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  #1  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 8:11 PM
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Young people like St. Louis

http://www.stltoday.com/business/loc...f2dc232c7.html

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Young people like St. Louis

In last three years, more young adults have moved into the region than have moved out.


BY TIM LOGAN • tlogan@post-dispatch.com > 314-340-8291


Anna Allen and her husband Adrian sit down for a drink at Coffee Cartel in the Central West End on Friday, December 2, 2011. In the last few years, more young adults have moved to the metro St. Louis area than away from it. Photo by Johnny Andrews, jandrews@post-dispatch.com

A funny thing happened here in the past few years. More young adults moved into the St. Louis region than moved out.

Not as many as in some so-called "cooler" cities, and maybe only because fewer people were moving in general from 2008 to 2010 as the nation wrestled with a deep recession and weak recovery.

But in each of those three years, according to new census data crunched by the Brookings Institution, on average, 870 more people age 25 to 34 came to the St. Louis area than left it. That is the opposite of what happened the previous three years and runs counter to the general trend of recent decades. After a long time spent watching young adults move away, and the St. Louis region slowly get grayer, a lot of people say this seems like progress.

Wooing young people has been a big focus in recent years for the groups that try to grow St. Louis' economy. Ranging from efforts by the Regional Chamber and Growth Association to St. Louis Mayor Francis Slay, "talent" initiatives and young adult councils have been launched in a bid to stem what some call a "brain drain" and spur fresh thinking in a place that is sometimes seen as stodgy and closed. Grass-roots groups have sprung up with the same ideas.

For an aging region, young adults are a sort of economic vitamin boost. People in their late 20s and early 30s are building careers and choosing where to settle down. Capturing them, and their talent, can mean a stronger workforce, which helps grow and attract companies — which means more jobs.

...
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  #2  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 8:21 PM
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^ 870 people over 3 years?

Give me a break, write an article when something more significant than that is taking place

Love St Louis, by the way. My brother lived there for 4 years and I have great memories from hanging out there
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  #3  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 8:31 PM
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
^ 870 people over 3 years?

Give me a break, write an article when something more significant than that is taking place

Love St Louis, by the way. My brother lived there for 4 years and I have great memories from hanging out there
Compared to consistently losing thousands of young adults every year for the past few decades... gaining 870 is VERY significant for St. Louis. And it's quite a different story compared to what is going on in nearby Chicago.
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  #4  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 8:44 PM
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And it's quite a different story compared to what is going on in nearby Chicago.
i'm curious, what are the stats on migration rates for 24-35 year-olds in chicago for the last 3 years?
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  #5  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:00 PM
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I'll take it. One thing I've really noticed, that may or may not be related, is the tendency of females to move back to St. Louis from city X much more than males in a kind of boomerang effect.
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  #6  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
i'm curious, what are the stats on migration rates for 24-35 year-olds in chicago for the last 3 years?
-9,645

You can see a young adult migration map here:

http://www.miamiherald.com/static/mu...Migration.html
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  #7  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:31 PM
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^ thanks for the link to that map, interesting stuff.
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  #8  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Evergrey View Post
-9,645

You can see a young adult migration map here:

http://www.miamiherald.com/static/mu...Migration.html
From that map, young people are moving away from metro NYC, Washington DC, LA, SF, and Chicago.

That indeed is interesting, as you usually view these places as magnets for the young. Perhaps this has something to do with rising costs of living?
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  #9  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:44 PM
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Unfortunately Jenna is gone. Le sigh.


http://images.askmen.com/celebs/wome...ge_image-1.jpg
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  #10  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evergrey View Post
-9,645

You can see a young adult migration map here:

http://www.miamiherald.com/static/mu...Migration.html
surprised by this number. when i was in chicago a few years ago, i ran into many people my age that moved in from other areas. seems like a natural magnet for young professionals. i certainly wouldn't balk at the idea of moving there.

though i'm no longer a part of that demographic.
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  #11  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:51 PM
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
From that map, young people are moving away from metro NYC, Washington DC, LA, SF, and Chicago.
not DC, according to the map, it was one of the big gainers.

