Basketball in Canada

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Berklon

I don't either - but that's not really saying much.

What that really means is that if the league as a whole is viable, the team in Toronto will be viable too.

[esquire]

I'm with JHikka on this one, if these guys pitching a team have no sports background and aren't aligned with MLSE in terms of getting access to MLSE-controlled venues, then they are most likely doomed to failure.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

I'm with JHikka on this one, if these guys pitching a team have no sports background and aren't aligned with MLSE in terms of getting access to MLSE-controlled venues, then they are most likely doomed to failure.

It may indeed be true, but it's still weird that in a city of close to 3 million people, in a metro of 6 million people, there are hardly any 7,000-8,000 seat venues (WNBA average crowd) for sports that are not controlled by a single entity (MLSE).

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

It may indeed be true, but it's still weird that in a city of close to 3 million people, in a metro of 6 million people, there are hardly any 7,000-8,000 seat venues (WNBA average crowd) for sports that are not controlled by a single entity (MLSE).

I was thinking the same thing. Toronto basically has Scotiabank and the much smaller Coca-Cola (CNE) Coliseum, and after that it drops off fast... you are basically looking at small OHL venues in the deep suburbs beyond that point, or Hamilton.

You would think that there would be room for another 10,000ish seat venue somewhere in there.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

I was thinking the same thing. Toronto basically has Scotiabank and the much smaller Coca-Cola (CNE) Coliseum, and after that it drops off fast... you are basically looking at small OHL venues in the deep suburbs beyond that point, or Hamilton.

You would think that there would be room for another 10,000ish seat venue somewhere in there.

Probably better suited for the Stadiums thread but....who would the main tenant be? Too big for junior hockey, too big/not financially sustainable for WNBA/G-League/NLL. AHL is under NHL (MLSE) umbrella. I guess it makes sense that all of the 5k-7k buildings are in Oshawa/Brampton/Mississauga...

[esquire]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Probably better suited for the Stadiums thread but....who would the main tenant be? Too big for junior hockey, too big/not financially sustainable for WNBA/G-League/NLL. AHL is under NHL (MLSE) umbrella. I guess it makes sense that all of the 5k-7k buildings are in Oshawa/Brampton/Mississauga...

Yes, I understand how the current situation came to be. Without an anchor tenant it's not likely to work. And Canada doesn't do university sports so that's out the window as a trigger for new venues. From a basketball standpoint, a lack of a suitable venue means that the chances of a WNBA team making it in the Toronto market are fairly slim.

[suburbanite]

Siakam with the well-deserved (and Toronto's first) Most Improved Player award.

Regardless if whether Kawhi stays, excited to see where this guy ends up. He's still getting better every day.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by isaidso

it will be played with FIBA rules instead of NBA (FIBA experience is important), and team chemistry/coaching plays a big role.

Many of the Canadians have played in FIBA Youth Tournaments and grown up together, for example RJ and Iggy played with each other when they were eight years old, if you can imagine that.

Apparently the draft picks were approaching Nurse about getting camp invites.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by JHikka

This whole thing sounds like an idea with no actual plan. SN article even highlights that the two proponents have no history in sports.

Bingo! I got more of an impression of modern age PC claptrap, and in the cutthroat business of pro sports that ain't gonna cut it unless you have one helluva business plan.

Added Escott, again, from the interview with The Gist: “The reality is that representation matters. When people look at professional sports and all they see are men, there’s a question from women and others — where do I fit in this? Where can I see myself in sports? And men’s only pro-sports are not representative of our nation’s population and mosaic.”

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by elly63

Many of the Canadians have played in FIBA Youth Tournaments and grown up together, for example RJ and Iggy played with each other when they were eight years old, if you can imagine that.

Apparently the draft picks were approaching Nurse about getting camp invites.

Most, if not all, Canadians chosen will have FIBA experience. A lot of credit needs to go to Canada Basketball. They've made sure representing Canada is something youth players dream about. It wasn't always that way.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Bishop2047

Lithuania is who I am even more worried about. They always seem to show up big, and have a lot more international experience. Either way tough group to be in, but if they come out of it they will most likely be playing France/Germany/Domican, all of whom they should match up well against.

Lithuania has more international experience but Australia might have more talent. Either way, they're both going to be tough.... and tougher than France, Germany, or the Dominican Republic.

[EpicPonyTime]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Where would they even play? Because MLSE isn't involved in this it won't be Scotiabank Place or the Coliseum. Would they get stuck out in Mississauga or Brampton? That'd be a quick way to insolvency.

This whole thing sounds like an idea with no actual plan. SN article even highlights that the two proponents have no history in sports.

Would the lack of MLSE involvement be a complete dealbreaker? The Rock continue to play at the ACC and they're independently owned (though admittedly they aren't playing the same sport as one of MLSE's teams).

[logan5]

This is why the vancouver Grizzlies were doomed from day 1. If this is how Americans feel about playing in Toronto, then there's no way a Vancouver or Montreal team would ever work until there is enough non American talent to choose from. It's not just a few of the players that feel this way either.

If you thought winning an NBA championship would shut everyone up about playing in Canada, you thought wrong, apparently.

Los Angeles Clippers guard Lou Williams raised some eyebrows this week, with his comments about the challenges of playing north of the border on Gilbert Arenas’ No Chill Podcast.

Williams is a former Raptors player, spending one season in Toronto in 2014-15.

Many of his comments about playing in Canada were laughable, but not all of them were negative. They’re getting extra attention though given the team he plays on — the leading candidate to pry Kawhi Leonard away from Toronto in free agency.

