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  #2481  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 7:47 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by Baronvonellis View Post
What were the top 5? I can't see Crains articles. Again, the perception of crime was a concern to Amazon. Most people outside of Chicago I talk to are scarred of the crime, they say how can you live there with all the shootings ect. The city really needs an all out War on Crime here, to shake this perception. That's the first thing people think of when I mention Chicago, whether that's fair or not, it's the perception. Bring in the National Guard!
All cities in Italy I went to had Army guys with machine guns walking around the downtown. I felt safer knowing they were around.
NYC, DC and Nashville were obviously 3 of the top 5. Don't know about the last one.
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  #2482  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 7:59 PM
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NYC, DC and Nashville were obviously 3 of the top 5. Don't know about the last one.
Dallas maybe?
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  #2483  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 8:03 PM
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I understand the marketing argument. Messaging could definitely be improved.

We can say we have the talent and environment that Google or Amazon want and need, but as a city, I don’t think we are showing it and proving it. Here’s the trend I see – behemoths follow behemoths. Where is Chicago’s tech behemoth?

There seems to be a successful trend for the city in the consumer packaged goods industry (Kraft, Hillshire, Conagra, Beam, MillerCoors, Constellation Brands, Ferrero, Pillsbury, Mead Johnson). There are tech and tech adjacent companies, but there is not an office with 5,000 or 10,000 or 25,000 that screams “we are a top tech talent company”. I’m not saying the trend is rationale. I guess a company could view it as X city has proved they have enough tech talent because Y company exist.

It takes more than boosterism from elected officials. If we want to be in the conversation, the companies we have here need to be the voice. Every company is somewhat of a “tech” company these days. I think it’s huge that Walgreens is moving all of its tech employees downtown. Now Walgreens need to tell tech success story. Hopefully it will. For us to win in the competition of superstar cities, we need some superstar companies. And it seems like we’re going to have to work with what we got for now.
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  #2484  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 8:10 PM
Investing In Chicago Investing In Chicago is offline
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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
You need to meet more people who have never lived in the Midwest and never even visited chicago. That's tons of people from all around the world. People who know Chicago take it for granted. People know about Chicago around the world but it's usually because of the Bulls/MJ, all Capone, or crime...and sometimes the Bean too.

Americans on the coast are by and large not any smarter than anyone else. Their knowledge is just different. Chicago is not on a lot of people's radars for one reason or another. You'd be shocked. I have had a lot of these experiences because I have 2 friends who are or were senior management consultants at Accenture who would teach a few 2 week courses per year in St. Charles to other consultants based all around the world. My friends were based in Paris and DC too, not Chicago. Since most of these were international people taking the courses, they would stay the weekend in downtown Chicago. Usually it was their first real in person exposure to Chicago and I'd hang out with my friends, who would be hanging about with these people. Every single time and nearly every single one of them were like "wow not what I expected at all."

I have some older coworkers who went once or twice, but not since the early 90s and that's what their view of the city is. A lot of others at my office have never been and their idea about it is 100% shaped by the media. That's been by experience with other Americans who never went to Chicago. It's shaped by media, movies, tv, etc. You can't blame them though. Most people aren't interested in looking these things up themselves.
It's understandable if non-Americans are not as familiar with Chicago, but my experience with Americans is VASTLY different than yours. I've lived in NYC nearly all my life, and the vast majority of people I speak with on this topic (and it comes up a lot, since I've actually moved to Chicago from NYC) either love Chicago from their visits, or say "I've heard great things....XYZ" (or something along those lines", I actually don't think I've ever gotten anything near the ignorant/dumbass responses you seem to have gotten in your experiences....

I'm a VP of Sales at Oracle within our Retail Division and a part time real estate developer/investor in both Chicago and NYC, so interact with people in one of those two fields on a daily basis. Would be curious to know WHO you speak to who have those comments you hear.
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  #2485  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 8:13 PM
Halsted & Villagio Halsted & Villagio is offline
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Originally Posted by rgolch View Post
Again, too much emphasis on the belief that outside perceptions are an anchor on our success.

It does play a role, for sure. But it's not the main issue. If we're really of the belief that Amazon, Apple, Salesforce, and Google are our roads for success, then we truly are a second rate city. It'd certainly be great if we could grow our local tech presence. But I don't think a thriving tech scene is a panacea for city health. We have so many legacy problems that go beyond whether we're consider "one of the cool kids" cities in the country. Not that we can't multitask; but dealing with rampant corruption, massive debt, and crime in minority neighborhoods should take precedence over a rebranding campaign. If we get those in order, my feeling is that success will follow. And sends a message far better than marketing. Unfortunately, I think things are going to get worse before they get better.
This is actually what Marothisu points to as one of the areas where we are falling short -- perceptions. And I agree with him.

