CHICAGO | General Discussions

[Investing In Chicago]

Originally Posted by west-town-brad

the amazing transit coverage in NYC must be the reason for such little 24-hour automobile traffic there.

I read somewhere once that ~80% of vehicles in Manhattan are either Taxi's/Delivery Trucks/Other Livery Driver.

[Handro]

Originally Posted by west-town-brad

the amazing transit coverage in NYC must be the reason for such little 24-hour automobile traffic there.

Cute, but it is demonstrably easier to get around NYC sans car than Chicago. Certainly the 6m daily population of the 20 square mile ISLAND of Manhattan has more to do with the traffic there than anything transit related.

But feel free to have guests of hotels in the West Loop that they just need to wait in the January cold for a bus that will take them 30 minutes to go less than a mile to the blue line.

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by Handro

People will drive always drive in Chicago--while we want to offer as many alternatives as possible, we'll never have the transit coverage of NYC.

That's fine, let them drive. Also let them pay the costs of their choices themselves. There is no reason to foist the costs of the negative externalities of individual choices onto developers or the end users or tenants of their projects.

If you drive to the West Loop, then prepare to pay for it and still have to walk several blocks. That's no one's problem but those who choose to drive.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by Handro

People will drive always drive in Chicago--while we want to offer as many alternatives as possible, we'll never have the transit coverage of NYC.

Certainly not with this attitude.

You understand induced demand but don't care because you want to drive at everyone else's expense.

[Handro]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

That's fine, let them drive. Also let them pay the costs of their choices themselves. There is no reason to foist the costs of the negative externalities of individual choices onto developers or the end users or tenants of their projects.

If you drive to the West Loop, then prepare to pay for it and still have to walk several blocks. That's no one's problem but those who choose to drive.

end users and tenants will deal with traffic too.

Originally Posted by k1052

Certainly not with this attitude.

You understand induced demand but don't care because you want to drive at everyone else's expense.

"You" as in me? I only drive if I need to go to the suburbs for something.

The appeal of acting so sanctimonious isn't lost on me, lord knows I'm guilty of it myself sometimes. But I know that you know it's a complete fantasy to rid the city of cars or the need for cars. Offer as many alternatives as possible for daily commuters or neighborhood visitors, but understand that people will drive and offering traffic alleviating measures and ways to get the cars off the street when they get to their destination makes the city move more efficiently.

I'm not asking for the complete demolition of the El and 50 story parking garages to pock mark the west loop. City planning is a balance and fanatical adherence to New Urbanism isn't realistic or helpful.

PS. you know what would move much faster and serve more people if traffic was better managed? Buses.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by Skyguy_7

^I’m pro-public transit, and very anti-NIMBY, but how could they forgo parking in both those proposals? The West Loop is an absolute nightmare for autos. I have to swing down there from the north burbs for meetings and it’s always a great ordeal. This goes against my being; but MORE PARKING PLEASE

This is like how trying to reduce highway congestion through adding lanes doesn't work. Making more space for cars causes more cars to show up.

Improve city transit and Metra instead.

[killaviews]

The young business district should take a lesson from the senior business district where they are tearing down parking garages. Sounds like the alderman is on board with no parking. Terrible traffic isn’t fixed by more parking.

[BonoboZill4]

Thanks for showing up and representing for us ardecila!

[Mr Downtown]

A huge market for Chicago hotels is Midwestern tourists who drive the family to the big city for the weekend, or come in with buddies for a game. Just observe the Friday afternoon unloading on Monroe by the Palmer House sometime.

Hotels don't need one space per key, but they do need some kind of car storage in the vicinity, at somewhere around .2 spaces per key.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

Hotels don't need one space per key, but they do need some kind of car storage in the vicinity, at somewhere around .2 spaces per key.

Yeah, I think this sounds reasonable.

[marothisu]

My parents drove to Chicago and stayed at a hotel downtown. My brother, sister, 2 nieces, and a nephew all came too. Even though they drove a car that could have carried all of them in it, they just ended up ubering many places (or walking).

Some spaces are needed in the least for people driving in. It's also presumptuous to say "who comes to Chicago and rents a car?" Yeah sure, you might not need it downtown, but what's not to say that they aren't driving to other places in the metro on some days that aren't accessible easily by any public transit?

