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bvpcvm Apr 11, 2009 3:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MightyAlweg (Post 4189724)
And if I'm the only one here who remembers Portland's first Trader Vic's off the lobby of the Benson Hotel, then that truly is a shame. It would be nice to see Vic's make a triumphant return to Portland Live! after a 20+ year absence, as Trader Vic's was once a real PDX hot spot. I'm sure many other Portlanders over the age of 40 remember it well.

Actually I DO remember Trader Vic's on Broadway, from when i was a kid, but I never stepped foot inside and only realized it was a chain when you mentioned it a couple days ago.

urbanlife Apr 11, 2009 6:17 PM

don't be knocking the champagne of beers. :P

holladay Apr 11, 2009 8:18 PM

Actually the champagne of beers would be Miller Highlife, not Miller Lite! :haha:

twofiftyfive Apr 11, 2009 9:02 PM

I have been to exactly one Blazers game in my time in Portland (last Christmas in the snow), and it was the most over the top, glitzy, not-a-second-of-down-time experience of my adult life. The pregame and timeout entertainment was as choreographed as a Broadway musical. The game itself was by far the most relaxing part of the experience. And it was very corporate.

In short, anyone who enjoys going to Blazers games would probably enjoy a Live! district.

ethirtysex Apr 12, 2009 1:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twofiftyfive (Post 4190219)
I have been to exactly one Blazers game in my time in Portland (last Christmas in the snow), and it was the most over the top, glitzy, not-a-second-of-down-time experience of my adult life. The pregame and timeout entertainment was as choreographed as a Broadway musical. The game itself was by far the most relaxing part of the experience. And it was very corporate.

In short, anyone who enjoys going to Blazers games would probably enjoy a Live! district.

I'm not sure that's an accurate assessment of Blazer fans... :shrug:

zilfondel Apr 12, 2009 2:34 AM

erm

Miller is the new pbr


also, please don't diss the Blazers. They have a huge fan base!

PacificNW Apr 12, 2009 2:56 AM

Architect fighting to protect Portland's Memorial Coliseum



Story Published: Apr 11, 2009 at 7:40 PM PDT
Story Updated: Apr 11, 2009 at 7:40 PM PDT
By Associated Press


PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) - Memorial Coliseum may be getting a nomination for the National Register of Historic Places as part of an effort to prevent it from being torn down and replaced with a baseball stadium.

Peter Meijer, a Portland architect and historic preservation specialist, is leading a group of local architects who won't let the Portland landmark go down without a fight.

They say the nearly 50-year-old building has historical significance, but they may have to move fast if they want the national register to recognize it.

This week, officials from the city and the Portland Trail Blazers unveiled proposals to build a ballpark for the Portland Beavers, the Triple-A affiliate of the San Diego Padres, near the Rose Garden Arena.

The Beavers must find a new ballpark because PGE Park, where the team plays now, will be the home of Portland's Major League Soccer franchise.

Plans put forward Tuesday are part of a larger proposed entertainment district in the Rose Quarter, and they call for the demolition of the Memorial Coliseum, which is next door to the Rose Garden.

"Now is the time for action," Mayor Sam Adams said earlier this week, as he announced that the city will partner with the Trail Blazers and a Baltimore development company, Cordish Co.

"We do not lack plans. We lack action," Adams said.

A public meeting to discuss proposals will be held April 14. Meijer told the Daily Journal of Commerce that he wants city commissioners to postpone making a decision.

Meijer and others say the coliseum has an innovative design.

"It's one of the best examples of international modernist styles in the city," said architect and preservationist Paul Falsetto of Carleton Hart Architecture. "I wouldn't want the coliseum to be a casualty of convenience."

Structurally, the coliseum was groundbreaking for its use of four cruciform-shaped, 70-foot-high reinforced concrete columns that support steel trusses for the roof. The coliseum also has a concrete seating bowl that stands freely within the coliseum walls.

The coliseum was designed by Skidmore, Owings & Merrill. The firm also designed Portland's Standard Plaza Building, Standard Insurance Center and the Hilton Hotel.