Sure, perception is not the only thing, but we have to wake up and realize that "perceptions" do matter. We have to do a better job of messaging. Corporations care about their perception so why shouldn't we care about our perception? Many corporations want to be associated with a city/region that is considered vibrant, cultured, progressive and even (for some) hip... not rural and dying.

In short, the mid-west is not sexy... and is even considered a dying area by some. Sure, some will overlook this but many will not. The fact is, the rural parts of the mid-west hold little in common with a city like Chicago... and in fact, could care less about Chicago. Some even resent Chicago. So why should Chicago keep trying to raise up a whole region (by increasing culture, making it more urban, etc.) when that whole region has no interest in rising up? They are perfectly content being rural, etc. And rightly so... be happy with who you are I say. Their vision for themselves should at all times be respected. But if their being how they are in not in alignment with the vision for Chicago then I say it is time to look at other options that include like-minded cities and areas -- the great lakes area.

Perceptions do matter and we have to start embracing that fact.
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  #2486  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 8:36 PM
moorhosj moorhosj is offline
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Originally Posted by Baronvonellis View Post
All cities in Italy I went to had Army guys with machine guns walking around the downtown. I felt safer knowing they were around.
I was at a Bears game last month and there were heavily armed security, visible outside the stadium. It did the exact opposite of make me feel safer, more like "what do they know about?". I felt the same thing when I lived in Guatemala City. Not really a feeling I'd like to adopt.

Edit: Wanted to add all the people talking about the negative the perception. Record tourism year-after-year would seem to disagree with the "poor marketing" or "negative perception" labels, although it's only one data point.
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  #2487  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 8:47 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Originally Posted by Investing In Chicago View Post
It's understandable if non-Americans are not as familiar with Chicago, but my experience with Americans is VASTLY different than yours. I've lived in NYC nearly all my life, and the vast majority of people I speak with on this topic (and it comes up a lot, since I've actually moved to Chicago from NYC) either love Chicago from their visits, or say "I've heard great things....XYZ" (or something along those lines", I actually don't think I've ever gotten anything near the ignorant/dumbass responses you seem to have gotten in your experiences....

I'm a VP of Sales at Oracle within our Retail Division and a part time real estate developer/investor in both Chicago and NYC, so interact with people in one of those two fields on a daily basis. Would be curious to know WHO you speak to who have those comments you hear.
Okay so the people you interact with in a daily basis from outside of Chicago have been to Chicago recently and are executives at companies and probably travel well. Congratulations. That's not a very good sample of America, no offense. And your title has absolutely zero to do with much of this. It's great the people you communicate with either aren't dumb in these regards or have been to Chicago at least once recently, but that's really not a good sample of the country. It's a small part of what should be part of an indicative sample.

The reality is that the average person on the coasts doesn't have Chicago on their list at all and never have, and they don't know shit about the city outside of sports and whatever is on the news.
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  #2488  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 10:02 PM
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Ok guys. Let's all agree Chicago can do better with marketing itself and perception.

I mean, we've all been through 16 different iterations of this discussion on this forum over the years. We don't need to go through it again. More than anything, I find it sort of tiresome when Chicagoans show this weird, undeserved insecurity because we fall short of a city like New York..... You know... Arguably the most important city on the planet....

Chicago is very much recognized as an important and great city. No need to doubt it.
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  #2489  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 10:33 PM
bnk bnk is offline
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The dumb ass media putting shit out there like this daily its tough improve the image. Fcking Yahoo nuz.






https://news.yahoo.com/daily-digit-b...133051504.html


Daily Digit: Believe it or not, Chicago is not the murder capital of the U.S.









Nicholas Ascanio

Yahoo News Video•December 18, 2018




Daily Digit is the story behind the numbers that make our world work.

Today we’re looking at the so-called murder capital of the U.S.

With 653 murders reported in 2017, it’s no secret that Chicago is a violent city. But when adjusting for its large population, Chicago has fewer deaths per capita than many other cities. St. Louis has had the nation’s highest murder rate for the past four years, followed by Baltimore, Detroit, New Orleans and Baton Rouge. While the St. Louis murder rate has been the highest per capita, Chicago’s murder totals have been the nation’s highest since 2012. Fortunately, that total has been on the decrease since 2016.






Meanwhile this is what you also get when you google Chicago





Kim Kardashian Sparkles in a Completely Sheer and Sexy Dress

The Keeping Up With the Kardashians star wasn't afraid to show a little skin.

Khloe Kardashian Reacts To Chicago Not Being Kim Kardashian's Baby Rumors | Hollywoodlife

Khloe Kardashian defends Kim Kardashian and Chicago West on Instagram. Kylie Jenner flexes her expensive holiday decor. Plus - Black Chyna's lawyer claps ...


video_youtube
HollywoodLife
• 2 hours ago

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  #2490  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2018, 11:23 PM
Baronvonellis Baronvonellis is offline
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Originally Posted by killaviews View Post
I understand the marketing argument. Messaging could definitely be improved.