[marothisu]

Top changes in the Chicago MSA for foreign born population from 2017 to 2018


Top increases Chicago MSA from 2017 to 2018
1. India: +12,300 people
2. China: +4145 people
3. Philippines: +4087 people
4. UK: +2834 people
5. Haiti: +2692 people
6. Asia N.E.C (not defined): +2542 people
7. Cameroon: +2114 people
8. Turkey: +2010 people
9. Albania: +1840 people
10. Nigeria: +1726 people
11. Serbia: +1713 people
12. Canada: +1627 people
13. Macedonia: +1382 people
14. Barbados: +1317 people
15. Iraq: +1293 people
16. Japan: +1290 people
17. Morocco: +1280 people
18. Bolivia: +1249 people
19. Other Eastern Asia: +1161 people
20. Cambodia: +1080 people
21. Korea: +964 people
22. Vietnam: +947 people
23. Czech Republic: +895 people
24. Malaysia: +864 people
25. Thailand: +846 people

Top decreases Chicago MSA from 2017 to 2018
1. Mexico: -20,258 people
2. Poland: -7701 people
3. Honduras: -5151 people
4. Other Eastern Europe: -4403 people
5. Guatemala: -4234 people
6. El Salvador: -3399 people
7. Egypt: -3196 people
8. Ukraine: -2345 people
9. Pakistan: -2217 people
10. Saudi Arabia: -2040 people
11. Jamaica: -1977 people
12. Other Northern Africa: -1942 people
13. Laos: -1817 people
14. Other South Central Asia: -1796 people
15. Cuba: -1390 people
16. Eritrea: -1380 people
17. Other Western Africa: -1376 people
18. Italy: -1342 people
19T. Austria: -1318 people
19T. Nepal: -1318 people
21. Other South America: -1309 people
22. Europe n.e.c (not defined): -1305 people
23. Bulgaria: -1201 people
24. Ireland: -1200 people
25. Bosnia and Herzegovina: -1142 people

[marothisu]

Changes from 2017 to 2018 for the Chicago MSA in foreign born population, by region of the world:

1. Eastern Asia: +7569 people
2. South Central Asia: +7052 people
3. South Eastern Asia: +6288 people
4. Middle Africa: +2194 people
5. Northern Europe: +2154 people
6. Western Africa: +219 people
7. Australia/New Zealand: -470 people
8. Southern Africa: -692 people
9. Caribbean: -1249 people
10. Western Asia: -1312 people
11. Eastern Africa: -1559 people
12. Southern Europe: -2049 people
13. Western Europe: -2195 people
14. Northern Africa: -4842 people
15. Eastern Europe: -14,835 people

By continents:
1. Asia: +22,139 people
2. Northern America: +1516 people
3. Oceania: -954 people
4. South America: -2776 people
5. Africa: -5124 people
6. Europe: -18,230 people
7. Central America: -35,127 people (I know not a continent but still)


So basically, the gains from Asia and Northern America are offset by the losses of Europe and Africa. Big difference here comes from Central America and the big loss of especially people born in Mexico.

[marothisu]

Change in foreign born population in the Chicago MSA from 2010 to 2018. The losses of people born in Mexico and Poland is nearly the same as the gains of people from India, China, Nigeria, Philippines, Pakistan, Other Eastern Europe, Vietnam, Jordan, Romania, and Ukraine. There's actually an increase of nearly 17,000 foreign born people from 2010 to 2018 in the Chicago MSA.