---

Information from: Daily Journal of Commerce, http://www.djc-or.com/

MightyAlweg Apr 12, 2009 9:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bvpcvm (Post 4189891)
Actually I DO remember Trader Vic's on Broadway, from when i was a kid, but I never stepped foot inside and only realized it was a chain when you mentioned it a couple days ago.

It was fabulous and hilarious all at once, and you're probably remembering the Polynesian longhouse structure that jutted out towards Broadway with tiki gods beneath. Aloha! :haha:

I did some research, and apparently it lasted longer than I thought. Portland's Trader Vic's opened in the Benson in 1959 at the height of the Polynesian craze, and lasted until 1996. I had thought it closed around 1990. The chain nearly died out entirely in the late 1990's, but in the last five years has had a resurgence with snazzy new locations in big cities in America, Europe and Asia.

Of course, for those Tiki inclined Portlanders, there is still the Alibi in NE. :tup:

twofiftyfive Apr 12, 2009 2:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zilfondel (Post 4190695)
erm

Miller is the new pbr


also, please don't diss the Blazers. They have a huge fan base!

I'm not dissing the Blazers--I like the Blazers. I'm just giving my opinion of actually attending games. It's like being in an ADD simulator.

zilfondel Apr 13, 2009 10:05 AM

you guys heard about this? I read about it on Jack Bog's blog. :(

Rose Quarter Redevelopment Public Open House Event
April 14th - 6:00PM to 8:00PM
Leftbank Building, 240 N. Broadway

PacificNW Apr 13, 2009 6:20 PM

There is a growing "movement" afoot to fight the demolition of the MC!! Check out the latest columns on: http://portlandarchitecture.com/ . I predicted this would be the case....

pdxtraveler Apr 13, 2009 7:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacificNW (Post 4192993)
There is a growing "movement" afoot to fight the demolition of the MC!! Check out the latest columns on: http://portlandarchitecture.com/ . I predicted this would be the case....


I would love it if MC could be saved, I love the building. Problem is it is VERY easy to jump on these band wagons to save these places when it doesn't cost us anything. We protest and protest but don't come up with ways to make it financially viable. It reminds me of the Rosefriends controversy. Everyone up in arms, but no one having any solution on how the church could financially save a building that was literally falling apart. So as much as it would be great to save the building I am wondering how it could be made a financially sound choice for the parties involved.

urbanlife Apr 13, 2009 7:57 PM

if demolition of MC does happen, as much of the original building's materials should be used with the ballpark.

zilfondel Apr 13, 2009 8:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdxtraveler (Post 4193121)
I would love it if MC could be saved, I love the building. Problem is it is VERY easy to jump on these band wagons to save these places when it doesn't cost us anything. We protest and protest but don't come up with ways to make it financially viable. It reminds me of the Rosefriends controversy. Everyone up in arms, but no one having any solution on how the church could financially save a building that was literally falling apart. So as much as it would be great to save the building I am wondering how it could be made a financially sound choice for the parties involved.

If you had read my previous post, you would have seen that there was actually quite a proposal several years ago for its reuse. http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...&postcount=179

There is such a huge difference between the MC and Rosefriends that its not even on the same page...

MC has a lot of potential in reuse because of its huge floorplan, unobstructed views of downtown that give it a lot of value, it is very modern, and NOT falling apart.

I don't know where people keep coming up with this idea that the building is on the verge of collapse. That is flat out a lie. It is probably in better shape than Union Station downtown - although in both cases the city is borderline criminal in its inability to conduct basic maintenance on its facilities.

zilfondel Apr 13, 2009 9:01 PM

http://www.portlandonline.com/mayor/...49522&a=239688

pdxtraveler Apr 13, 2009 9:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zilfondel (Post 4193245)
If you had read my previous post, you would have seen that there was actually quite a proposal several years ago for its reuse. http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...&postcount=179

There is such a huge difference between the MC and Rosefriends that its not even on the same page...

MC has a lot of potential in reuse because of its huge floorplan, unobstructed views of downtown that give it a lot of value, it is very modern, and NOT falling apart.

