[Halifax] Permanent Wanderers Grounds Stadium | ? m | ? fl | Proposed

[q12]

The Halifax Wanderers are in the early stages of pitching a new pitch. The professional soccer club is hoping to get a permanent stadium, saying they've outgrown the existing pop-up facility. Their estimated cost is just a fraction of the formerly proposed CFL football stadium, and in this case, there's an established team ready to fill seats.

HFX Wanderers hope to score permanent outdoor stadium in heart of Halifax

By Alex Cooke Global News
Posted May 28, 2022 6:00 am
Updated May 28, 2022 9:00 am

The HFX Wanderers are in the early stages of pitching a permanent outdoor stadium, saying the soccer team has outgrown the existing pop-up facility at the Wanderers Grounds.

“I think we’ve done the best with what we have,” Derek Martin, president and founder of the HFX Wanderers Football Club, told Global News in an interview.

“It was always our intent to use this as a proof-of-concept, to show the public that this was, in my opinion, the best location for an outdoor sports and entertainment venue in Halifax.

“And I think our success to date has certainly proven that.”

As it stands, the current site in the heart of Halifax has a capacity of about 6,500. During a recent game against the Toronto FC, fans were “filling every nook and cranny,” Martin said.

Typically, games at the Wanderers Grounds average about 6,000 people in attendance. Martin said it would be “viable” for the proposed permanent stadium to seat up to 10,000.

It would also include better infrastructure to better serve the fans, he said.

“You know, getting rid of portable toilets, no running water, inability to serve food,” said Martin.

“It’s at the stage now where I think we’ve proven that (the location) works and we’d like to see something a little bit better for our fans and for the citizens of Halifax to enjoy.”

Martin said the venue could also host rugby tournaments – “Rugby and soccer work really well together because they both prefer to play on natural grass, they don’t damage the grass in the way that American football would” – and may even set the stage to bring a professional women’s soccer team to the city.

“That’s something that we think would be a great fit with a new venue,” he said.

Another stadium pitch

This isn’t the first time a stadium has been proposed in Halifax. Pre-pandemic, Schooner Sports and Entertainment hoped to land a CFL franchise in the Halifax area with a proposed $110-million stadium.

While Halifax Regional Council voted in 2019 to provide $20 million to help build it, councillors decided in 2021 to discontinue work on the project indefinitely due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

In March, with the announcement of Touchdown Atlantic coming to Nova Scotia this summer, CFL commissioner Randy Ambrosie said he is still very committed to expanding the league to the Maritimes, and they were “quietly working behind the scenes” to make it happen. There have been no updates since then.

The CFL stadium was a controversial proposal, due in part to its cost, as well as its proposed location in the Shannon Park area of Dartmouth, where bars and restaurants are lacking and access to public transit is less reliable.

But Martin said the proposed stadium at the Wanderers Grounds is different. The estimated cost would be $15 million to $20 million — a fraction of the proposed price tag on the CFL stadium.

Read more here:
https://globalnews.ca/news/8875419/h...posal-halifax/

I was at the game Tuesday where Halifax played Toronto FC. The atmosphere was great. I think the time has come to rebuild a permanent stadium on the Wanderers Grounds. HFX Wanderers have done great work here to make this site as successful as the Scotiabank Centre in Downtown.

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[RyNyeScienceGuy]

With how much Halifax is willing to spend on sports arenas/stadiums, this is probably the best we can hope for: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRV_PNK_Stadium

[atbw]

I would be much more on-board with HRM spending the money to put a stadium here than putting a football stadium in Shanon Park. Like the article says, its got a proven fan base in a sport that is growing in popularity in Canada. Men's national team made the World Cup, Women's team took gold at the Olympics.

[Keith P.]

Just imagine the outcry from the likes of Peggy Cameron, Martyn Williams, Bev Miller, Alan Ruffman et al, otherwise known as The Friends of the Halifax Common a.k.a. The Usual Suspects if this was proposed.

[Haliguy]

I really hope this happens! This isn't build it and they will come scenario. The Wanderers have been a proven success. I think city should seriously consider building permanent venue here.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Just imagine the outcry from the likes of Peggy Cameron, Martyn Williams, Bev Miller, Alan Ruffman et al, otherwise known as The Friends of the Halifax Common a.k.a. The Usual Suspects if this was proposed.

