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  #81  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 1:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Djeffery View Post
Plus, what are the seats like on GO now? Been a while, but I remember it basically like being on a city bus. Can't imagine spending hours sitting on them.
Metrolinx has been refurbishing rail cars, even just simple things like replacing the seat cushions. Same seat structure though, with the rigid posturing and no adjustability. They've also added plastic screens between adjacent seats, which is a bit constrictive but probably here for the long haul... and not great for long-haul travel.

This all seems like more of a trial run to me. Maybe it will pan out and lead to more service, but I don't think the travel times are going to lead to much "commuting"... quite right that it would be faster to drive between London and Aldershot if one wanted to get to/from downtown Toronto; I wonder if express GO bus service is being contemplated?

Also can't help thinking that maybe it's about doing VIA a favour so they can focus on one corridor between London and Toronto.
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  #82  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 1:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ScreamingViking View Post
This all seems like more of a trial run to me. Maybe it will pan out and lead to more service, but I don't think the travel times are going to lead to much "commuting"... quite right that it would be faster to drive between London and Aldershot if one wanted to get to/from downtown Toronto; I wonder if express GO bus service is being contemplated?
They've literally referred to it as "the first phase" in interviews and press releases. Much like how people think we can plant down HSR without anything existing before it, it's wise to start small and then build up from there.
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  #83  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 1:34 PM
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This is likely focused on intercity travel from London to Stratford, Kitchener, Guelph, etc., not Toronto-London service as much.

And yea, travel speeds will only improve if upgrades are made. The corridor from London to Kitchener is mostly limited to 50km/h because it's in such terrible shape. The train would be a whole lot faster if those tracks were upgraded to modern standards.
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  #84  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 3:14 PM
GreatTallNorth2 GreatTallNorth2 is offline
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Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
This is likely focused on intercity travel from London to Stratford, Kitchener, Guelph, etc., not Toronto-London service as much.
Except if I want to go from London to Stratford for a day trip, the train arrives at 6:20 am I believe. I'd rather take the train but wouldn't want to wake up at 5:00 am to go. If it was more frequent, I think we'd see a lot of day trips despite the slow trains.
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  #85  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 3:27 PM
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Ever since Metrolinx bought the Guelph Subd east of Kitchener, they've been doing a lot of work to improve the line that has mostly flown under the radar - crossing improvements, bridge replacements, and whatnot - and that should deal with the major slow zones east of Kitchener.

The point is that these have been projects Metrolinx has been able to do without major public consultation and political involvement. They have been small and incremental, but they are necessary improvements and are key to both faster service and eventual all-day two-way service.

I'm pretty sure that Metrolinx plans to buy the remainder of the Guelph Subd from CN, which will allow them to take a similar approach to improvements to London. It has been quite effective for Metrolinx to this point for other projects elsewhere in the GO network.
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  #86  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 4:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Djeffery View Post
As far as I know, there are multiple companies that own the track this will run on, at least from London to Kitchener, and the track doesn't support a very high speed. Even the VIA train on this route takes 3.5 hours to Toronto. I don't know what kind of demand the route needs to show to justify spending the money the upgrade the track, but I don't think one train a day each way is going to show the potential this route potentially has to justify the investment. Plus, what are the seats like on GO now? Been a while, but I remember it basically like being on a city bus. Can't imagine spending hours sitting on them.
CN owns and operates the full trackage from London to Kitchener. GEXR had a 20-year lease on the line which expired in 2018. Prior to then the trains would have dealt with CN from the London station to the junction, then GEXR from there to Kitchener.
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  #87  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 8:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
Well it's about time for GO to London.

Needless to say 4 hours to Toronto is truly ridiculous but few will take it to Toronto Union as most will still go by VIA. It will however be very useful for KW to London as there is a lot of traffic between the 2 and needless to say these speeds and frequency will increase greatly over the coming years. Also it will be beneficial for Londoners going to Pearson.

One of the best things about it is that as the speed and frequency increases and hence ridership, they may begin more express service to Union ie London/KW/Pearson/Union and this would really make a dent in VIA's ridership. London is the 4th busiest station in the VIA system and VIA can't afford to lose that lucrative market forcing them to FINALLY put some real money into the London/Aldershot/Union route.

It may not be much but may turn out to be the kick in the ass VIA needs to improve it's SWO service lest they lose market share on the segment of VIA that requires the least amount of public subsidy in terms of passengers carried per km travelled in the entire system.
You're dreaming in technicolor if you think VIA will make ANY good investments in the near future
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  #88  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 11:37 PM
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Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2 View Post
Except if I want to go from London to Stratford for a day trip, the train arrives at 6:20 am I believe. I'd rather take the train but wouldn't want to wake up at 5:00 am to go. If it was more frequent, I think we'd see a lot of day trips despite the slow trains.
And also important, you are there until about 7pm when the return train comes through.
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  #89  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 1:14 AM
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And also important, you are there until about 7pm when the return train comes through.
There are a number of things to do in Stratford.
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  #90  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:02 AM
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Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
There are a number of things to do in Stratford.
If I could spend one day in either Stratford or Okotoks, I’d pick Okotoks.