but yes, the others were all big losers, which does go against conventional wisdom.
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  #12  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 9:58 PM
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Not a huge number, but a positive change nonetheless, good for St Louis.
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  #13  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evergrey View Post
-9,645

You can see a young adult migration map here:

http://www.miamiherald.com/static/mu...Migration.html
It is not that surprising when you consider the city lost nearly 200K African Americans in the past decade. Many of those AA were probably in that age cohort. I'd like to see the + / - broken down by race & educ. level.
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  #14  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by JManc View Post
surprised by this number. when i was in chicago a few years ago, i ran into many people my age that moved in from other areas. seems like a natural magnet for young professionals. i certainly wouldn't balk at the idea of moving there.

though i'm no longer a part of that demographic.
The problem is... when you were in Chicago... you didn't run into the even greater number of people your age that moved away from Chicago... because they're in Denver or Seattle or Houston.

I think our perceptions of places like Chicago, NYC, LA, etc. are influenced by the massive migration flows these cities experience. St. Louis might be experiencing a net gain of young adults... but Chicago sees a lot more young adults moving in. However, there are even more young adults moving out of Chicago... hence the loss. Our largest metros are centers of major population churn.
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  #15  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evergrey View Post
The problem is... when you were in Chicago... you didn't run into the even greater number of people your age that moved away from Chicago... because they're in Denver or Seattle or Houston.

I think our perceptions of places like Chicago, NYC, LA, etc. are influenced by the massive migration flows these cities experience. St. Louis might be experiencing a net gain of young adults... but Chicago sees a lot more young adults moving in. However, there are even more young adults moving out of Chicago... hence the loss. Our largest metros are centers of major population churn.
Generally speaking, I think central Chicago gains a lot of young people. I would be shocked if you could provide city-only numbers showing otherwise.

The suburbs lose young people because when you're young you want to move away from your parents (or are at least willing to). Central Chicago is the destination of choice (within the metro area) for people coming from other metros. Chicago suburbs are not. Since 70% of the population and probably 80% of the local-raised young people are in the suburbs, if even a small fraction of them decide to move to a new metro just to get away from their parents, it creates a huge number to replace through in-migration. But since a greater percentage of that incoming cohort would land in the City itself, as a metro area you end up "losing" young people to other areas, but the central city still ends up gaining quite a lot. In more expensive locations, you have fewer young people moving in as a percentage of total *for the metro area* compared to older people simply because it's a bigger gamble. That's why places like Chicago, New York, SF, and LA all "lose" young people. The only time that gets overridden is when thre's just a huge influx of every age group, like, for example, most of Texas.

I would guess that St. Louis is keeping more of its youth partly because it's becoming a more interesting city, but it could also be because the youth there simply don't think they can afford to risk moving to more expensive cities.

Also, I'm curious - are those domestic migration only, or do they include immigrants, too?
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Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evergrey View Post
The problem is... when you were in Chicago... you didn't run into the even greater number of people your age that moved away from Chicago... because they're in Denver or Seattle or Houston.

I think our perceptions of places like Chicago, NYC, LA, etc. are influenced by the massive migration flows these cities experience. St. Louis might be experiencing a net gain of young adults... but Chicago sees a lot more young adults moving in. However, there are even more young adults moving out of Chicago... hence the loss. Our largest metros are centers of major population churn.
I've also found this to be true. I've met a lot of young entrepreneurial types from larger markets (Chicago, New York, California etc.) that have come to St. Louis to open up businesses, because they see it as an untapped market for certain trends, ideas, cuisines etc. (ex. there may be a over 100 sushi themed internet cafes in Chicago, but in St. Louis there may only be a few if any). I've also found that many transplants that actually move to St. Louis have a better appreciation for it than locals.

I will also say that this change is a result of two things primarily.

1) The Economy - Many young people just cant afford to leave St. Louis. So there stuck here until the economy improves.