We can say we have the talent and environment that Google or Amazon want and need, but as a city, I don’t think we are showing it and proving it. Here’s the trend I see – behemoths follow behemoths. Where is Chicago’s tech behemoth?

There seems to be a successful trend for the city in the consumer packaged goods industry (Kraft, Hillshire, Conagra, Beam, MillerCoors, Constellation Brands, Ferrero, Pillsbury, Mead Johnson). There are tech and tech adjacent companies, but there is not an office with 5,000 or 10,000 or 25,000 that screams “we are a top tech talent company”. I’m not saying the trend is rationale. I guess a company could view it as X city has proved they have enough tech talent because Y company exist.

It takes more than boosterism from elected officials. If we want to be in the conversation, the companies we have here need to be the voice. Every company is somewhat of a “tech” company these days. I think it’s huge that Walgreens is moving all of its tech employees downtown. Now Walgreens need to tell tech success story. Hopefully it will. For us to win in the competition of superstar cities, we need some superstar companies. And it seems like we’re going to have to work with what we got for now.
Chicago used to have a tech behemoth Motorola. Unfortunately, it imploded 10 years ago due to inept management. They used to be hot stuff like Google is today. I worked there from 2006-2009 at the time management kept saying smartphones with touchscreens was just a fad, and blackberry type phones were the future, d'oh! They had no vision.
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  #2491  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 1:08 AM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Didn't Milwaukee's mayor try to popularize the "Fresh Coast" moniker? I kind of like it. Or maybe "Central Coast."
How about "1/5th of all fresh water and the most fertile land on earth coast"?

Seriously though, the Midwest doesn't need to change it's name, it needs to own it. If someone is using your name as a dirty word then you own that insult and make it a source of pride. The way the Midwest improves it's reputation is by delivering the goods. The region, despite recovering from catastrophic industrial collapse, is on an upward trajectory. Just because some of the larger metros still suffer from blight, smaller miderwestern states and cities do as well or better than the rest of the country by most stats that matter (GDP growth, unemployment, etc). As I constantly mention, Iowa's economic statistics are among the best in the US and even, by some measures, the world. Iowa isn't a sexy brand name, but it's delivering the goods and eventually it will become know for success if it keeps up it's run.
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  #2492  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 2:27 AM
chicubs111 chicubs111 is offline
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Originally Posted by rgolch View Post
Ok guys. Let's all agree Chicago can do better with marketing itself and perception.

I mean, we've all been through 16 different iterations of this discussion on this forum over the years. We don't need to go through it again. More than anything, I find it sort of tiresome when Chicagoans show this weird, undeserved insecurity because we fall short of a city like New York..... You know... Arguably the most important city on the planet....

Chicago is very much recognized as an important and great city. No need to doubt it.
I don't think anyone doubts Chicago is a great or important city...I think Chicagoans have extremely high expectations for the city (which is good).. we all deep down believe Chicago has what it takes to become the most or one of the most important cities on the planet at some point (decades possible centuries down the road)...kind of everyone dream but not completely unheard of...
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  #2493  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 5:02 AM
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Things are more nuanced than just how big you are. Seattle's success in this space goes back to the 80s with Microsoft and Nintendo, which then attracted other companies and formed others as time went on. Austin goes back to the 80s with companies like Dell and then later just attracted expansions. Austin is good but also overrated in terms of things like startups - guess it depends on what you want. DC has tons of government contractors who started their own things too. LA has been big on video game development since the late 80s or early 90s. Boston goes back to bio medical.

You should think beyond size and what should be. That's really not how it works no matter how much everyone wants to believe it. I think Chicago and midwest in general has a lot more talent (which is very hard to measure) than most people realize (you need to understand just how many people in Silicon Valley are from the midwest - it's not a small number at all). I think the issue with Chicago is more marketing - it's been the problem for a long time. Chicago's marketing sucks and it's only recently that it's attracted some of these fairly major expansions. You can't compare it to Seattle, Austin, etc - they've been getting this stuff since the 80s and 90s. NYC has done a good job of playing catchup and that's basically just in the last decade only, but NYC has excellent marketing. Most cities are playing catchup as these other places have had a few decades head start on a lot of people and have kept it going.

Again, most people just assume Chicago is flyover country, there's nothing there, and/or it's not nice. It's about marketing. I can't tell you how many times I've met people visiting who have the same reaction of "WHO KNEW!?" or just showing people here at my office in NYC street view of Chicago. They're always like "I just assumed there was nothing there and it wasn't nice." That actually happened today when talking to someone and I told her I moved to NYC 2 years ago from Chicago. She said "wow that must have been a big change" - She's never been to Chicago and I told her no, because Chicago is not hugely different as far as lifestyle goes from NYC (at least my lifestyle). Showed her some coastline pic of Chicago and she said "nice - is that Florida?" and when I said it was Chicago she just said "wtf?" - showed her more streetviews "Wow, I never knew Chicago was this nice..." It's all about marketing and sometimes this trickles down to companies who should be doing their homework better than normal people like you and me, but they don't always.