I wonder how much traction such complaints will get when this has been operating here for years with hugely more people enjoying this area now than they did before it was used for this purpose.

I still think this is a better stadium site than Shannon Park. Maybe that new Summer Street parkade is even useful for stadium visitors. There are lots of things to do before and after the games and people can walk to their hotels or to transit.

[kzt79]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Just imagine the outcry from the likes of Peggy Cameron, Martyn Williams, Bev Miller, Alan Ruffman et al, otherwise known as The Friends of the Halifax Common a.k.a. The Usual Suspects if this was proposed.

Although I am generally against spending city money on any sort of stadium (they tend to be massive losers over time), I do think the aggravation of the "usual suspects" might make it worthwhile in this instance

[someone123]

Originally Posted by kzt79

Although I am generally against spending city money on any sort of stadium (they tend to be massive losers over time), I do think the aggravation of the "usual suspects" might make it worthwhile in this instance

I don't disagree but aren't the Public Gardens or library massive money losers as well? Maybe all the hockey rinks and public pools too? The city has to decide what the public amenity value is and if the cost is worth it. $15-20M is pretty minor in the scheme of HRM projects these days. Not sure if that's an updated number or what the scope is but I suspect the $110M CFL stadium figure is outdated.

[kzt79]

Originally Posted by someone123

I don't disagree but aren't the Public Gardens or library massive money losers as well? Maybe all the hockey rinks and public pools too? The city has to decide what the public amenity value is and if the cost is worth it. $15-20M is pretty minor in the scheme of HRM projects these days. Not sure if that's an updated number or what the scope is but I suspect the $110M CFL stadium figure is outdated.

Yes, I'm still picturing the scheme by the CFL group to clean us out. Those monsters are proven huge losers over time (tens to hundreds of millions), yet cities all over North America rush to repeat the same mistakes. Much larger and wealthier cities than Halifax have been pillaged by those. There's no way it would be remotely successful by any measure (other than from the perspective of the owners and maybe ardent fans). In terms of benefit versus cost to the average citizen they are horrible, far worse than the other examples you list.

A modest facility with multiple uses that benefits a larger portion of the populace at much lower cost might be reasonable - especially if it inflames the Peggy Cameron types, I'm not even joking. Yes it's petty but I am so tired of them complaining and blocking everything (or trying to do so) for so many years, that their opposition will automatically increase my support of any given project. For whatever that's worth!

[Hali87]

I think a 10,000-seat stadium there would be much less controversial now than if it had been proposed "from scratch". 10,000 seats is only about 1.5x the capacity of what's already there, and this part of the Commons would only ever be used for soccer and related sports regardless of whether or not seating capacity is expanded - it's not going to revert back to pasture land or get turned into an orchard even if seating is capped at 6000.

Maybe they could spruce up the stables and lawn bowling area as a peace offering to the olde-schoolers.

[Jor D]

Originally Posted by Hali87

Maybe they could spruce up the stables and lawn bowling area as a peace offering to the olde-schoolers.

the lawn bowling could move to the st. pat high school site. and the stables need to move to hamonds plain. my opinion sorry. the wanders ground needs to be halifax's stadium without question with that part of sackville street closed to cars....food trucks and pedestrians only

[Dartguard]

Originally Posted by Jor D

the lawn bowling could move to the st. pat high school site. and the stables need to move to hamonds plain. my opinion sorry. the wanders ground needs to be halifax's stadium without question with that part of sackville street closed to cars....food trucks and pedestrians only

Ah good luck with trying to move the stables. My niece trains there and that has educated my Brother and his wife on just how many horse lovers there are in Nova Scotia. Its the sport of Kings but those stables are the playground of Halifax Princess's. They learn all aspects of equestrian arts including cleaning up after them .

[OldDartmouthMark]

I'm not against the city investing to turn it into a permanent stadium but converting common lands to private-only use does give me pause.

In other words, my impression of common lands is that they should be available for anybody to use. If they are converted into a stadium to be used by a profit-based private entity requiring the public to pay to enter, it seems a line is being crossed that goes against the concept of them being 'commons'.