I don't know where people keep coming up with this idea that the building is on the verge of collapse. That is flat out a lie. It is probably in better shape than Union Station downtown - although in both cases the city is borderline criminal in its inability to conduct basic maintenance on its facilities.

I remember the whole MARC thing. It was based on getting $100 million in money from the will from the death of someone's widow (Kroc was it, something like that). Without the money we are back to it not being financially viable. LOVED that concept though, it would have been great!

PacificNW Apr 14, 2009 5:07 AM

http://savethecoliseum.blogspot.com/

pylon Apr 15, 2009 12:38 AM

Can the MC "shell" be kept, given a little TLC and energy efficiency, and be used to house the Live! businesses? It would probably look classier and less silly than some of the structures these entertainment zones are put in. It would also make for a great glassy rain shelter to view the city from while doing things inside. Turnaround on a project like this could be done very eco-friendly and quick. With less risk and cost.

Not putting the SMART tower in here during this development seems like a missed opportunity. It would help bring business to the area when there are no games going on, and be an additional draw for conventions.

zilfondel Apr 15, 2009 4:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pylon (Post 4195712)
Can the MC "shell" be kept, given a little TLC and energy efficiency, and be used to house the Live! businesses? It would probably look classier and less silly than some of the structures these entertainment zones are put in. It would also make for a great glassy rain shelter to view the city from while doing things inside. Turnaround on a project like this could be done very eco-friendly and quick. With less risk and cost.

Not putting the SMART tower in here during this development seems like a missed opportunity. It would help bring business to the area when there are no games going on, and be an additional draw for conventions.

Thats kind of what I'd like to see as well... we could insert program into the existing shell, probably having to demolish the "teacup," but could allow a huge amount of activity. Like Crodish's proposal for a 2,500 seat theater, or a concert hall, which is also part of their proposal.


I just got back home from the public presentation tonight - wow! It was quite the ordeal. I would say at least 85% of the public, if not more, were very vocal against tearing down the MC. Probably 12 or more people brought it up during the Q/comments period, each to great applause.

And, boy, did the architecture community show up in force! Not only was Randy Gragg there, but several professors from the universities, as well as a few prominent urban planners/designers. The AIA sent a rep to denounce the destruction of the MC, calling it an architectural treasure. Many of the professionals not only were against tearing it down, but the plan itself is terrible and doomed to fail.


One of the current proposals:

http://www.portlandonline.com/shared....cfm?id=239696


One thing I would really like to know is the current value of the MC. And how much money Cordish, the Blazers, and Vulcan (???) are planning or willing to spend on the redevelopment. And why the hell aren't they looking at actually going to the river? The current plans wouldn't even have any activity that is focused towards the most valuable asset: downtown and river views. They basically involve tearing down the Blazer's office building and repurposing part of the central plaza into a U-shaped retail building that would face the Rose Garden. Circulation would likewise remained nonexistant, with no entrances or axial circulation routes. Unsurprisingly for a project being rushed like this, it doesn't even include looking at the greater district and how to integrate the development into the area, despite the fact that Sam and the lead city planner repeatedly claimed that it would build synergy in the district and act as a critical catalyst for redevelopment. Only one of the panels included the extensive planning done in Lloyd Crossing and the Convention Center blocks, with no mention of the Np Greenway plan, bike access, or pedestrian accessibility from the RQ transit center. I, and many others, failed to see how it will help spur redevelopment of the district, as they neglected the most critical components: The River, Downtown Views, Broadway, Accessibility and Openness (to the street grid, which was claimed many times), and circulation.

Apologies to the length of my post, but Folks, we're headed towards a clusterfuck... Sam and the team are fastracking this project, we might even see MC razed within a month or two if they get their way. Which, I would hope does not happen, as I fail to see how this would benefit Portland in the long term.

I can't believe the city has spent years studying this area and has basically nothing to show for it. They were able to develop a comprehensive Pearl District Plan in just a few years, that has worked fantastically. And this site is mere feet from the Pearl! So much wasted opportunity.

tworivers Apr 15, 2009 5:42 AM

Thanks for the report! Much appreciated.

