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  #1  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:19 PM
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downtown rail mostly elevated, some at-grade

in portland theres a short part of the light rail downtown thats elevated, people say it has amazing light rail. for light rail that is at-grade only it is.

what are some cities with mostly elevated rail downtown but no subways?
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  #2  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:33 PM
llamaorama llamaorama is offline
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Quote:
what are some cities with mostly elevated rail downtown but no subways?
In the actual CBD with only the strictest definition:

Chicago has the famous "L"
Miami has the MetroRail system and the Metro Mover.
Jacksonville, Florida has a mostly pointless monorail that doesn't go anywhere but I guess it counts.
Honolulu's new metro will have an elevated downtown segment

Cities with trains downtown and if they are elevated downtown -

Seattle- No
Portland - Not really except going up onto bridges
SF - Nope
Oakland - Nope
San Jose - No
Sacramento - No
LA - No
Long Beach - No
San Diego - No
Phoenix - No
Salt Lake City - Nah
Denver - Nein
Minneapolis - Not really except for the very end of the Blue Line
St Louis - Uh no
Chicago - Yeah def.
Cleveland - Nope
Pittsburgh - No
Dallas - Nah
Houston - No
Atlanta - No
New Orleans - No
Charlotte - No
Norfolk - No
Buffalo - Nah bro
Miami - Yes
Jacksonville - Yes
NYC - Not under strict definition, there are els in Brooklyn and elsewhere
Philly - Not under strict definition but there are el's
Honolulu(Under Construction) - Yes
San Juan - Doesn't even go downtown
Boston - No
Baltimore - No
Washington DC - No

Can anyone think of a rail system in the US I left out?
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  #3  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llamaorama View Post
In the actual CBD with only the strictest definition:

Chicago has the famous "L"
Miami has the MetroRail system and the Metro Mover.
Jacksonville, Florida has a mostly pointless monorail that doesn't go anywhere but I guess it counts.
Honolulu's new metro will have an elevated downtown segment

Cities with trains downtown and if they are elevated downtown -

Seattle- No
Portland - Not really except going up onto bridges
SF - Nope
Oakland - Nope
San Jose - No
Sacramento - No
LA - No
Long Beach - No
San Diego - No
Phoenix - No
Salt Lake City - Nah
Denver - Nein
Minneapolis - Not really except for the very end of the Blue Line
St Louis - Uh no
Chicago - Yeah def.
Cleveland - Nope
Pittsburgh - No
Dallas - Nah
Houston - No
Atlanta - No
New Orleans - No
Charlotte - No
Norfolk - No
Buffalo - Nah bro
Miami - Yes
Jacksonville - Yes
NYC - Not under strict definition, there are els in Brooklyn and elsewhere
Philly - Not under strict definition but there are el's
Honolulu(Under Construction) - Yes
San Juan - Doesn't even go downtown
Boston - No
Baltimore - No
Washington DC - No

Can anyone think of a rail system in the US I left out?
Detroit - Yes
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  #4  
Old Posted May 13, 2019, 3:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llamaorama View Post
In the actual CBD with only the strictest definition:

Chicago has the famous "L"
Miami has the MetroRail system and the Metro Mover.
Jacksonville, Florida has a mostly pointless monorail that doesn't go anywhere but I guess it counts.
Honolulu's new metro will have an elevated downtown segment

Cities with trains downtown and if they are elevated downtown -

Seattle- No
Portland - Not really except going up onto bridges
SF - Nope
Oakland - Nope
San Jose - No
Sacramento - No
LA - No
Long Beach - No
San Diego - No
Phoenix - No
Salt Lake City - Nah
Denver - Nein
Minneapolis - Not really except for the very end of the Blue Line
St Louis - Uh no
Chicago - Yeah def.
Cleveland - Nope
Pittsburgh - No
Dallas - Nah
Houston - No
Atlanta - No
New Orleans - No
Charlotte - No
Norfolk - No
Buffalo - Nah bro
Miami - Yes
Jacksonville - Yes
NYC - Not under strict definition, there are els in Brooklyn and elsewhere
Philly - Not under strict definition but there are el's
Honolulu(Under Construction) - Yes
San Juan - Doesn't even go downtown
Boston - No
Baltimore - No
Washington DC - No

Can anyone think of a rail system in the US I left out?
Technically, the El is elevated under the strict definition of Center City. After leaving 2nd Street, the El negotiates a left curve and emerges near the Ben Franklin Bridge, running in the median of I-95. The strictest definition of CC is river to river, Vine to South. Though the next stop is Spring Garden, the El is running elevated before and at Vine Street.

Here's the view from Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/place/2n...2!4d-75.142589
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  #5  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:38 PM
llamaorama llamaorama is offline
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I forgot about the People Mover!

Shame they never extended it and ended up with the streetcar instead.
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  #6  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:46 PM
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Las Vegas has that useless monorail system on the strip (that's not downtown though).


