PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread II

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by bdurk

I think a good permanent location would be Independence Mall. Maybe it'll bring a little extra foot traffic for people visiting Independence Hall

This isn't a bad idea, but I sorta think the point is to connect people from Philadelphia to other places in the world...not tourists.

Anyways, a note and a question.

Note: Just got back from my morning coffee walk. Site work is beginning on the multi-family building at Northbank.

Question: When is the Sprouts going to open at Riverwalk (i.e. Spring Garden and Delaware)? Building appears to be fast approaching completion and I think I might be looking more forward to this than anything else in the Riverwards.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by bdurk

I think a good permanent location would be Independence Mall. Maybe it'll bring a little extra foot traffic for people visiting Independence Hall

That is a good spot, but I like Love Park because you can see City Hall in the background and more locals and passersby vs. exclusively tourists.

I saw videos on social media of a ton of people at Love Park including someone dressed as Elmo, waving to a few people in Poland, lol. Philadelphia makes me laugh.

And I'm glad there is a push to keep the Portal in Philadelphia and not NYC.

[mcgrath618]

The overbuild at 10th and Vine has a stop work order. Wasn’t able to see what for.

[PHLtoNYC]

Archive Development finished 2406 Frankford Avenue.

See what a little design integrity can accomplish!

https://www.instagram.com/archivedevelopment/ (first picture)

[PhillyPDX]

They just announced a PDX-BWI flight on SWA, and it got me thinking, why still no year round/non red-eye service to PHL? Why is PHL so overlooked for airport growth? I get it's located in the middle of tons of other huge cities and it's easy to fly from any. But really, I still don't get it. DC has 3 airports, and they are ALL the roughly the same size as PHL, so it still doesn't really make sense "just" due to proximity to other airports.

PHL is the 21st busiest airport, but 8th in population, and either 9th or 10th in metro GDP depending on source (US BEA the latter number, UN the former). Philly metro has a thriving economy. In fact, the UN shows PHL as bigger GDP than Boston yet PHL has 50% fewer passengers than BOS. PHL is SO small relative to the city size, one would think that there obviously must be at least two full service airports serving the metro that are both considered "large". And yet, nope.

What gives?

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by PhillyPDX

They just announced a PDX-BWI flight on SWA, and it got me thinking, why still no year round/non red-eye service to PHL? Why is PHL so overlooked for airport growth? I get it's located in the middle of tons of other huge cities and it's easy to fly from any. But really, I still don't get it. DC has 3 airports, and they are ALL the roughly the same size as PHL, so it still doesn't really make sense "just" due to proximity to other airports.

PHL is the 21st busiest airport, but 8th in population, and either 9th or 10th in metro GDP depending on source (US BEA the latter number, UN the former). Philly metro has a thriving economy. In fact, the UN shows PHL as bigger GDP than Boston yet PHL has 50% fewer passengers than BOS. PHL is SO small relative to the city size, one would think that there obviously must be at least two full service airports serving the metro that are both considered "large". And yet, nope.

What gives?

I'm sure others will elaborate on various reasons why PHL isn't a mega airport, but proximity does matter. EWR is one of the most prominent international airports in the US, and while it aligns with NYC, its still accessible to Philadelphia. Though I get annoyed when tourism numbers are ranked by airport traffic, because PHL gets jipped since many arrive from NYC or DC via train, bus, car (another topic, lol).

PHL is getting a new flagship AA lounge though, which is a boost for AA flyers.

[PhillyPDX]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

I'm sure others will elaborate on various reasons why PHL isn't a mega airport, but proximity does matter. EWR is one of the most prominent international airports in the US, and while it aligns with NYC, its still accessible to Philadelphia. Though I get annoyed when tourism numbers are ranked by airport traffic, because PHL gets jipped since many arrive from NYC or DC via train, bus, car (another topic, lol).

PHL is getting a new flagship AA lounge though, which is a boost for AA flyers.

I get it, I often fly EWR to get to Philly. But that argument doesn’t work for DC that manages to support 3 PHL sized airports. Or heck, why is it EWR that grows rapidly while PHL stagnates and not the other way around? Philly has the 9th biggest economy. Do all those biz travelers prefer connecting through EWR?