Did you specifically hear that they may try to demolish MC within a month or two?

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 6:26 AM

This is where the stadium should be:
 
I'm totally in favor of the MLS and a new baseball stadium, but have become troubled by the demolition of the Memorial Coliseum. It would seem as though there is a fantastic location for a new stadium that is being ignored - The parking lots and unused space at OMSI.

The advantages of this site are:
Located on the new Max line
Views of the city
No demolition of the MC necessary!
All land is public (I believe), and doesn't require any demolition
Existing attractions at OMSI
Great waterfront location
Enough room to expand the stadium in the future to MLB standards

I'm not sure if any considerations for other locations are still on the table, but this is my vote (yeah, sorry for the bad sketch!):

I created a page for the OMSI proposal: here

http://www.liquidosity.com/stadiumplan.jpg

scleeb Apr 15, 2009 6:50 AM

It's a novel idea, and worth considering. However the momentum for the Rose Quarter seems unstoppable. Incidentally, your render is superb psxf. Nice work!

tworivers Apr 15, 2009 7:03 AM

Isn't the Big Pipe project there until 2011?

zilfondel Apr 15, 2009 7:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tworivers (Post 4196258)
Thanks for the report! Much appreciated.

Did you specifically hear that they may try to demolish MC within a month or two?

no. but their timeline is very, very short.. the deadline Sam mentioned was to identify a site, not tear it down - but buildings have a tendency to disappear when you least expect it. :shrug:

zilfondel Apr 15, 2009 7:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdxf (Post 4196314)
I'm totally in favor of the MLS and a new baseball stadium, but have become troubled by the demolition of the Memorial Colosium. It would seem as though there is a fantastic location for a new stadium that is being ignored - The parking lots and unused space at OMSI.

The advantages of this site are:
Located on the new Max line
Views of the city
No demolition of the MC necessary!
All land is public (I believe), and doesn't require any demolition
Existing attractions at OMSI
Great waterfront location
Enough room to expand the stadium in the future to MLB standards

I'm not sure if any considerations for other locations are still on the table, but this is my vote (yeah, sorry for the bad sketch!):

http://www.liquidosity.com/stadiumplan.jpg

Hey, this is great! Love the sketch and the idea for a stadium. The only problem I can think of is that the streetcar is going to branch off from the bridge and somewhere cross over the train tracks on its own bridge - don't know exactly where/how much space there is, but I wouldn't be surprised it would all still fit. Also, Big Pipe. But, since they want a dirt field for baseball, shouldn't be a big deal once it is finished. The stadium won't be much more than some bleachers and a field.

urbanlife Apr 15, 2009 8:27 AM

I strongly think the new ballpark should stay near downtown, but I do think the city council has been too quick to pick where they wanted the new park...it seems like there was a lack of study on this other than the old Rose Quarter or Lents study. So far there is a good 5 sites near downtown that could be used.

Though, I still cant see the point in tearing out the bowl of the MC and readjusting the building's function for another use. Once the bowl is gone, the building loses its original characteristic and becomes the "I remember when the MC use to look like this." which is no different than "I remember when the MC use to stand next to the Rose Garden." Once a massive change is made to the building, it will lose its original integrity.

sowat Apr 15, 2009 2:02 PM

lengthy article in the Oregonian last night if anyone missed it...

Portland's accelerated MLS plan leaves little time for public debate
by Ryan Frank and Mark Larabee, The Oregonian
Tuesday April 14, 2009, 8:32 PM

Mayor Sam Adams is pushing City Hall at light speed to endorse a more than $250 million plan to rehab PGE Park, revamp the Rose Quarter and tear down Memorial Coliseum so the city can add a Major League Soccer team and an entertainment district.

The question from others on the City Council and community leaders: Why is Adams moving so fast?

The answer is logistical and political.

full article:
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/i..._major_le.html

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 2:53 PM

A few nots about my OMSI proposal:
-The big dig is going on there, however the main construction area (the hole) would be south of the stadium (basically where the 'Max' label is), so potentially both could coexist.