Maybe Manila?
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  #7  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 6:51 PM
llamaorama llamaorama is offline
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Las Vegas has that useless monorail system on the strip (that's not downtown though).
It's also barely on the strip, rather it is a couple blocks east of it IIRC. Given what a block is in Paradise, NV, that's pretty far away.
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  #8  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:00 PM
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doesnt chicago have some subways downtown and there probably isnt at-grade rail?

i was thinking in the whole world, maybe there isnt something like a portland but ahead of its time.
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  #9  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:08 PM
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chicago red and blue lines are subways downtown, yes


and actually starting and ending well outside of downtown, to be particular. The red line goes underground south of fullerton all the way to chinatown.

blue is under ground off and on on the northwest side and reemerges on the eisenhower expwy west of downtown
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  #10  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:25 PM
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Originally Posted by maru2501 View Post
chicago red and blue lines are subways downtown, yes


and actually starting and ending well outside of downtown, to be particular. The red line goes underground south of fullerton all the way to chinatown.

blue is under ground off and on on the northwest side and reemerges on the eisenhower expwy west of downtown
chicago is in a different level then light rail type cities. portland got some things right like not building a lot of freeways or wide streets. the worst part is downtown with the real slow trains. if they fixed that then they could have longer lines and fix the lines so they dont go through so many tight turns, longer trains too.
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  #11  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:39 PM
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NYC has more elevated track than people realize - approximately 40% of the system or 168 miles of track are above ground, mostly in the outer boroughs.
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  #12  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:43 PM
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I just thought of one very interesting exception from the above list, and that is Morgantown, West Virginia. It deserves an asterisk, because technically I don't think it runs on rails, and the cars are essentially just big enough for a moderately sized family... but it's still, for all intents and purposes, in the same category as the Jacksonville people mover.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan..._Rapid_Transit

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  #13  
Old Posted May 13, 2019, 5:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BnaBreaker View Post
I just thought of one very interesting exception from the above list, and that is Morgantown, West Virginia. It deserves an asterisk, because technically I don't think it runs on rails, and the cars are essentially just big enough for a moderately sized family... but it's still, for all intents and purposes, in the same category as the Jacksonville people mover.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan..._Rapid_Transit


Wow that's totally unexpected and cool.


Kind of reminds me of the Dorfbahn in the Austrian village of Serfaus: (which is entirely underground however)

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  #14  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:55 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by sbarn View Post
NYC has more elevated track than people realize - approximately 40% of the system or 168 miles of track are above ground, mostly in the outer boroughs.
But nothing is elevated even remotely close to the major business districts. The closest elevated trains to core areas of Manhattan are in Queens. And, maybe, if you want to count the train lines that cross the East River over the bridges instead of through a tunnel.
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  #15  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 8:11 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
But nothing is elevated even remotely close to the major business districts. The closest elevated trains to core areas of Manhattan are in Queens. And, maybe, if you want to count the train lines that cross the East River over the bridges instead of through a tunnel.
True, the elevated portions are beyond the core commercial areas, except for Long Island City / Queensboro Plaza.
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  #16  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 8:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbarn View Post
NYC has more elevated track than people realize - approximately 40% of the system or 168 miles of track are above ground, mostly in the outer boroughs.
True, but much of that isn't elevated.

Something like 40% of the system is non-subway, but that includes trenches (such as the N in Brooklyn and 5 in Bronx), embankments (the Q in Brooklyn, the A in furthest Queens) and elevateds. I would guess no more than 15-20% of the system sits on elevated structures. There are a lot of London-style trenches further out.
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  #17  
Old Posted May 14, 2019, 2:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
True, but much of that isn't elevated.

Something like 40% of the system is non-subway, but that includes trenches (such as the N in Brooklyn and 5 in Bronx), embankments (the Q in Brooklyn, the A in furthest Queens) and elevateds. I would guess no more than 15-20% of the system sits on elevated structures. There are a lot of London-style trenches further out.
True, I wasn't thinking about trenches or embankments - 20% elevated track is probably a good estimate, 15% sounds a little low.

These are the elevated portions of the subway that come to mind:

Brooklyn:
D in Borough Park & Bensonhurst
F in Kensington, Borough Park, Bensonhurst
JM in Williamsburg, Bushwick & BedStuy
2, 3, 4 in Brownsville
Q in Brighton Beach

Queens:
7 in LIC, Sunnyside, Jackson Heights
N, W in LIC & Astoria
A in the Rockaways

Bronx:
1 in Kingsbridge & Riverdale
4 in western portions of the Bronx
2, 5 in eastern portions of the Bronx
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  #18  
Old Posted May 13, 2019, 3:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbarn View Post
NYC has more elevated track than people realize - approximately 40% of the system or 168 miles of track are above ground, mostly in the outer boroughs.
Exactly.

We forget that once you get out of Manhattan, there are a good number of elevated rail lines.

In addition, I believe the 1,2,3 trains become elevated uptown of 125th St
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  #19  
Old Posted May 13, 2019, 3:40 PM
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In addition, I believe the 1,2,3 trains become elevated uptown of 125th St
The 1 train becomes elevated at Dyckman Street, which is on Manhattan's northern tip.

The 2 train becomes elevated at Jackson Street, in the Bronx (though goes underground and then in embankment near end).

The 3 train is all subway Uptown (but has an elevated portion in Brooklyn).
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  #20  
Old Posted May 12, 2019, 7:18 PM
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Denver has at-grade light rail and commuter rail lines downtown (no underground sections) with one above grade segment that carries the B and G lines over the S Platte River and a series of freight tracks just outside downtown.
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