So now pdx gets a direct flight to much smaller Baltimore (city). I get it’s really a DC metro airport, but this will make 3 daily year round flights to DC, no red eye. Philly gets 1 summer seasonal with a terrible red eye. Wtf.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by PhillyPDX

I get it, I often fly EWR to get to Philly. But that argument doesn’t work for DC that manages to support 3 PHL sized airports. Or heck, why is it EWR that grows rapidly while PHL stagnates and not the other way around? Philly has the 9th biggest economy. Do all those biz travelers prefer connecting through EWR?

So now pdx gets a direct flight to much smaller Baltimore (city). I get it’s really a DC metro airport, but this will make 3 daily year round flights to DC, no red eye. Philly gets 1 summer seasonal with a terrible red eye. Wtf.

The problem with PHL is that there's really no direct int'l flights that go to PHL. It's nice that AA provides direct flights that goes to SJU, but if you want to go to POP, STI, SDQ, or PUJ, there's not one flight from PHL that actually goes to those airports. There was talk that AA would provide flight to those airports, but as of today, there hasn't been one flight. I'm coming to Philly to vote since absentee balloting overseas sucks (my vote wasn't processed, so I have to vote in person), as well as to get a job. If you want to go to Philadelphia, you have to use EWR, or, at the least, LGA, or JFK. That's a damn shame for what should be a decent "world class" city.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by PhillyPDX

They just announced a PDX-BWI flight on SWA, and it got me thinking, why still no year round/non red-eye service to PHL? Why is PHL so overlooked for airport growth? I get it's located in the middle of tons of other huge cities and it's easy to fly from any. But really, I still don't get it. DC has 3 airports, and they are ALL the roughly the same size as PHL, so it still doesn't really make sense "just" due to proximity to other airports.

PHL is the 21st busiest airport, but 8th in population, and either 9th or 10th in metro GDP depending on source (US BEA the latter number, UN the former). Philly metro has a thriving economy. In fact, the UN shows PHL as bigger GDP than Boston yet PHL has 50% fewer passengers than BOS. PHL is SO small relative to the city size, one would think that there obviously must be at least two full service airports serving the metro that are both considered "large". And yet, nope.

What gives?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...tes#Large_hubs

You have to blame the economic, financial, and the political leaders in the city and the state as to why PHL is the 21st, when it should be at least Top 15, if not Top 10. Also, it helps that BOS is located in the "Hub of New England", and the closest major city is 4 hours away (New York), while Philly is wedged 90 min away from New York, and over 2 1/2 hours away from DC. Either way, it's no excuse why Philly isn't busier and offers int'l carriers outside of British Airways and Aer Lingus. I'd love to go to Amsterdam via KLM, Tokyo via JAL, Hong Kong via Cathay Pacific, and even Dubai via Emirates but it's slim to none those carriers come and operate here due to how the airport is run.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

I'm sure others will elaborate on various reasons why PHL isn't a mega airport, but proximity does matter. EWR is one of the most prominent international airports in the US, and while it aligns with NYC, its still accessible to Philadelphia. Though I get annoyed when tourism numbers are ranked by airport traffic, because PHL gets jipped since many arrive from NYC or DC via train, bus, car (another topic, lol).

PHL is getting a new flagship AA lounge though, which is a boost for AA flyers.

https://www.forconstructionpros.com/...airport-rework

If you can click on the link, you can see the map with the fifth diagram. The funny thing is that EWR has three runways, while PHL has four, but EWR is busiest due to it's location (15-20 min away from Lower Manhattan), while PHL, which has 4 runways, and has planned for a fifth one, is basically a reflection of it's city. The fifthh runway was planned to be 13K' ft, but as of today, I haven't heard of any plans to either expand the runways or even renovate the airport.

[PhilliesPhan]

Originally Posted by PhillyPDX

They just announced a PDX-BWI flight on SWA, and it got me thinking, why still no year round/non red-eye service to PHL? Why is PHL so overlooked for airport growth? I get it's located in the middle of tons of other huge cities and it's easy to fly from any. But really, I still don't get it. DC has 3 airports, and they are ALL the roughly the same size as PHL, so it still doesn't really make sense "just" due to proximity to other airports.