-I'm not sure of the alignments of the streetcar and Max, but it seems as though since they are in the planning stages, those ideas could be worked out. The site is actually a little tight from my quick studies (for the MLB size stadium, which would come at some point down the road), but I think fitting everything in could be workable.

-Transit issues: I believe the Max wouldn't be built until 2015, so there would be a couple years without good light rail service. Maybe we can set up a water taxi system until then!

pylon Apr 15, 2009 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zilfondel (Post 4196384)
But, since they want a dirt field for baseball, shouldn't be a big deal once it is finished. The stadium won't be much more than some bleachers and a field.

That's the really sad part... tearing down the MC for only this.

jaxg8r1 Apr 15, 2009 3:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tworivers (Post 4196258)
Thanks for the report! Much appreciated.

Did you specifically hear that they may try to demolish MC within a month or two?

I've always heard a demo date of early 2010. Although I doubt anything has been set in stone as of yet.

I'm personally sort of indifferent about MC (either tearing it down or keeping it). I've been to a couple of events there, and while it seemed kind of cool it did have a "smell" inside. Maybe it just needs some love and better moisture barriers...

I'm curious to know what could potentially go on a site like that. It seems "blockaded" in between I-5, the Rose Garden, Broadway and Interstate Ave/Railroad Tracks. Nothing screams walkable/neighborhood about this location, so it might as well be a new stadium. And unless we bury any of the transportation infrastructure in the area, none of this is likely to change.

Although there have been some interesting and thought provoking points on both sides of the debate.... :cheers:

jaxg8r1 Apr 15, 2009 3:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdxf (Post 4196314)
I'm totally in favor of the MLS and a new baseball stadium, but have become troubled by the demolition of the Memorial Coliseum. It would seem as though there is a fantastic location for a new stadium that is being ignored - The parking lots and unused space at OMSI.

The advantages of this site are:
Located on the new Max line
Views of the city
No demolition of the MC necessary!
All land is public (I believe), and doesn't require any demolition
Existing attractions at OMSI
Great waterfront location
Enough room to expand the stadium in the future to MLB standards

I'm not sure if any considerations for other locations are still on the table, but this is my vote (yeah, sorry for the bad sketch!):

http://www.liquidosity.com/stadiumplan.jpg

Fascinating concept, and if this is your idea of a bad sketch then you must be really talented. :D

jaxg8r1 Apr 15, 2009 3:47 PM

I've always thought (and not necessarily for baseball) but that the Lloyd Center movie theater parking lot (next to the park) would be a good site for something large. Seems like far too good a location for its current use...

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 4:15 PM

OMSI Site Plan
 
I'm kind of sucked into this OMSI idea, so here is another sketch...
I wanted to make sure everything could fit on the OMSI site, so here is a quick site plan (stadium plan and scale came from the pre-existing stadium proposals, and is a MLB sized park, although initially it would only be sized for AAA):

I created a page for the OMSI proposal: here

http://www.liquidosity.com/stadiumsiteplan.jpg

RoseCtyRoks Apr 15, 2009 5:00 PM

pdfx: Wow, you seriously need to be involved in these ballpark concepts, with your forward thinking and talent with the pencil!! There has to be at least 3 better options for the new ballpark site, including your OMSI idea. I'm afraid with the quick timeframe involving the MLS and AAA baseball, the city will move abruptly, and will raze the Memorial Coliseum without even batting an eye. (unless a historical status is placed in time)

The city claims that they're losing money year after year on the Coliseum--- revenue vs. the annual upkeep. Does anyone have any numbers showing validity of this? Undoubtedly, this factor along with the prompt need for the ballpark, is what could have the city making some misguided decisions, and hopefully, ones we won't all regret.

pdxhome Apr 15, 2009 5:36 PM

pdxf, I think your renderings are great, and they present in my mind another site that is at least worth considering. I saw your website, have you been able to get this idea in front of any decision makers?

