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  #221  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2024, 3:00 AM
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Williamoforange Williamoforange is offline
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They posted the panels, not half bad design on a quick glance....It might actually be better then Rockcliffe, but will have to wait for density mapping & ROW widths.....though I'd rather see this on the Greenbelt research farm then way out in the boonies.

https://www.tewin.ca/news-events/
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  #222  
Old Posted Jun 22, 2024, 1:24 PM
Jay31 Jay31 is offline
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
What I'd really like to know is if this is an actual planned community or just several hundred sh*tty townhouses on curvy streets?
I assume this is because people who buy in the suburbs want to feel like they live in the suburbs - that is, streets that have very little traffic because the roads are so windy that the only reason you would drive there is because you live there. I assume this is valued more than walkability and being near transit hubs. Some developers put shortcut walking paths between properties to help, but not always....and it doesn't help the fact that most properties will not be close to transit. It's what people want though.

Of course, the further out you build to satisfy the demand for suburban living, the higher the infrastructure costs...and the more ongoing maintenance cost, which politically, we're not willing to make property owners eat. Thus, politicians keep giving what voters want, even though it's financially unsustainable, and the city's infrastructure rots from the inside outward.
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  #223  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 1:12 PM
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Tewin land project doesn't add up, and it's not just about cost
Bruce Deachman says Tewin is paying for city staff to work on its development proposal. That's odd — and raises questions beyond how taxpayer dollars are spent.

Bruce Deachman, Ottawa Citizen
Published Jun 24, 2024 • Last updated 3 hours ago • 4 minute read


The Tewin development consumed much of the discussion at city hall last Thursday, as a joint planning and environment committee accepted the city’s $2-billion Infrastructure Master Plan, which will govern how Ottawa manages drinking water, sewers and stormwater runoff in the coming decades.

And no wonder there was so much discussion. Tewin has never made economic sense for the taxpayer. Close to $590 million will be spent servicing the water needs of the development, a contentious 445-hectare satellite community to be built near Carlsbad Springs that was proposed by a partnership between the Algonquins of Ontario and Taggart Investments. It was approved and adopted into the city’s official plan by the last council in 2021.

Of that amount, just over half, or about $313 million, will come from Tewin, with another $97 million or so covered by development charges. The city could be on the hook for about $160 million, a big ask of taxpayers given that city staff, when it was initially looking at where urban expansion should take place, determined that the Tewin land was too far away from the urban area and didn’t score high enough to even warrant a thorough assessment. Before approving the city’s plan, the province also questioned the Tewin project, noting it didn’t appear to align with some of the city’s goals, including creating 15-minute communities and developing close to rapid transit.

Even the ameliorating notion that expanding the city’s boundaries and approving Tewin was an act of Indigenous reconciliation is questioned by other Algonquin Nations, who say that it wasn’t reconciliation and that they weren’t consulted.

Regardless, it’s shaping up to be too expensive a project, reconciliation or no, and the city should explore ways of expanding instead to some of the West Carleton/March lands that scored much higher on staff assessments and are closer to existing infrastructure.

Meanwhile, the nighttime clear-cutting of 70 hectares of trees by Tewin a year ago, which Taggart first defended as necessary to clean up after the derecho, then subsequently added it was allowed in order to enable farming on the property, was an unsavoury event, even though the city agreed it had the right to do it.

Another questionable aspect was revealed Thursday: Tewin is funding the salaries and benefits of three senior city staff members whose responsibilities are solely to work on the Tewin project.

According to a September 2022 memorandum of understanding between the city and Tewin, a community designer, transportation planner and infrastructure planner — all employees of the city — are paid for by Tewin. Additionally, the memorandum notes that with regard to the latter two positions, “If the City is unable to hire a new dedicated Senior FTE … the Tewin Landowners will fund an outside consultant to fulfil these responsibilities.”

Additionally, if parts of the work plans of the latter two positions require outside consultants, Tewin will fund those, too, and their contracts will be subject to Tewin’s approval.

This project smells like a fish market on a hot day.

