Queen's Park Politics

[SteelTown]

The 40th Ontario general election is scheduled for October 6, 2011.

Dalton McGuinty - Liberal - Incumbent Premier
Tim Hudak - Ontario PC
Andrea Horwath - New Democrat
Mike Schreiner - Green

107 seats in the 40th Legislative Assembly of Ontario
54 seats are needed for a majority

[Pimpmasterdac]

PCs & Hudak are gonna win a majority government!

Liberals & McGuinty are gonna get mopped up

NDP & Horwath are gonna pick up seats, depending on the anger towards McGuinty, possibly official opposition if they campaign well.

Election couldn't come soon enough!!!

[ForestryW]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

PCs & Hudak are gonna win a majority government!

Liberals & McGuinty are gonna get mopped up

NDP & Horwath are gonna pick up seats, depending on the anger towards McGuinty, possibly official opposition if they campaign well.

Election couldn't come soon enough!!!

I hope you're wrong.

As a student, I fear what will happen with Conservative majorities in both Ottawa and Toronto.

[Pimpmasterdac]

Originally Posted by van Hemessen

I hope you're wrong.

As a student, I fear what will happen with Conservative majorities in both Ottawa and Toronto.

Fiscal solvency and less social spending to start!

Honestly as a student Hemessen, we're in less need of social services. I just graduated and Hudak doesn't sound like he's going to gut OSAP or any post-secondary educational spending. Just cut a lot of the waste McGuinty and his gang have done the last 8 years.

[vid]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

Just cut a lot of the waste McGuinty and his gang have done the last 8 years.

Such as?

I thought the Northern Ontario Growth Plan was vague and contradictory. Then I heard Tim Hudak speak.

Honestly, I don't think anyone is worth voting for right now. I think we'll get a PC minority.

[Pimpmasterdac]

Originally Posted by vid

Such as?

e.Health, OLG, gold plated pensions for liberal appointees as far as scandals.

Health Premiums, eco-fees, HST, "green energy" act as far as additional costs.

Need any more?

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

Fiscal solvency...

ROFLMAO!!!

That's the best damn joke I've heard yet this year. Conservatives these days seem to be anything but fiscally conservative.

[Pimpmasterdac]

Originally Posted by Jamaican-Phoenix

Conservatives these days seem to be anything but fiscally conservative.

Oh Really?!

Since McGuinty running a ~$17 billion deficit despite all his idiotic tax increases is fiscally solvent and sensible.

Or Bob Rae Liberal/NDP turncoat who was running deficits ~$17 billion during his majestically term in Ontario. In his 5 years he doubled our provincial debt!

When Harris resigned Ontario had a $200 million surplus and Eves left with a $5.6 billion deficit, sure a deficit but better than any these Liberal or NDP jokers have been able to do!

[Blitz]

Hudak has already alienated himself from a good part of southwestern Ontario by making asinine comments threatening to shut down the province's green energy program that has provided lots of new decent jobs in the region.

The conservatives have been desperately pleading for the current mayor of Windsor to run for them but he officially declined today.

I see them doing well in eastern Ontario and parts of the GTA, probably not as well in the north or southwest.

[telyou]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

e.Health, OLG, gold plated pensions for liberal appointees as far as scandals.

Health Premiums, eco-fees, HST, "green energy" act as far as additional costs.

Need any more?

Ahahahahaaaa, you guys really don't understand what spending for the future means.
The green energy act is the future of Ontario and unfortunately Hudak may very well be the demise of Ontario.

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

When Harris resigned Ontario had a $200 million surplus and Eves left with a $5.6 billion deficit, sure a deficit but better than any these Liberal or NDP jokers have been able to do!

I didn't know Harris had to go through the worst recession in the history of Ontario since WW2.

[Dr Nevergold]

I would warn against taking anything seriously from someone named pimpmaster... LOL

On a more serious note, what exactly is this frustration with McGuinty? It is frustration with length of power, which every politician deals with. Everyone loves 'change' and loves a refresh in power. McGuinty's biggest problem is he has been in power 8 years, time that has passed, and he isn't a fresh face. After the disaster of Harris/Eves he was the freshest face and welcomed with open arms.