Some other potential issues to consider with the OMSI location are traffic and parking. I believe the PCL requires that all ballparks provide a minimum 5,000 parking spaces in the immediate vicinity of the stadium and this number would likely be increased to 20,000 spaces for MLB. Also until transit is built, one would need to demonstrate that there are adequate transportation facilities to handle 4,000 – 5,000 vehicles entering and leaving the area (15,000-25,000 if it were MLB). Unfortunately there is not a great route to I-5 northbound or southbound or I-84 from the OMSI location. These are not impossible to work out, but would need attention.

Regarding a comment that was made earlier. I just wanted to share that a AAA baseball stadium can be much more that just “bleachers and a field.” In fact some of the best ballparks I have been to in the country have been minor league stadiums. I would refer you to Franklin Covey Field in Salt Lake City or Autozone Park in Memphis. Both these stadiums have a context sensitive design that enhances the overall baseball watching experience.

There is probably an option out there that could create a context sensitive AAA baseball field at the MC site and that can integrate the architectural elegance and history of the MC. Some ideas that have been suggested are re-using materials from the MC. Demolishing the MC doesn’t mean we have to forget about it forever.

jaxg8r1 Apr 15, 2009 5:48 PM

Not sure if this is important, but would the Markam bridge block downtown views from this site? (Or am I imagining this in the incorrect location?)

scottyboi Apr 15, 2009 5:57 PM

yes...the bridge and OMSI itself would seem to block any views...maybe this would be a good excuse to finally knock down that fugly bridge!

PacificNW Apr 15, 2009 5:58 PM

I don't think MLB, or PCL, would accept this particular playing field layout. I think the view of downtown would be off their table if the stadium was placed at the OMSI location. They are pretty rigid on what direction homeplate, the pitcher mound, and outfield all face. Could the stadium be turned to accommodate their specs? Is there enough space? Great drawings, btw.

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 6:02 PM

I think the biggest issue with the OMSI site is the auto access, hopefully it could be something that can be overcome. Parking I don't think is too big of an issue, there is a lot of available land over there, but getting the autos to the stadium could present some challenges.

I haven't gotten this idea in front of any policy makers. I've been thinking about the OMSI site for a couple of months, but I didn't get around to sketching it out until last night (since it looks like the MC is headed for the wrecking ball). Since the feedback on this was pretty positive, I quickly drew up the site plan and made a quick website to post those on.

I definitely wouldn't mind if this spread to those who can at least get it into consideration. Feel free to spread the link to this thread, or to the site I created. If anyone else is interested in the idea, feel free to email the information to any of the local architecture bloggers, city commissioners, etc...

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 6:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PacificNW (Post 4196999)
I don't think MLB, or PCL, would accept this particular playing field layout. I think the view of downtown would be off their table if the stadium was placed at the OMSI location. They are pretty rigid on what direction homeplate, the pitcher mound, and outfield all face. Could the stadium be turned to accommodate their specs? Is there enough space? Great drawings, btw.

The stadium fits with other possible orientations. I just looked at other stadiums for orientation, but I'm no expert. My preferred orientation was openning towards the river, but it seemed like a southerly orientation is bad for baseball.

The I-5 bridge is slated for demolition in 2020, so that is a short term concern (just kidding, I can dream though). OMSI probably will take most of the view, but I would think that there would be some good views of SOWA and the West Hills. There is a site to the south of the Opera building which would offer better views, but it's all private land so that would add some complication.

urbanlife Apr 15, 2009 6:10 PM

deleted.

Actually in rereading the report for major league baseball, the report suggested that the PPS was the best location...which would go against the report to put a minor league ballpark at the MC.

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 6:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyboi (Post 4196995)
yes...the bridge and OMSI itself would seem to block any views...maybe this would be a good excuse to finally knock down that fugly bridge!

I took a couple of screenshots from googleearth to get an idea for views. Unfortunately it doesn't look like the bridge is modelled in googleearth, but just to get an idea.... I posted them here.

*Hopefully I haven't diverted this thread too much...