Questioned Thursday by Knoxdale-Merivale Coun. Sean Devine, city staff said that such hiring was not common practice and they were unaware of any similar arrangements at the city. Further pressed by Devine, staff said that city management would be unable to reassign any of the three to different files if it wanted, making it easy to wonder if they really fit the definition of city employees.

I asked the city’s media office for an explanation, but none came by my deadline.

It’s possible there’s nothing untoward here. Perhaps Tewin just writes the cheques and the three employees go about their business unaware that it’s a developer, not taxpayers, footing their salaries. The optics, however, are terrible, and the perceived impropriety of having a developer pay the salaries of city employees working on their projects is a black mark against both Tewin and the city.

Meanwhile, Capital Coun. Shawn Menard proposed a motion to have staff determine what the Master Plan costs would be if Tewin were removed from the equation. The motion narrowly failed, but the 9-8 outcome suggests that not everyone is comfortable with the burden Tewin will add to taxpayers’ bills. (Conversely, you could argue it also shows a reluctance to re-open this can of worms.) Bear in mind, the cost figure is even before roads and transit to service the development are calculated and factored in.

The joint committee’s approval of the master plan isn’t a financial commitment on the part of the city, and, according to the legal counsel, there’s no financial risk if the city changes it. According to Kitchissippi Coun. Jeff Leiper, there remain off-ramps from the deal if councillors choose to take them.

They ought to at least consider doing so, as these and other costs come to light. For while I understand the reluctance to relitigate decisions made by previous councils, a point made Thursday by Stittsville Coun. Glen Gower, it’s equally the responsibility of elected officials to re-evaluate the city’s path as details and costs become clearer. Too many questions remain about Tewin to simply forge ahead.

bdeachman@postmedia.com

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...t-cost-opinion
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  #224  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 4:33 PM
stolenottawa stolenottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
[B][SIZE="4"]
Another questionable aspect was revealed Thursday: Tewin is funding the salaries and benefits of three senior city staff members whose responsibilities are solely to work on the Tewin project.

According to a September 2022 memorandum of understanding between the city and Tewin, a community designer, transportation planner and infrastructure planner — all employees of the city — are paid for by Tewin. Additionally, the memorandum notes that with regard to the latter two positions, “If the City is unable to hire a new dedicated Senior FTE … the Tewin Landowners will fund an outside consultant to fulfil these responsibilities.”

Additionally, if parts of the work plans of the latter two positions require outside consultants, Tewin will fund those, too, and their contracts will be subject to Tewin’s approval.
Ugh, WTF?
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  #225  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 5:25 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is online now
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Ugh, WTF?
Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
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  #226  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 5:29 PM
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Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
People keeping saying this but it's closer to downtown than Kanata is.
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  #227  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2024, 7:02 PM
stolenottawa stolenottawa is offline
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Originally Posted by YOWetal View Post
Not sure what's wrong with this. It looks bad but choosing this for inclusion was the shady decision after that of course there is a lot of work needed. It could be joint marketed as a Montreal suburb it's so far from Ottawa.
Don't disagree.

I'm guessing the people who will defend the optics of this on council will be the same ones who poopooed the optics of the developer ward donations (which also looked bad.)

I just finished reading The Power Broker and it's shocking how little things change, you see the same types of tactics used in Ottawa and Ontario that Robert Moses used in New York. It's clearly different but the patterns are there.

I suppose it's part of the cost of getting things done...but it always has to be done on the cheap here in Ottawa. Which ends up being expensive long term.
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  #228  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 3:06 PM
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From the presentation on their website:



https://www.tewin.ca/news-events/
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  #229  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 3:45 PM
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Great. 4 neighbourhoods that you have to drive (or bus) between to accomplish your 15-minute neighbourhood tasks.
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  #230  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 9:54 PM
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If we have a main street, what is the chance that we include BRT on that corridor or will it just be another car based plan with token transit. There will be zero chance that we include effective transit from Day 1.
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  #231  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 10:05 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is online now
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Great. 4 neighbourhoods that you have to drive (or bus) between to accomplish your 15-minute neighbourhood tasks.
Yeah there is going to be a bus betwenn nodes

