Denver! The Perth of America

[pdxtex]

Is Denver the most remote big city of the lower 48? Its got nothing above it, SLC and Albuquerque are 400 miles away and Kansas City is 500 miles east. I used to think Portland was remote but I think Denver might be America's truly land locked, island city. Ive lived in Denver but it felt more connected to the American zeitgeist than the PNW. Not sure why.

[Steely Dan]

According the exercise performed in this thread:

UAs >200K within 200 (driving) miles of your city.

Minneapolis appears to be the largest UA in the lower 48 that doesn't have any other UAs over 200K within a 200 mile driving distance of it.

Denver has Colorado Springs and Fort Collins in relatively close proximity.

[mhays]

Perth is on a whole 'nother scale. It's 1,300 miles from Adelaide, or more like 1,500 by road. It would be like if San Diego was the only city west of Houston.

[jbermingham123]

Anchorage is the Perth of America

Denver is the Adelaide, at best


Closest city of over 100k to Anchorage is Vancouver BC, and Vancouver is closer to Mexico than it is to Anchorage

(edit, just saw you specified lower 48)

[ChiSoxRox]

Originally Posted by mhays

It would be like if San Diego was the only city west of Houston.

Go back to the frontier era and San Francisco might as well have been on the Moon.

In the 1870 Census, San Francisco is already #10 (and Sacramento is #89). The next westernmost city in the top 100 (15k cutoff)? Omaha, Nebraska!

Denver appears in 1880 and then Seattle/Portland/LA in 1890 to at least give SF some company. But still, for a full lifetime (1850 to 1920), San Francisco is by far the urban center of over half the continent.

[Cirrus]

Denver is pretty isolated. Colorado Springs and the other cities along the Front Range are really just satellites. Beyond that anywhere you go you have to fly. And once you're in flying range, really what's the difference? It was a thing I really didn't like about living there.

Minneapolis you can drive to Milwaukee or Chicago. It doesn't have the satellites (except St Paul!) but it's a lot closer to other actual big cities.

On this subject, though, Honolulu is worth bringing up. Not only is it a lot more isolated than Denver or even Anchorage, but it's more isolated even than Perth. It's smaller than Perth but at this point, with a metro area right about 1 million, I don't think anybody can reasonably deny that Honolulu is a major city.

[pdxtex]

^^^^^Hawaii blows my mind in general. Its like America! But you know, 3000 miles from America in the middle of a sharky sea. Powered by tourism and colonial spite.

[Tom In Chicago]

The greater Southland metro area of Los Angeles/San Diego/Tijuana seems like the most remote place in the contiguous United States. . . but that's just my opinion. . .

. . .

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

On this subject, though, Honolulu is worth bringing up. Not only is it a lot more isolated than Denver or even Anchorage, but it's more isolated even than Perth. It's smaller than Perth but at this point, with a metro area right about 1 million, I don't think anybody can reasonably deny that Honolulu is a major city.

I've brought this up before on another thread some time ago, but Honolulu is the most isolated city of its size. Metro Honolulu is about a million people as of the 2020 Census, and the closest big city to it is San Francisco, which is 2,397 miles (3,858 km) away. More isolated than Perth for sure.

I assume Hawaii is the largest most isolated cluster of people anywhere in the world.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by Tom In Chicago

The greater Southland metro area of Los Angeles/San Diego/Tijuana seems like the most remote place in the contiguous United States. . . but that's just my opinion. . .

. . .

It does feel that way when you fly back from the east, thats for sure. Especially at night. Hell, just leaving Illinois/Missouri (in the air) things look sparse, fast.

[Buckeye Native 001]

I never felt isolated from the rest of the country living in Southern California but that's because a) there's about 18 million folks in the metro and b) San Diego, The Bay Area, Phoenix and Las Vegas are all within a couple hours drive.

As someone living in Arizona who travels back to Ohio at least once or twice a year, I sometimes wonder theoretically if living in Denver would make me feel any closer since its only a two hour plane ride to Cincinnati and Columbus as opposed to a three to four hour plane ride from Phoenix.