“Toronto’s a dope organization,” Williams said, before dropping the hammer.

“I don’t think they’ll ever sign free agents up there. The problem they’re going to have is trying to keep guys there.”

Well then.

While Williams clearly seems fond of the Raptors’ organization, he seems to have a real problem with really minor issues that come with living in Canada.

“Once you’re there, you’ll love playing for the Raptors, you’ll love playing for the country. And then that fourth, fifth month into the season you like, ‘God damn, I wanna go home,'” Williams said.

“When you play in Toronto, you feel like you’re playing overseas. Like, we can’t wait to go on the road sometimes. Just to be in America. It’s like little shit you don’t think of like the channels on your TV, your phone bill, you gotta get a fucking Canadian bank account. Shit like that people don’t think about. Like that shit is hard. Then if you have kids, you’re raising your kids in Canada.”

Raising your kids in Canada? The horror! Imagine your child receiving a decent education and being eligible for universal healthcare.

While Canada is undoubtedly different than the United States, these are hilariously ridiculous complaints.

If you want to get American TV channels, there’s a way to get them.

Setting up bank accounts and getting a Canadian phone plan? You’re a multi-millionaire, I’m sure you can pay somebody to do that quite affordably.

You’d think we’d be past this point of prejudice by now.

Tony Massenburg, who played for the Raptors and Vancouver Grizzlies during his career, once famously complained about the available cereal options in Canada.

“Nobody was hot on Canada, mainly because of the taxes. And there are things you can’t get in Vancouver, like Cap’n Crunch,” he said while a member of the Grizzlies.

Look, every NBA city is different, and each one includes a challenge. And there are a lot of terrible cities to live in on the NBA circuit.

Toronto is one of the most visited cities in North America for a reason. It’s also consistently ranked as one of the best cities for quality of life.

I wonder how Sacramento, Cleveland, Detroit, and Oklahoma City rank on those lists.

But hey, at least they get ESPN.

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/lou-...anada-overseas

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by logan5

This is why the vancouver Grizzlies were doomed from day 1.

The Grizzlies were doomed because they had horrible ownership and management.

I think this story is more about how Lou Williams felt about playing in Toronto and not so much Americans as a whole.

[Acajack]

They have Cap'n Crunch in every grocery store here in Gatineau. Pretty sure they have it in Vancouver LOL!

[logan5]

Originally Posted by JHikka

The Grizzlies were doomed because they had horrible ownership and management.

I think this story is more about how Lou Williams felt about playing in Toronto and not so much Americans as a whole.

Nope. Almost every Grizzlies player had some level of dissatisfaction. Even Shareef complained when he was drafted here. Big Country Reeves wife hated here. Like Chris Bosh said, players won't sign in Toronto simply because it's not America. You'd think these guys would be happy to get away from a country that has major issues.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by JHikka

The Grizzlies were doomed because they had horrible ownership and management.

I think this story is more about how Lou Williams felt about playing in Toronto and not so much Americans as a whole.

I've known a lot of Americans in Toronto who were basically lost outside of the universe of brands and consumer goods that they knew. And those were supposedly sophisticated graduate students and professionals, not basketball players. We're conscious of Canada's near-total irrelevance everywhere outside of Canada and it's consequently easy for us to substitute Walgreen's for Shoppers Drug Mart or Comcast for Rogers. That ease of psychological adjustment is not reciprocal at all ... it's as if they've never even considered that there could be a place where the touchstones of their material universe aren't recognized (even if it's just Cap'n Crunch).

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by Acajack

They have Cap'n Crunch in every grocery store here in Gatineau. Pretty sure they have it in Vancouver LOL!

Yes, but it won't be exactly the same formulation, or it will have its sugar content adjusted downward for Canadian tastes, or the box won't be the right colour (plus it will have you-know-which-language on it).

[rousseau]

For all that some Canadians sniff that Toronto is "too American," the proof is in the pudding. The vibe in Toronto isn't American at all, and it's not surprising at all that some African-Americans wouldn't feel at home there.

Raptors' players expressing surprise and wonder at how they end up liking it in Toronto is now an established NBA cliche. Hey, contrary to what you might have thought, it's pretty good up here! Some guys will embrace it with an open mind, and others, like Lou Williams, just don't like it. Which isn't surprising considering the generally very insular African-American experience that most of them have grown up with, where opening yourself up to the possibility of new ideas and experiences is irrelevant when you are living on the wrong end of an embattled existence in racist America.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Andy6

I've known a lot of Americans in Toronto who were basically lost outside of the universe of brands and consumer goods that they knew. And those were supposedly sophisticated graduate students and professionals, not basketball players. We're conscious of Canada's near-total irrelevance everywhere outside of Canada and it's consequently easy for us to substitute Walgreen's for Shoppers Drug Mart or Comcast for Rogers. That ease of psychological adjustment is not reciprocal at all ... it's as if they've never even considered that there could be a place where the touchstones of their material universe aren't recognized (even if it's just Cap'n Crunch).

The taxes thing I get, especially compared to low-tax states.

But....um, 'wat' for the rest of it. Most of the major brands of whatever your heart desires are here, aside from maybe grocery stores/drug stores? Even they carry a pretty complete set of America-brand whatever, with maybe the exception of chocolate bars?

Verizon phones work in Canada too. I mean, you'll have to extend your US plan, but a multimillionaire can afford it.



The weather, taxes and border 'hassles' sure, I see that. Then again, I can't imagine Cleveland being a huge draw, simply because it is in America.