We can barely build not suburban housing somewhere like Oblates land where still the ground based housing sells first. This is obviously a 2-3 car per family development.
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  #232  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2024, 10:36 PM
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We know that this whole idea will be blown away when neighbouring land is also developed and it just becomes another suburb and the original concept goes out the window. I am old enough to remember that Kanata had special design features when it was first developed, and has later became watered down with each subsequent phase. Just like Greenboro, which was never copied into other adjacent Hunt Club neighbourhoods. Everybody loved these special design features except subsequent developers who can make more money with cookie cutter traditional suburban designs focused on autos rather than people.
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  #233  
Old Posted Jul 5, 2024, 1:58 AM
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Ottawa Council meekly agrees to a spending plan for Tewin that doesn't make sense
Randall Denley says that by supporting big bucks for the Tewin area, councillors are backing into a long-term development priority without looking at the alternatives.

Randall Denley, Ottawa Citizen
Published Jun 26, 2024 • Last updated Jun 26, 2024 • 3 minute read


At times, Ottawa Council has a disconcerting lack of ability to see the big picture or to understand the relationship between cost and value.

Case in point, this week councillors passed the city’s new master plan for water and sewer services. Nearly $600 million of the $1.5 billion plan is attributable to Tewin, a proposed new satellite suburban community out near Carlsbad Springs in rural south-east Ottawa.

Included in that amount is nearly $170 million that city staff have suggested spending to make the main sewer pipes to Tewin far larger than the community of 16,500 people will require by 2046. It’s the smart move, you see, because eventually the vacant land around Tewin might become the home to 93,000 people. Not now, not 20 years from now, but possibly by the end of the century. In effect, councillors are willing to spend your money now because it might, potentially, benefit some other people long after most of us are dead.

Planning enthusiasts will recognize Tewin as being one of the oddest planning decisions ever made by the City of Ottawa. Back in 2021, councillors were just about to approve the Official Plan, the city’s long-term planning document, when then-mayor Jim Watson championed the idea of adding 450 hectares of land that hadn’t even been evaluated by city staff.

The ostensible reason for doing so was that the Algonquins of Ontario owned part of the land, so it was a chance for Indigenous reconciliation. Other Algonquin leaders were skeptical of the deal.

At least the project came with a saving grace. The Algonquin group and their partners, development powerhouse Taggart Group, said they would pay the substantial costs of extending services to Tewin. They are keeping their side of the bargain, agreeing to pay an estimated $313 million in water and sewer capital costs.

That was the original deal, but now city bureaucrats have turned it into a money pit with their grandiose plan to speculate on future sewer demand for land that isn’t even in the city’s Official Plan. That was the point where councillors should have said, “Hey, wait a minute. What do we get for all that money?”

Instead, most councillors chose the path of least resistance at Tuesday’s meeting, going along with the staff plan without questioning its underlying assumption that the area around Tewin has suddenly gone from obscurity to red-hot prospect.

Coun. Shawn Menard was one of the few who understood that a new development needs to be considered based on its costs to the city versus those of other potential developments. That’s the big picture here.

What was at issue is not revisiting the Tewin decision, as some councillors argue, but determining where the city will grow in the future. By supporting big bucks for the Tewin area, councillors are backing into a long-term development priority without looking at the alternatives. There is no shortage of them.

In an effort to jump-start housing in Ottawa, in 2022 the provincial government added 654 hectares of development land to the city’s Official Plan, most of it extending existing suburbs. Last year, the government got in a flap over the provincial Greenbelt controversy around Toronto and withdrew the land. The potential is still there and most, if not all of that development, would make more sense than even more housing around Tewin.

Councillors keen to make an excuse for not limiting Tewin costs now say that can still be done in the future. It could, but the more times the city says yes to a big new development in the southeast, the less likely it is to ever say no.

At some point, making a priority of the area around Tewin will be justified by the number of studies and decisions the city has already made. You can bet $170 million on it.

Randall Denley is an Ottawa journalist and author. Contact him at randalldenley1@gmail.com

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/ot...-sense-opinion
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