With that said, Hudak is a single-message candidate with no plans. All he has plans to do is cut, cut, cut. In fact, his entire campaign could be summed up in key dumbed-down phrases: "cut spending" and "cut taxes" just like a typical right winger. No plans, no innovation, no vision of where to take Ontario. The problem is that Hudak doesn't plan on offering any real tax cuts, it is just a fake carrot thrown to draw attention and votes. He supports the HST as a concept. The HST was tax simplification.

McGuinty has done a lot of good things for Ontario, but along with that comes some controversial moves like the HST. Fact is, Hudak and the Conservatives support the HST, there won't be change in that area, and that is the cornerstone of his campaign of "tax cuts, spending cuts" in which he sounds like a broken record.

McGuinty has an accomplished record: better health access, better education plans, a revolutionary clean energy program that is the envy of North America. Investments in transit in the cities, particularly with the funding for Transit City's Eglinton LRT in Toronto, and the jobs created from that at the plant up in Thunder Bay to build the new streetcars.

McGuinty has more to say than a dumb "tax cuts, spending cuts" platform. He has some results to brag about... If he can overcome the HST controversy (which is a joke, the only real increase anyone saw was on energy costs, but it came with tax cuts in other areas) then he'll be re-elected. If people just want a fresh face, and a repeat of Mike Harris, they have the choice of Hudak's dumb "tax cut, spending cut" message with no vision or leadership.

As far as the other parties involved, I think we all learned on May 2nd that a vote for the NDP in Ontario is a vote for a Conservative government in this province. If you want a Hudak government, then vote Horwath.

If you want a green energy program, if you want better hospitals and schools, better transit and roads, and all the things provinces are supposed to be involved in... Vote to keep the McGuinty government. He's done a good job at guiding the province through good and bad times.

[Pimpmasterdac]

Originally Posted by telyou

Ahahahahaaaa, you guys really don't understand what spending for the future means.
The green energy act is the future of Ontario and unfortunately Hudak may very well be the demise of Ontario.

2003: McGuinty "I won't lower your taxes but I won't raise them either"

If it were truly investing in the future I would agree. Some investments have been ok however the McGuinty Liberals have been text book tax and spend liberals in the worst sense. A $1 billion wasted in e.Heath, hundreds of millions lost by OLG, yet no one fired, no one gets punished, instead they get gold plated severance packages at our expense. The Liberals don't seem to understand that, the Ontario treasury is their money for them and their friends to piss away.

As well McGuinty has allowed the public service to become bloated in both size and pay scale. He refuses to fight for whats right for Ontario, but just caves into OPSEU and OSSTF and all these other unions demands rather than hold the line. It's only been in the last year or two since shit really hit the fan he's started to tighten the belt but were still in a ~$17 billion deficit.

Originally Posted by telyou

I didn't know Harris had to go through the worst recession in the history of Ontario since WW2.

Bob Rae used the same line during his abortion of a term in the early 1990's. Harris had to clean up the mess that Rae & Peterson had left in wake of their decade of rule and got our economy going again, created jobs, shrunk the size of government and balanced the books.

While not everything McGuinty's fault in recent years with the economic turn-down, he has continued to grow the size and spending of government when it's clearly unsustainable.

Ontario use to be the Cadillac province of Canada, we use to drive economic growth in Canada, now were dragging Canada down, our unemployment rate is above the national average and were even qualifying for equalization payments now! Thanks to Dalton & Co. with their big government, big spending ways.

October cannot come soon enough to vote these jokers out!

[Dr Nevergold]

^Harper wasted billions on G20 spending not related with the G20 (with a B) and people looked over it, particularly Ontarians who gave him a majority government. Why should ehealth and OLG matter to Ontarians on a provincial level? It isn't like Hudak really would change things, he supports the HST and that is what Ontarians are 'worried' about and what gives McGuinty the image of raising taxes (it was relatively tax neutral and came with other tax cuts).

Yea, ehealth was a screw up, but the concept is over, the program has been cancelled for years. The liberals did cut their losses and cancel that project when they realized how badly managed it was. As far as who was in charge of that, do you have proof that Sarah Kramer (the CEO of the ehealth program) is still in Liberal politics in Ontario? What is she doing today, exactly? What I saw is that McGuinty wanted to revolutionize health records and convert it to a modern database system, he handed the program over to who he thought would be good leaders, and they screwed the program up and wasted a billion $$$. So he cut the program and let them go. Nothing that exciting if you ask me... He has vision and leadership and tried to make a big accomplishment with the conversion of health records, and he failed.