1. India: +39,833 people
2. China: +13,499 people
3. Nigeria: +9074 people
4. Philippines: +7331 people
5. Pakistan: +7068 people
6. Other Eastern Europe: +4972 people
7. Vietnam: +4596 people
8. Jordan: +4261 people
9. Romania: +4207 people
10. Ukraine: +3721 people
11. Asia N.E.C: +3413 people
12. Iraq: +3179 people
13. Turkey: +2840 people
14. Moldova: +2743 people
15. Cameroon: +2666 people
16. Canada: +2508 people
17. Ghana: +2483 people
18. Serbia: +2396 people
19. UK: +2389 people
20. Albania: +2103 people
21. Japan: +2041 people
22. Morocco: +1940 people
23. Haiti: +1914 people
24. Malaysia: +1682 people
25. Afghanistan: +1668 people
26. Syria: +1595 people
27. Ecuador: +1474 people
28. Czech: +1460 people
29. Thailand: +1434 people
30. Saudi Arabia: +1348 people
31. Ethiopia: +1330 people
32. Colombia: +1305 people
33. Belarus: +1213 people
34. Kenya: +1138 people
35. Dominican Republic: +980 people
36. Russia: +953 people
37. Burma: +941 people
38. Bolivia: +891 people
39. Venezuela: +850 people
40. Lithuania: +785 people
41. Kazakhstan: +783 people
42. Barbados: +699 people
43. Australia: +645 people
44. Guatemala: +626 people
45. Indonesia: +609 people
46. Other Eastern Asia: +572 people
47. Nicaragua: +537 people
48. Nepal: +505 people
49. Other Western Asia: +476 people
50. Norway: +452 people
51. Korea: +428 people
52. Brazil: +380 people
53. Sri Lanka: +358 people
54. Denmark: +324 people
55. Other South Central Asia: +302 people
56. Liberia: +273 people
57. Sierra Leone: +265 people
58. Oceania N.E.C: +256 people
59. Cambodia: +249 people
60. Other Middle Africa: +233 people
61. Spain: +220 people
62. Austria: +200 people
63. Europe n.e.c: +196 people
64. West Indies: +160 people
65. Belize: +143 people
66. Bahamas: +142 people
67. Other Northern Africa: +121 people
68. Uruguay: +116 people
69. Belgium: +63 people
70. Cabo Verde: +44 people
71. Fiji: +39 people
72. Other Southern Africa: +34 people
73. Uzbekistan: +31 people
74. Panama: +16 people
75. other South Eastern Asia: Unchanged
76. Other Northern Europe: -14 people
77. Kuwait: -20 people
78. Singapore: -36 people
79. Other Northern America: -46 people
80. Other Central America: -64 people
81. Grenada: -65 people
82. Other Western Europe: -66 people
83. Other Southern Europe: -77 people
84. Trinidad and Tobago: -107 people
85. St. Vincent and the Grenadines: -178 people
86. Eritrea: -203 people
87. Bosnia: -230 people
88. Croatia: -233 people
89. Portugal: -235 people
90. Other Eastern Africa: -274 people
91. Other Aus/NZ: -285 people
92. Other South America: -293 people
93. Lebanon: -303 people
94. Dominica: -322 people
95. Guyana: -351 people
96. Armenia: -371 people
97. Other Caribbean: -380 people
98. Chile: -418 people
99. Switzerland: -436 people
100. Netherlands: -494 people
101. Hungary: -522 people
102. Africa N.E.C: -544 people
103. Sudan: -636 people
104. Costa Rica: -638 people
105. Sweden: -656 people
106. Iran: -799 people
107. South Africa: -836 people
108. Honduras: -962 people
109. Other Western Africa: -993 people
110. Argentina: -1033 people
111. Israel: -1058 people
112. Laos: -1061 people
113. El Salvador: -1064 people
114. Yemen: -1179 people
115. Egypt: -1227 people
116. Bangladesh: -1286 people
117. Cuba: -1315 people
118. Greece: -1444 people
119. Latvia: -1537 people
120. France: -1560 people
121. Jamaica: -1802 people
122. Macedonia: -1910 people
123. Bulgaria: -2269 people
124. Italy: -3041 people
125. Peru: -3364 people
126. Ireland: -3638 people
127. Germany: -5287 people
128. Poland: -24,826 people
129. Mexico: -73,773 people

[bnk]

Very good to see those Indian numbers but wow I never knew Hispanics were moving out that much. I just thought the inflow slowed down to a trickle.

Why are we gaining with the UK but losing Poles, Irish, and Germans?

Great find on the numbers, appreciated.

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by bnk

Very good to see those Indian numbers but wow I never knew Hispanics were moving out that much. I just thought the inflow slowed down to a trickle.

Why are we gaining with the UK but losing Poles, Irish, and Germans?

Great find on the numbers, appreciated.

Poles are moving out because the economy in Poland is doing as well as it has in 100 years and, due to the Euro, dollars earned in the US go an awfully long ways there. I have seen numerous elderly poles that were tenants of mine up and leave to return home and be with their families in retirement.

That and the foreign born inflows of poles tailed off 20 years ago so most people of Polish descent were born here and the now elderly foreign born are slowly dying off.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

Poles are moving out because the economy in Poland is doing as well as it has in 100 years and, due to the Euro, dollars earned in the US go an awfully long ways there. I have seen numerous elderly poles that were tenants of mine up and leave to return home and be with their families in retirement.

That and the foreign born inflows of poles tailed off 20 years ago so most people of Polish descent were born here and the now elderly foreign born are slowly dying off.

Pretty much. Also, the NYC area has lost over 15,000 Polish born people since 2010 as well. Percentage wise, that's a loss of 1.3% versus the 1.6% for Chicago - similar in that regard.

[sixo1]

Originally Posted by marothisu

Change in foreign born population in the Chicago MSA from 2010 to 2018. The losses of people born in Mexico and Poland is nearly the same as the gains of people from India, China, Nigeria, Philippines, Pakistan, Other Eastern Europe, Vietnam, Jordan, Romania, and Ukraine. There's actually an increase of nearly 17,000 foreign born people from 2010 to 2018 in the Chicago MSA.

How does Chicago compare to other cities in regards to the increase in Vietnamese population? (Or you could point me in a direction to look up these data myself.) Many of my Vietnamese friends (and their relatives that move to the US) want to leave (skip over) California for Texas because of affordability.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by sixo1

How does Chicago compare to other cities in regards to the increase in Vietnamese population? (Or you could point me in a direction to look up these data myself.) Many of my Vietnamese friends (and their relatives that move to the US) want to leave (skip over) California for Texas because of affordability.