Stratford has enough to occupy several days and one day isn’t enough.
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  #91  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:23 AM
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It doesn't seem like that long ago that GO first expanded to KW and Barrie with similarly anemic scheduling. I imagine this will grow nicely with the amount of population growth we're seeing in SWO.

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Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
If I could spend one day in either Stratford or Okotoks, I’d pick Okotoks.

Stratford has enough to occupy several days and one day isn’t enough.
Unless you have mobility issues, I don't think thats true. There's very little to do in Stratford. I'm guessing there's nothing to do in Okotoks.
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  #92  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:31 AM
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Yeah Stratford is pretty boring unless you're into theatre, dining or watching small town drug dealers bike around town. However, there's plenty of prewar residential streets to walk or cycle up and down - does Stratford have a bike share?

The GO service is mostly for students to get between Brampton/KW and London. Maybe some old folks will use it to get to Stratford.
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  #93  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:38 AM
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Originally Posted by urbandreamer View Post
The GO service is mostly for students to get between Brampton/KW and London. Maybe some old folks will use it to get to Stratford.
A departure time of well before 6am would be a rather odd choice for a train service mostly aimed at students...
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  #94  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:44 AM
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Perhaps. But when I was a student I often went to London or Detroit overnight via Greyhound. London always felt like such a dead shithole at 3am on an early January morning.
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  #95  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:50 AM
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Originally Posted by urbandreamer View Post
Yeah Stratford is pretty boring unless you're into theatre, dining or watching small town drug dealers bike around town. However, there's plenty of prewar residential streets to walk or cycle up and down - does Stratford have a bike share?

The GO service is mostly for students to get between Brampton/KW and London. Maybe some old folks will use it to get to Stratford.
Not really, I get enough of him yelling at clouds on SSP.
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  #96  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2021, 3:21 AM
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https://www.blogto.com/travel/2021/1...running-today/

https://www.gotransit.com/static_fil...21/Table31.pdf

Today was the first day of GO train service to London ON. The platforms at London. St Marys and Stratford are too short for all cars to open. The platforms are also too low to be accessible, but they have a lift for those that need it.
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  #97  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2021, 1:18 PM
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Originally Posted by swimmer_spe View Post
https://www.blogto.com/travel/2021/1...running-today/

https://www.gotransit.com/static_fil...21/Table31.pdf

Today was the first day of GO train service to London ON. The platforms at London. St Marys and Stratford are too short for all cars to open. The platforms are also too low to be accessible, but they have a lift for those that need it.
GO's platforms are all low, even at Union Station -- it's always two steps up and down. The accessible car relies on a raised platform with a metal ramp to bridge the gap that one of the crew has to put down manually... those stations probably don't have that though?

Perhaps in the future this will change and all stations/trains will have level boarding. But it will be a huge undertaking. I think the issue has always been related to freight trains - can't have level platforms that are close to the doors to minimize the gaps because CN and CP would not be able to run their trains on those lines, and in most cases the stations don't have platforms dedicated strictly to passenger use.

Last edited by ScreamingViking; Oct 19, 2021 at 1:31 PM.
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  #98  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2021, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ScreamingViking View Post
GO's platforms are all low, even at Union Station -- it's always two steps up and down. The accessible car relies on a raised platform with a metal ramp to bridge the gap that one of the crew has to put down manually... those stations probably don't have that though?

Perhaps in the future this will change and all stations/trains will have level boarding. But it will be a huge undertaking. I think the issue has always been related to freight trains - can't have level platforms that are close to the doors to minimize the gaps because CN and CP would not be able to run their trains on those lines, and in most cases the stations don't have platforms dedicated strictly to passenger use.
On the GO website states they are going to be building those ramps. Since they are Via stations, they do have lifts that Via uses. I have always thought that a station should be on a siding. That would allow freight to pass them by.
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  #99  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2021, 6:04 PM
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Originally Posted by swimmer_spe View Post
I have always thought that a station should be on a siding. That would allow freight to pass them by.
That would be ideal. Some GO stations do have dedicated rails. The new West Harbour station in Hamilton has 2 sidings for passenger service, and on the Lakeshore East corridor passenger tracks are completely separate from freight between Pickering and Oshawa.

The land requirements mean it may not be possible on many parts of rail corridors, but for those with multiple tracks (especially 4 or more) there's no reason why at least one or two tracks can't be "reserved" for freight with a couple that offer easier access to train doors -- this would work in stations like Oakville (4 tracks), Clarkson (5), Mimico (5), and Aldershot (9 tracks!). There may be others on GO's other corridors. And I'm not sure what the plans are for Union Station's platforms, but there's no reason they can't be at door level (there are 2 tracks without platforms on the south side of the corridor, for pass-through trains).

Someone else may know, but I wonder if there are a legacy agreements with CN and CP to preserve the tracks and platform levels "just in case" every track needs to handle freight, even on the corridors Metrolinx now owns and supposedly controls.

The accessibility they offer is one thing. But they'd also help speed up boarding and alighting, and increase the safety of each.
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  #100  
Old Posted Oct 19, 2021, 7:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Urban_Sky View Post
A departure time of well before 6am would be a rather odd choice for a train service mostly aimed at students...
Agree and this is made even more bizarre by the fact that students are usually highly transit dependent and yet you can't get to London's VIA station that early in the morning in the city as the buses don't start rolling until 6:00 AM.
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