sorry for anyone who has to contend with that every day.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by esquire

Apart from the interchange issue though, I can't believe that Lag is still only 4 lanes the way it was in the 70s. How has there not been any discussion about turning it into a 6 lane road? The congestion between Marion and the north Perimeter is so bad it makes me feel sorry for anyone who has to contend with that every day.

Thanks for feeling my pain Esquire. I have grown a major hatred towards Lagimodiere that only started about 5 years ago. The stretch between Marion and Dugald is about the biggest gong show of a road I have ever seen.

The line-ups at the north Perimeter (north-bound) are outrageous almost every evening...frequently extending south past McIvor Ave. It has really degenerated from an almost expressway like roadway into something to be avoided.

[rypinion]

Originally Posted by harls

I would close the access from 2 entirely.. feed it into the new 3/perimeter interchange.

I always figured it'd be the opposite - if the interchange was at #2 it would give #3 an "Oak Bluff Bypass".