[dave8721]

Being in Miami at the end of a long peninsula can feel isolating. Orlando is only 3 to 3.5 hours away and Tampa is 4 hours but after that it is nothing for a while. I think most people don't realize how looong the peninsula is. The next major city after Orlando is Atlanta (not counting Jacksonville and its distinctive skyline). Atlanta is closer to Chicago than it is to Miami. To get out of the state in any direction is pretty much a full days drive from Miami.

[Innsertnamehere]

Here's a question - what's the least isolated city?

I've always thought about living in Toronto / southern Ontario how I can drive to probably 1/2 of Canada / the US by population in an 8-10-hour drive. Long Weekend getaways by car can include Montreal, Chicago, Boston, Philadelphia, New York, Washington, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Detroit, Buffalo, Columbus, Indianapolis, Ottawa, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Richmond, Louisville, Milwaukee, Grand Rapids, etc., etc., etc.

Going a bit further south probably gives you a bit more centrality in this way. Cleveland, and really Akron, may hit it best, by adding a lot more southern destinations into the 10-hr drive radius with Charlotte, Nashville, Raleigh, Atlanta (barely), Norfolk, Myrtle Beach, St Louis, etc. added and only really losing Portland ME and Quebec City.

Growing or shrinking the radius definitely changes things too. I would say NYC is best for a 3-hour drive radius probably, for example.. What about 5 hour radius? 12 hour? 20 hour?

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by dave8721

Atlanta is closer to Chicago than it is to Miami.

I know that's true.

I've even mapped it myself.

But it still "feels" like it shouldn't be true.


That Florida peninsula is no joke.

And plus, it makes it look like our country is pissing on Cuba!
[/Gallagher]

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Here's a question - what's the least isolated city?

I've always thought about living in Toronto / southern Ontario how I can drive to probably 1/2 of Canada / the US by population in an 8-10-hour drive. Long Weekend getaways by car can include Montreal, Chicago, Boston, Philadelphia, New York, Washington, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Detroit, Buffalo, Columbus, Indianapolis, Ottawa, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Richmond, Louisville, Milwaukee, Grand Rapids, etc., etc., etc.

Going a bit further south probably gives you a bit more centrality in this way. Cleveland, and really Akron, may hit it best, by adding a lot more southern destinations into the 10-hr drive radius with Charlotte, Nashville, Raleigh, Atlanta (barely), Norfolk, Myrtle Beach, St Louis, etc. added and only really losing Portland ME and Quebec City.

Growing or shrinking the radius definitely changes things too. I would say NYC is best for a 3-hour drive radius probably, for example.. What about 5 hour radius? 12 hour? 20 hour?

Cleveland, according to the count I did about a year ago:

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Limited to the 37 metros in the US and Canada with populations of 2 million or more.

Count of +2 million metros within roughly 300 miles by city:

1. Cleveland 9
2. Chicago 7
3. Cincinnati 7
4. Detroit 7
5. Indianapolis 7
6. Pittsburgh 7
7. Columbus 6
8. Baltimore 5
9. Philadelphia 5
10. Washington 5
11. Austin 4
12. Dallas 4
13. Houston 4
14. New York 4
15. San Antonio 4
16. St. Louis 4
17. Boston 3
18. Las Vegas 3
19. San Diego 3
20. Toronto 3
21. Atlanta 2
22. Los Angeles 2
23. Miami 2
24. Montreal 2
25. Orlando 2
26. Phoenix 2
27. Portland 2
28. Seattle 2
29. Tampa 2
30. Vancouver 2
31. Charlotte 1
32. Kansas City 1
33. Nashville 1
34. Sacramento 1
35. San Francisco 1
36. Denver 0
37. Minneapolis 0

Average number of cities within roughly 300 miles by region:

1. Midwest 4.6
2. Northeast 4.5
3. Southwest 3.5
4. South 3.5
5. West 2.1
6. Canada 1.3

Count of +2 million metros within roughly 200 miles by city:

1. Pittsburgh 5
2. Columbus 5
3. Detroit 4
4. New York 4
5. Cleveland 3
6. Indianapolis 3
7. Washington 3
8. Philadelphia 3
9. Baltimore 3
10. Austin 3
11. Cincinnati 2
12. Houston 2
13. San Antonio 2
14. Toronto 2
15. Miami 2
16. Seattle 2
17. Tampa 2
18. Orlando 2
19. Chicago 1
20. Dallas 1
21. Boston 1
22. San Diego 1
23. Los Angeles 1
24. Portland 1
25. Vancouver 1
26. San Francisco 1
27. Sacramento 1
28. St. Louis 0
29. Las Vegas 0
30. Atlanta 0
31. Phoenix 0
32. Montreal 0
33. Charlotte 0
34. Kansas City 0
35. Nashville 0
36. Minneapolis 0
37. Denver 0

Average number of cities within roughly 200 miles by region:

1. Southwest 2.5
2. Northeast 2.3
3. Midwest 2.3
4. South 1.3
5. West 0.9
6. Canada 0.0

Count of +2 million metros within roughly 100 miles by city:

1. Baltimore 2
2. Cincinnati 2
3. Philadelphia 2
4. Austin 1
5. Cleveland 1
6. Columbus 1
7. Detroit 1
8. Indianapolis 1
9. New York 1
10. Orlando 1
11. Sacramento 1
12. San Antonio 1
13. San Francisco 1
14. Tampa 1
15. Washington 1
16. Atlanta 0
17. Boston 0
18. Charlotte 0
19. Chicago 0
20. Dallas 0
21. Denver 0
22. Houston 0
23. Kansas City 0
24. Las Vegas 0
25. Los Angeles 0
26. Miami 0
27. Minneapolis 0
28. Montreal 0
29. Nashville 0
30. Phoenix 0
31. Pittsburgh 0
32. Portland 0
33. San Diego 0
34. Seattle 0
35. St. Louis 0
36. Toronto 0
37. Vancouver 0

Average number of cities within roughly 100 miles by region:

1. Northeast 1.0
2. Midwest 0.7
3. Southwest 0.5
4. South 0.3
5. West 0.2
6. Canada 0.0

Roughly measured from city center to center and counted cities that fell within a few miles of the cutoff (less than 10). Northeast includes traditional Northeast corridor cities plus Pittsburgh. Southwest only includes Texas, as those were the only cities in the region large enough to make the threshold. All other designations are self-explanatory.

Observations: The Midwest should really have MUCH better inter-city rail. It is the most well spaced region of the country for a rail network. Texas also makes a lot of sense for inter-city rail.

ETA: I did not consider Riverside-San Bernadino-Ontario as a separate "city".

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...00&postcount=1

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by dave8721

Being in Miami at the end of a long peninsula can feel isolating. Orlando is only 3 to 3.5 hours away and Tampa is 4 hours but after that it is nothing for a while. I think most people don't realize how looong the peninsula is. The next major city after Orlando is Atlanta (not counting Jacksonville and its distinctive skyline). Atlanta is closer to Chicago than it is to Miami. To get out of the state in any direction is pretty much a full days drive from Miami.

On the several road trips my family took from Detroit to Orlando when I was a kid, Atlanta (or north Georgia) was usually where we spent the night on the way down and back.

[pdxtex]

Whoa that was a neat list. Yeah living in Michigan was fun. You could drive to Toronto or Chicago in 4 hours. I did that alot. During Covid, I thought about proximity alot. I didn't drive out of state once so Portland felt extra isolated.

[badrunner]

Originally Posted by pdxtex

^^^^^Hawaii blows my mind in general. Its like America! But you know, 3000 miles from America in the middle of a sharky sea. Powered by tourism and colonial spite.

99% of the world's bullshit happens on one side of the planet.

[pdxtex]

Sh!t rolls downhill. :/

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by badrunner

99% of the world's bullshit happens on one side of the planet.

Probably 100%. Do you think any bullshit ever actually happens in those islands? Other than maybe bullshit brought from the other side...