My opinion would lighten if other not-for-profit entities, such as schools or other amateur leagues, were allowed to use the facilities for their games, which would provide more public benefit, IMHO.

Non-pragmatic reasons, such as pissing off "friends of" organizations seem a little silly, though I appreciate the humour.

I would like to see the space elevated to a higher use level than it was previously, but I would also like it to be considered carefully when public land and tax money are being used for the purpose. For example, I'm curious as to the investment ratio between the football club and the city for expenses that specifically benefit the professional-league uses. It's not uncommon in a lease situation for the lessee to pay for modifications of the property being leased that benefit the lessee in the use of such property, and I would expect this to be the case here.

Also, I would like to see more data on attendance longer-term, to fret out whether current attendance rates are simply a reaction to "freedom" from pandemic restrictions easing up (and perhaps some fans will eventually find other things to do with their time) or if popularity of attending these games continues (or increases). If the demand continues, then it would be a stronger case to green-light a permanent stadium with higher capacity, in my opinion.

As far as relocating the stables, I don't agree with this, as it has become a longstanding tradition for the area, and IMHO many people enjoy seeing the horses there, even if they don't personally use the facilities. Interest and demand still appears to be strong, even after all these years.

[someone123]

Presumably this facility would be owned and operated by the municipality and available for other users. The article refers to the Wanderers as a potential tenant.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by someone123

Presumably this facility would be owned and operated by the municipality and available for other users. The article refers to the Wanderers as a potential tenant.

Presumably, but the article states that this is being pitched by the Wanderers organization, so presumably they are shooting for a stadium that meets their needs first and foremost. In the article they specify what sports would be acceptable for their permanent field (rugby, and potentially professional women's soccer/football, but not American football), so it sounds like they would expect to have some control over its use.

[MonctonRad]

I am not against a small soccer specific stadium in this location (~10,000 seat), but I agree with other posters that they should leave the Junior Bengal Lancers alone.

In any event, the combined net worth of all the parents of these privileged young ladies would be enough to hire some very high powered legal expertise to prevent such a move from happening. The fight would be vicious!

[Jor D]

ok i too agree with than stables staying...but perhaps a NEW stables built at the pavement square north of garrison grounds. really? a parking lot? i cant beileve they put that there. sorry
anyways a 20000 capacity stadium on wanderers ground would be huge benefit for ALL haligonians and ALL nova scotians. just think.. pro soccer, CFL, etc etc in the heart of the city and downtown. ottawa did it right.

[Mr.Zero33]

Hopefully any stadium would include an outside track for track and field events and could also incorporate the Universities and their larger events.

[atbw]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Also, I would like to see more data on attendance longer-term, to fret out whether current attendance rates are simply a reaction to "freedom" from pandemic restrictions easing up (and perhaps some fans will eventually find other things to do with their time) or if popularity of attending these games continues (or increases). If the demand continues, then it would be a stronger case to green-light a permanent stadium with higher capacity, in my opinion.

I'm open to being corrected, but I think they had pretty good attendance prior to the 'end' of the pandemic.

2021 had them with the highest average attendance of any team in their league. May be that NS didn't have such high case loads through the year as other places, though: 6th in the standings, 1st in the stands

I couldn't find anything official, but their website says 'consistently selling out games' consistently selling out games

From my viewpoint there seems to be no shortage of excitement, such that I'm going to check out a game this weekend.

[Colin May]

A 5th rate team, I am feeling generous, which is nowhere as near as good as watching U-17 womens game in Clayton park. I have watched both teams and I can say the young women are well coached and very skilled and many will have a bright future. If you are male or female and are playing in a low skill league you will not have much of a chance in the pro leagues. It is a little over 5 years since I saw Alphonso Davies playing in Vancouver. His ability was obvious. In Europe pro teams start with kids age 5 and have teams in different age groups; keep and discard kids as they age - some are late bloomers and some are standouts at a young age. I remember watching Denis Law play in the 2nd Division when he was 16 and 100 lbs soaking wet - skinny,brave and unafraid of men much taller and heavier than him.