The real jokers are the Hudak no-plans, tax cut spending cut hoax.

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac

2003: McGuinty "I won't lower your taxes but I won't raise them either"

If it were truly investing in the future I would agree. Some investments have been ok however the McGuinty Liberals have been text book tax and spend liberals in the worst sense. A $1 billion wasted in e.Heath, hundreds of millions lost by OLG, yet no one fired, no one gets punished, instead they get gold plated severance packages at our expense. The Liberals don't seem to understand that, the Ontario treasury is their money for them and their friends to piss away.

As well McGuinty has allowed the public service to become bloated in both size and pay scale. He refuses to fight for whats right for Ontario, but just caves into OPSEU and OSSTF and all these other unions demands rather than hold the line. It's only been in the last year or two since shit really hit the fan he's started to tighten the belt but were still in a ~$17 billion deficit.



Bob Rae used the same line during his abortion of a term in the early 1990's. Harris had to clean up the mess that Rae & Peterson had left in wake of their decade of rule and got our economy going again, created jobs, shrunk the size of government and balanced the books.

While not everything McGuinty's fault in recent years with the economic turn-down, he has continued to grow the size and spending of government when it's clearly unsustainable.

Ontario use to be the Cadillac province of Canada, we use to drive economic growth in Canada, now were dragging Canada down, our unemployment rate is above the national average and were even qualifying for equalization payments now! Thanks to Dalton & Co. with their big government, big spending ways.

October cannot come soon enough to vote these jokers out!

So, Mr. Pimp... You seem to be an emotional voter, not a results-oriented or issues voter. Your emotional desire to personally pay lower taxes is getting stroked by Hudak's relentless "tax cut, spending cut" mantra, and despite the fact that he says absolutely nothing more substantive than that, it is making your ego get bigger and bigger every time he says cut... Its the emotion you're running on. You also haven't checked to realize the entire conservative caucus supports the HST behind closed doors and out of the public eye, as it was a tax simplification issue to most Liberals and Conservatives (the HST politically enjoys near unanimous support out of the public eye).

The HST was also relatively neutral. It raised energy prices since the PST portion was applied on gas and energy, but it also cut taxes in other areas. Again, revenue neutral. But that "tax cut, spending cut" mantra just SOUNDS so delicious. I want a piece of the pie. MMMMMMMMMM

Got it. Now I understand why Hudak is polling well... Emotion and personal ego.

If Ontarians make the mistake they look like they are making with Hudak, then that carrot he throws you will have no calories. You'll see meaningless tax reductions and a gutting of Ontario's services just like the Harris years.

[Blitz]

Ontario use to be the Cadillac province of Canada, we use to drive economic growth in Canada, now were dragging Canada down, our unemployment rate is above the national average and were even qualifying for equalization payments now! Thanks to Dalton & Co. with their big government, big spending ways.

There are two main reasons Ontario is currently a have-not province: the collapse of the auto industry and the fact that other provinces are booming because they have oil (Alta, Sask, BC, Nfld). We can't blame McGuinty for it.

I think it's just that people are tired of McGuinty and want change but if that means a return to a Harris-type government, no thank you.

[Dr Nevergold]

^The 'change' factor is what it is all about, plus the fact that McGuinty's push for the HST. Between those two things, that will be the loss for the party if it loses this election. I'd like to see at least another Liberal government before the Tories ultimately take over again (it is bound to happen eventually). Ontario can't afford Hudak right now, it is in the middle of a huge green investment when the province desperately needs those kinds of jobs to replace jobs lost during the last recession. Ontario has made important investments into transit that it cannot cut back on.

There doesn't need to be another embarrassing hole dug on Eglinton Ave just for it to be filled back in, for example... Hudak is just not right for Ontario at this time and juncture. Tax cuts, spending cuts aren't what Ontario needs. Ontario needs innovation and investment.

[vid]

Originally Posted by Jamaican-Phoenix

ROFLMAO!!!

That's the best damn joke I've heard yet this year. Conservatives these days seem to be anything but fiscally conservative.