2) Our Urban Revitalization that is 20 years late - Like most interior markets St. Louis is about 10-20 years behind the the coast on most perimeters of progress (including urban revitalization/gentrification), but now that St. Louis has been swept by the urbanist wave we are retaining a lot more of our young people. Downtown St. Louis is probably the fastest growing neighborhood in the region and its hard to keep rental apartments on the market.
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  #17  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2011, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by emathias View Post
Generally speaking, I think central Chicago gains a lot of young people. I would be shocked if you could provide city-only numbers showing otherwise.

The suburbs lose young people because when you're young you want to move away from your parents (or are at least willing to). Central Chicago is the destination of choice (within the metro area) for people coming from other metros. Chicago suburbs are not. Since 70% of the population and probably 80% of the local-raised young people are in the suburbs, if even a small fraction of them decide to move to a new metro just to get away from their parents, it creates a huge number to replace through in-migration. But since a greater percentage of that incoming cohort would land in the City itself, as a metro area you end up "losing" young people to other areas, but the central city still ends up gaining quite a lot. In more expensive locations, you have fewer young people moving in as a percentage of total *for the metro area* compared to older people simply because it's a bigger gamble. That's why places like Chicago, New York, SF, and LA all "lose" young people. The only time that gets overridden is when thre's just a huge influx of every age group, like, for example, most of Texas.

I would guess that St. Louis is keeping more of its youth partly because it's becoming a more interesting city, but it could also be because the youth there simply don't think they can afford to risk moving to more expensive cities.

Also, I'm curious - are those domestic migration only, or do they include immigrants, too?
St. Louis has always been an interesting and dynamic city.

St. Louis is like an old, dull, dirty pair of patent leather shoes. Its still a quality leather shoe, but the better you take care of it the more it shines.

Also, I would be willing to bet that Chicago gets a shitload of St. Louis youth in any given year. Probably one of the biggest markets for St. Louis expats.
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  #18  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2011, 2:15 AM
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Also, I would be willing to bet that Chicago gets a shitload of St. Louis youth in any given year. Probably one of the biggest markets for St. Louis expats.
Yeah, I'd guess it's been that way for as long as I know and then some. The trains have always been packed to the gills on Fridays with people like me visiting friends. I think we will reach a point where we really start to reel some of that in (and I think we already have made progress as it seems like so many people who live around me have lived in Chicago for a few years and came back) once we get a north/south metro line, and the compact east/west commercial streets in inner south city all "come on line," like Cherokee is doing now (I'm thinking of Meramec, and inner Chippewa...what am I forgetting). A huge chunk of urbanism in South St. Louis is somewhat dormant, but there , contiguous, and of high quality for the midwest and easily repaired with speckled infill as has been done all over the northside of Chicago.
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Last edited by Centropolis; Dec 16, 2011 at 2:28 AM.
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  #19  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2011, 2:20 AM
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I hate to bring up Portland, but when talking about young people and migrations of them, it is a city for that. I always joke here that it is hard to find a born and raised Portlander and that out of all my friends the ratio is about 2to5 or 1to5 for born and raised compared to the young population.

Also another factor that has been going on in Spokane, Wa this past few years is that I have noticed more young people sticking around rather than moving away to Seattle, Portland, or other larger cities in their early 20s because I think the bad economy is making it harder to want to move to another city, therefore keeping its youth culture within its city.

I imagine more cities in this country that were more known for having the youth move away to brighter bigger things have noticed more sticking around to make the most of the city they were raised in. Which for me, I think it is important to find the city you best fit in with, but I think it is good to also do your part to make your own city hip and exciting.
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Old Posted Dec 16, 2011, 3:01 AM
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For those of us on the ground living in St. Louis City, the tides have turned in the last few years for the better. Young people who live here want to be here. Ten years ago, people were apologetic about living in St. Louis-- now people are proud! As a business owner in the city, I talk to people from all over the metro area (and well beyond), and it's the suburbanites who seem to be embarrassed about not living in the city "yet"!

New, young, progressive aldermen are now in positions of power, and the transformation occurring in St. Louis is palpable. And goat314-- you are absolutely right-- transplants love St. Louis the most!

What I love most about St. Louis is that despite its undeniable upswing, it still retains its gritty edge.
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