PacificNW Apr 15, 2009 7:10 PM

I have misspoken: Google search: "Official MLB rules state a preference for having the home-mound-CF line facing east or northeast but it is not a requirement. Many major league parks follow the suggestion, but not all.

sowat Apr 15, 2009 8:26 PM

oops. moved

zilfondel Apr 15, 2009 9:19 PM

PDXF: excellent drawing showing your proposal. I believe the new streetcar line will branch off of the bridge, run up Water Ave, and then over the railroad tracks and Division on a new vaiduct bridge. The OMSI site has a bunch of land to the north that could be used as parking... several acres at the least. And it is very close to highway 99 and I-5, so access shouldn't be much of a problem.

I don't think views were ever a consideration for a ballpark. According to the planners, ballparks cannot face west, because the sun would get into the batter's eyes. Most of the drawings I've seen have the 1st baseline running due south.

zilfondel Apr 15, 2009 9:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by urbanlife (Post 4197025)
one thing to keep in mind with the MC site is that it was the chosen site from that lengthy major league report when we were in the running for a team. It makes sense for the city council to want to listen to that report and chose this site for a minor league ballpark that would be expandable to a major league park.

Sam Adams and the city planner specifically stated that the Memorial Coliseum site would not be able to accommodate a major league baseball stadium, as it is far too small. According to their baseball stadium construction consultant, a MLB stadium would have to have a minimum of 40,000 seats, and is not doable on the site.

Sam did say that the Blanchard site, currently housing PPS's HQ, would be ideal for a minor league stadium, as it would be upgradeable to MLB. Unfortunately, although he said they were willing to move, he made it clear the city was not pursuing that option. He wanted to maximize the city's leverage and "financial mechanisms that expire in 2013."


If the MC comes down, we will forever (?) have a minor league baseball stadium there. :tup:

pdxhome Apr 15, 2009 9:47 PM

The MC/Rose Garden site is large enough to house a MLB stadium, HOWEVER, this would be without the "Live" stuff that goes along with this proposal. One thing that would be exciting to see is if a AAA baseball field could be oriented in the direction of a future MLB stadium, that way if (BIG "IF") MLB comes knocking in 10-20 years and the "Live" thing just isn't working out you could potentially redevelop the site again for MLB use.

Although people around Portland would have a fit at the thought of potentially redevloping this site again in 10-20 years. Maybe by then someone with verrrry deep pockets comes into town...

pdxf Apr 15, 2009 10:13 PM

I can't imagine building a AAA baseball stadium that can't be upgraded in the future. Seems like a bad move for long term. If I stay inspired, I may try to update my site plan with a better orientation tonight.

jaxg8r1 Apr 15, 2009 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdxf (Post 4197625)
I can't imagine building a AAA baseball stadium that can't be upgraded in the future. Seems like a bad move for long term. If I stay inspired, I may try to update my site plan with a better orientation tonight.

Stay inspired! :cheers:

urbanlife Apr 15, 2009 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zilfondel (Post 4197513)
Sam Adams and the city planner specifically stated that the Memorial Coliseum site would not be able to accommodate a major league baseball stadium, as it is far too small. According to their baseball stadium construction consultant, a MLB stadium would have to have a minimum of 40,000 seats, and is not doable on the site.

Sam did say that the Blanchard site, currently housing PPS's HQ, would be ideal for a minor league stadium, as it would be upgradeable to MLB. Unfortunately, although he said they were willing to move, he made it clear the city was not pursuing that option. He wanted to maximize the city's leverage and "financial mechanisms that expire in 2013."


If the MC comes down, we will forever (?) have a minor league baseball stadium there. :tup:

I corrected my earlier statement after rereading the report that was released a while ago. So I would have to say it doesnt make sense to spend all that money on the report, then when it comes time to put it in action, not to listen to it...if that is the case, why spend money on planning if the city council refuses to listen to what planners are saying?

So yes you are correct that if the ballpark goes at the MC it would stay a minor league ballpark, which is not a good enough reason to put it there because a AAA ballpark should be placed in a location that will allow for a MLB expansion if Portland were to ever get one...it is much easier to compete for a team when we would already have a place that could be upgraded for them.


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