The Harris conservatives weren't fiscally conservative either, but they found a way to make it look like they were.

Originally Posted by Blitz

I see them doing well in eastern Ontario and parts of the GTA, probably not as well in the north or southwest.

The PC candidate in my riding is the former president of Lakehead University (and highest paid civil servant in NWO for five years in a row—over 350,000 taxpayer dollars a year!!) and he thinks Wi-Fi is evil.

The PC candidate in Thunder Bay—Superior North is a former RIM CEO who's only real vision is "an NHL team in Thunder Bay!!11!"

Yeah, "fiscal conservatism"! That said, the PCs will probably do better than the Liberals up here. They've delivered a lot of pork on the past few years, but it happened too late. The north will probably go NDP.

No parties are promising to give the north more decision making power over its regional economy so I don't see how any of them can really help us. The PCs have so far said that the Liberal's Northern Growth Plan is crap and will scrap it, but their equivalent plan for the north is equally vague.

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by vid

The north will probably go NDP.

And in Ontario, at both the provincial and federal level, a vote for the NDP is a proxy vote for Conservative government. So yea, I could see enough drain to the NDP and enough 'change' from more right leaning Liberals going to the Hudak tories to see him win. It'd be a horrible loss for Ontario for the province to step toward such a rightward direction after the progress provincial Liberals have made. I don't agree with everything the McGuinty Liberals have done, for example some of the nanny state laws are annoying (think speeding over 140km/h getting your car impounded)... But overall it has been good progress for Ontario. I'll take a few unnecessary nanny laws for the progress Ontario has seen.

I think the campaign Ontario Liberals should embrace is a difference outlining the fact that Hudak has nothing to offer but catch-phrases. "Tax cuts" and "Spending Cuts" is the only thing Hudak knows how to utter from his mouth. He offers no plans, his government doesn't oppose the HST nor will it repeal it, and the Ontario Liberals should make an issue out of it.

McGuinty needs to get his party's message out, and draw a line in the sand. Start repeating back for every "tax cut" statement from Hudak, ask him if he'll make a committment to undo the HST and go back to the GST/PST setup. Make the Tories answer the question, if they want to complain about taxes, do they plan on scrapping the HST.

So far the Ontario Liberals haven't drawn that line in the sand for voters... Is this election going to be about empty rhetoric from Hudak regarding tax cuts/spending cuts, or is it going to be about substance?

[vid]

Hudak has offered plans, they're just vague.

Ontario's NDP has governed before and could govern again if they run a good enough campaign. All it took for the Liberals to recapture their majority in 2007 was a silly comment from the PC leader at the time, and something could happen to the Liberals this time. It's their election to lose.

Of course, in Canada, it is always the incumbent's election to lose.

[Dr Nevergold]

I don't think this is the Liberals' election to lose, this election is up in the air because McGuinty has the drag of time against him. People like fresh faces, particularly swing voters that go wherever the wind blows them. McGuinty has never been particularly inspiring, he's just a leader. The Liberals have to make the case and draw lines in the sand, and make Hudak answer tough questions. Thus far I haven't seen them do so, although McGuinty is finally snapping out of it and realizing an election is barely 2 months away. Hudak on the other hand has been running a 24/7 campaign since last fall in 2010. I have heard his ads all over the radio here in Niagara region non-stop for a year preceding this election, with the mantra "tax cuts, spending cuts" about the only thing he can say.

Hudak is doing what right wing conservatives do best... Pander to fear and greed. He's screaming "tax cuts, spending cuts" every millisecond of every campaign stop and message, invoking the dislike of the HST. But Hudak has no plans to remove the HST... He is capitalizing on it without a proper response from the Liberals. The OLP should be running ads poking fun at Hudak, showing he has nothing to offer but "tax cuts, spending cuts" without actually reducing taxes or cutting anything. McGuinty needs to offer a challenge: make Hudak pledge he'll get rid of the HST if he becomes Premier. Ask the question over and over what he intends on replacing the HST with.

The only thing the HST did was raise prices of gas slightly and increase energy bills (which, if Canadians realize that it is still a fraction of what people in the states pay even with the higher HST price). Okay, so that is true... It also lowered taxes in key areas such as some income tax reductions, got rid of the PST/GST double taxation problem, among other issues...