Houston has the 3rd highest "born in Vietnam" population of any MSA proper in the country behind LA and San Jose. Dallas is 4th highest though a bit lower than Houston. In terms of overall population of this, Chicago is middle of the pack - similar to Riverside, CA near Los Angeles and not far behind NYC and Philadelphia areas. Basically though California (LA, Bay Area, and San Diego), Texas (Houston and Dallas), and Seattle dominate. DC area has a good number too.

I haven't looked at every single MSA, but these are the populations estimated of people born in Vietnam per MSA:

1. Los Angeles MSA: 248,516 people
2. San Jose MSA: 102,358 people
3. Houston MSA: 92,700 people
4. Dallas MSA: 57,773 people
5. Seattle MSA: 56,108 people
6. San Francisco MSA: 53,841 people
7. Washington DC MSA: 45,131 people
8. San Diego MSA: 40,157 people
9. Atlanta MSA: 35,512 people
10. Boston MSA: 28,999 people
11. Sacramento MSA: 28,605 people
12. Philadelphia MSA: 25,464 people
13. NYC MSA: 25,442 people
14. Chicago MSA: 22,811 people
15. Riverside, CA MSA: 21,348 people
16. Phoenix MSA: 17,313 people
17. Minneapolis MSA: 15,431 people
18. Denver MSA: 14,427 people
19. Miami MSA: 13,053 people
20. Orlando MSA: 10,742 people
21. Austin MSA: 10,706 people
22. Tampa MSA: 10,508 people
23. Las Vegas MSA: 9725 people
24. Charlotte MSA: 6629 people
25. Virginia Beach MSA: 4935 people
26. Baltimore MSA: 4610 people
27. Detroit MSA: 4537 people
28. Cleveland MSA: 2233 people

Now, between 2011 and 2018, Chicago MSA is doing decently well relatively with the changes:
1. Los Angeles MSA: +19,364 people
2. Houston MSA: +19,083 people
3. Seattle MSA: +9417 people
4. San Jose MSA: +8126 people
5. Chicago MSA: +5454 people
6. Atlanta MSA: +4688 people
7. Sacramento MSA: +3684 people
8. Miami MSA: +2606 people
9. San Francisco MSA: +2088 people
10. Washington DC MSA: +1429 people
11. Dallas MSA: +1365 people
12. Phoenix MSA: +1315 people
13. Minneapolis MSA: +1042 people
14. Las Vegas MSA: +599 people
15. Orlando MSA: +463 people
16. Denver MSA: +400 people
17. San Diego MSA: -141 people
18. Baltimore MSA: -326 people
19. Riverside, CA MSA: -469 people
20. Boston MSA: -902 people
21. Detroit MSA: -928 people
22. Philadelphia MSA: -3044 people
23. Tampa MSA: 5404 people
24. NYC MSA: -9053 people

In terms of percent change from 2011 to 2018, Chicago MSA is actually #1:
1. Chicago MSA: +31.42%
2. Houston MSA: +25.92%
3. Miami MSA: +24.94%
4. Seattle MSA: +20.17%
5. Atlanta MSA: +15.21%
6. Sacramento MSA: +14.78%
7. San Jose MSA: +8.62%
8. Los Angeles MSA: +8.45%
9. Phoenix MSA: +8.22%
10. Minneapolis MSA: +7.24%
11. Las Vegas MSA: +6.56%
12. Orlando MSA: +4.5%
13. San Francisco MSA: +4.03%
14. Washington DC MSA: +3.27%
15. Denver MSA: +2.85%
16. Dallas MSA: +2.42%
17. San Diego MSA: -0.35%
18. Riverside, CA MSA: -2.15%
19. Boston MSA: -3.02%
20. Baltimore MSA: -6.6%
21. Philadelphia MSA: -10.68%
22. Detroit MSA: -16.98%
23. NYC MSA: -26.24%
24. Tampa MSA: -33.96%


Also Chicago MSA had the 3rd highest increase of people born in Cambodians only behind the DC and Philadelphia areas - a little over 1100 added. The areas with the most lost a lot each - Los Angeles (-6339 people), Boston (-3406 people), Seattle (-3280 people), Dallas (-2940 people), Riverside, CA (-4448 people). NYC also lost over 1800 but didn't have a ton to begin with.

[jpIllInoIs]

Originally Posted by sixo1

How does Chicago compare to other cities in regards to the increase in Vietnamese population? (Or you could point me in a direction to look up these data myself.) Many of my Vietnamese friends (and their relatives that move to the US) want to leave (skip over) California for Texas because of affordability.

Isnt the Argyle red line station considered 'little vietnam' . I used to live in andersonville and we would go there for Asian food frequently.