PHL is the 21st busiest airport, but 8th in population, and either 9th or 10th in metro GDP depending on source (US BEA the latter number, UN the former). Philly metro has a thriving economy. In fact, the UN shows PHL as bigger GDP than Boston yet PHL has 50% fewer passengers than BOS. PHL is SO small relative to the city size, one would think that there obviously must be at least two full service airports serving the metro that are both considered "large". And yet, nope.

What gives?

BOS has the advantage of being the sole large international airport for all of New England. While PHL does anchor the Philadelphia area, we're at the center of a very connected megalopolis where it is easy to get to other large airports. If someone lives in the southern portion of the MSA (especially New Castle County, DE and Cecil County, MD), BWI/DCA/IAD aren't all that hard to get to. If one lives in Bucks County or Montgomery Counties, Burlington County, NJ, or even portions of the Far Northeast (Bustleton, Somerton, Torresdale, etc.), EWR is convenient. Even as someone who lives in Northwest Philly, it's very easy for me to take the Regional Rail to 30th Street, transfer to Amtrak, and be on the AirTrain at EWR within an hour. Also, PHL is a fortress hub for American. With the exceptions of BWI and DCA, there is a LOT more competition at other Northeastern airports, driving down costs and making the extra trip worth it for some people. Finally, although American is convenient, their domestic product does not hold up to Delta or even United.

Believe it or not, aircraft manufacturers are also responsible for PHL's sluggish recovery. American retired many of its older widebody Airbus A330s and Boeing 767s during the pandemic with the expectation that Boeing would've already came through on its 787 Dreamliner and 777x orders. American also has a bunch of narrowbody Airbus A321XLRs on backorder, but at least Airbus has its act together. Many of those new jets will be based out of PHL. PHL will gain additional service as those new jets are delivered and become available for revenue service.

[PHLtoNYC]

Small update, but Iron Hill Brewery is planning another Philadelphia outpost. Their spaces are usually large. I'm thinking maybe Nolibs area or possibly South Broad Street?
Also closing their longtime Phoenixville outpost.

Iron Hill Brewery & Restaurant closes Chester County location, plans new Philadelphia spot
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...estaurant.html

Despite the closures, Iron Hill has plans to expand. Edelson said the company has signed a letter of intent for another Philadelphia location, but the chain declined to share more details about the new restaurant at this time. Iron Hill currently operates two restaurants in Philadelphia proper at 1150 Market St. in Center City and 8400 Germantown Ave. in Chestnut Hill.

[jaysb]

Originally Posted by wanderer34

The problem with PHL is that there's really no direct int'l flights that go to PHL. It's nice that AA provides direct flights that goes to SJU, but if you want to go to POP, STI, SDQ, or PUJ, there's not one flight from PHL that actually goes to those airports. There was talk that AA would provide flight to those airports, but as of today, there hasn't been one flight. I'm coming to Philly to vote since absentee balloting overseas sucks (my vote wasn't processed, so I have to vote in person), as well as to get a job. If you want to go to Philadelphia, you have to use EWR, or, at the least, LGA, or JFK. That's a damn shame for what should be a decent "world class" city.

I'm sorry but that's just not true. You can get to nearly every major European city direct from Philly (and even some of the more obscure ones). It's pricier than the NY airports bc there is no competition. There are multiple daily flights to Punta Cana. AA used to have a Saturday flight to SDQ but don't any longer (which is silly due to the increase of Dominican population around Philly/reading etc. I know Frontier has infrequent direct flights (good luck!). But yes, I get your frustrations with Puerto Plata/Santiago, sucks connecting through Miami.

[mcgrath618]

FWIW I flew out and back from EWR rather than PHL when I went to Europe last year. An Acela ticket combined with the red eye flight on IcelandicAir was still almost a hundred dollars cheaper than flying direct out of PHL.

[gjrip]

Originally Posted by wanderer34

The problem with PHL is that there's really no direct int'l flights that go to PHL.

Literally false af