The 2 things holding Chicago back is basically how everyone thinks it's -20 degrees in the winter and reports of crime on the news. People in various parts of the coasts kind of have a self importance and think there's nothing worth visiting outside of that. Which is funny because the same people claim to be cultured and knowledgeable, but yet don't know shit beyond a few places in the US. Some others are those from the midwest who grew up in small towns, who basically write off everything midwest including Chicago (even though they don't know about it in reality because they grew up in Iowa never having actually visited Chicago) and want to act cool for their "cultured" coastal peers, so they trash talk everything and say there's nothing worth going to in the midwest. So they assume Chicago too. Unfortunately these types of people are sometimes running the companies you want expansions from.
All good points - I'll end my pity party for now.
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  #2494  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 5:24 AM
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Originally Posted by rgolch View Post
More than anything, I find it sort of tiresome when Chicagoans show this weird, undeserved insecurity because we fall short of a city like New York.....
x8 million billion trillion.





Perhaps chicago needs to rebrand itself as what it really is:



via Imgflip Meme Generator




Chicago is a great city, I love it dearly, but it's inhabited by some of the most insufferably insecure and whiny folks you'll ever meet.
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  #2495  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 2:32 PM
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Would this spinoff land on the Fortune 500? They don’t say in this article. If so, Chicago will soon be gaining one:

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/heal...alth-care-unit

Edit: number 500 on this year’s list brought in $5.4 billion in revenue.

GE Healthcare is around $18 billion. So the answer is yes
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  #2496  
Old Posted Dec 19, 2018, 4:57 PM
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^ Nice. Also:


Sprout Social raises $40.5 million, one of the quiet stars of Chicago tech could be lining up for an IPO.

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/john...es-405-million
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  #2497  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 2:43 AM
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How about "1/5th of all fresh water and the most fertile land on earth coast"?
Our location, in the end, is the number 1 marketing tool we have. This idea will become crucially important in the future. I know this is really unethical, but what if Chicago (and the Midwest / Great Lakes) in general marketed in areas hit by "natural" (they're not that natural anymore) disasters. Seems like a wasted opportunity to not convince some people to move to a place without forest fires, hurricanes, and a reliable long-lasting source of fresh water.
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  #2498  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 4:22 AM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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I don't think it's unethical to tell someone whose city has been singed reapeatedely by wildfires "hey maybe you'd like to live somewhere with regular precipitation and an ecosystem that isn't literally evolved for frequent burns?" Or " hey maybe if you don't like to have your house flooded by hurricanes 3 times in 5 years you should move somewhere 1000 miles from the hurricanes"...
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  #2499  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 4:27 AM
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I wonder if Chicago should try to market itself to seniors as a place you can get around without a car. Probably need to finish making the L actually accessible though...
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  #2500  
Old Posted Dec 20, 2018, 7:08 AM
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^ That reminds me of Wisconsin's (Scott Walker's WEDC) campaign to poach Chicagoans last year, where they tried to throw shade on the CTA and pretty much everyone in the city clapped back.

I mean seriously, it's a major advantage and not one that often comes up when outsiders discuss Chicago.

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Originally Posted by rgolch View Post
Not that we can't multitask; but dealing with rampant corruption, massive debt, and crime in minority neighborhoods should take precedence over a rebranding campaign. If we get those in order, my feeling is that success will follow. And sends a message far better than marketing. Unfortunately, I think things are going to get worse before they get better.
How do you tackle those issues with extremely limited resources? If you raise taxes without luring more jobs in or creating a growth narrative, then you're just asking Texas, Georgia, and Indiana to poach our residents and businesses. A rising tide floats all boats, especially in Chicago where we have ample land to add housing and ample unused capacity on our transit system so we can make sure growth isn't zero-sum. At least if you invest in growth and are successful, you can take some of the returns and invest in the community. I love the Neighborhood Opportunity Fund.

Also not clear that our crime issue is because we have more (or more violent) criminals than NY, LA, etc and not just because our criminals have laughably easy access to guns from Indiana. That's not a problem Chicago can solve on its own. For corruption, the best remedy is a healthy economy. Have you seen failing cities like Gary or (for awhile) Detroit? When resources are scarce, the folks with power will use that power to enrich their friends at the expense of everyone else. As for the debt problem, good luck filling that hole with declining tax revenues from a sagging economy.

Our city and state leaders have to walk and chew gum. They can't stop chasing factories and corporate expansions just because the city has other pressing issues.
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