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Originally Posted by MAC123
The people who actually run the station disagree with you
“Today, however, MSG’s existing configuration and property boundaries impose severe constraints on the Station that impede the safe and efficient movement of passengers and restrict efforts to implement improvements, particularly at the street and platform levels.”
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NO, they don't. It was less than a year ago that the MTA said it wouldn't even pursue the new entrance on 8th Avenue because most of the traffic entered the station from 7th Avenue, (and the new Moynihan was right across 8th Ave). You think they've suddenly got a new religion? Get your head out of the sand. I use Penn Station just about every day of the week. I know what I'm talking about. Penn Station is underground. Madison Square Garden is elevated above street level. MSG is not what has allowed Penn Station to turn into the current dump that (most) of it is. It's not the reason the place feels cramped. Witness the extended ceilings they were able to create after all these years MSG has been there. And witness the plans now calling for renovations and expansion - with MSG still in place.
This is just part of the negotiating phase, and I don't expect the general public to follow this nonsense step for step. But since I do, I'm keeping it clear. The only thing standing in the way of operations at Penn is Penn itself. It wasn't built to handle the capacity it now does on a daily basis. And that is what has to be fixed. Removing an arena that sits above does nothing for that.
And that's a point they actually do get...
https://www.amny.com/new-york/manhattan/...-crossroads-over-future-of-penn-station/
MSG, transit agencies at crossroads over future of Penn Station
By Ben Brachfeld
June 7, 2023
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.....the railroads are not outright calling on the Garden to move. At the City Planning Commission on Wednesday, the MTA’s Construction Chief Jamie Torres-Springer said the agencies are looking for a compromise. Among other things, he proposed that the railroads could build a brand new underground facility for MSG’s considerable cargo loading needs, which is presently done at street level and leads to significant truck traffic.
In exchange, the railroads want to take over MSG’s mid-block taxi stand, which has been unused since 9/11, and turn that land into a brand new train hall with a naturally-lit atrium, plus two new entrances on Eighth Avenue on land owned by MSG.
“We’re not saying MSG must move,” said Torres-Springer. “What we’re saying is that MSG must work with us to take steps to address these constraints and meet the needs of transit users.”
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Reps for MSG, on the other hand, have not been willing to engage in horse trading, arguing that the railroads’ master plan is not detailed enough for them to comment and that the drama over the special permit renewal lends itself to uncertainty over the future of Penn and the Garden.
“The plan that they have in terms of their vision is a concept piece. It is not detailed,” said Rich Constable, MSG’s head of governmental affairs and social impact. “There’s no concrete engineering, no concrete mechanical, no concrete electrical, no concrete structural, that we can look at and respond to.”
Constable noted that MSG is a publicly traded company and as such, cannot stomach the level of disruption the MTA’s Penn plans would have in store, such as potentially a whole season of Rangers games having to relocate as crews upgrade Penn’s HVAC system.
Asked whether the Rangers could follow the example of the WNBA’s Liberty and move to the Barclays Center — which no longer has a home hockey team after the Islanders moved to Nassau County — Constable noted that Barclays is no longer an NHL-approved arena, but more importantly, staging games there would rob games of their “magic” factor.
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“The reason we’re not sort of waiting on should they go, should they move somewhere else, is we have 600,000 people in that station everyday, in a rabbit warren.” said Torres-Springer. “It’s unsafe, it’s undeserving of the quality and character of this city, and we want to fix it now, and we have a plan that allows us to fix it now…and we can do that with Madison Square Garden on the block.”
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Dolan can't be forced to give up the land - this everyone knows. And the arena permit itself is just to allow for the large Garden crowds. (He could still operate a large, theater sized arena, which wouldn't help the Knicks and Rangers.) So, if these people don't want to see yet another set of large towers go up on site, they had better get together and figure out how to build an arena at Penn that complements Penn. Cause Dolan aint goin anywhere, and neither is Penn.
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