Halifax Active Transportation

[OldDartmouthMark]

I would have thought that most people who want an e-bike would have already had a small motorcycle or scooter, but it appears that I am wrong on that account.

To you potential e-bikers: why would you consider an e-bike and not a motorcycle? Is it the lack of regulations/responsibility that goes along with a bicycle? The cost? The size/weight? What is it?

[Keith P.]

It's The Next Big Thing that all "urbanists" glom on to. The stench of BS you may smell near SGR and Queen today is emanating from the glass palace on the corner as the "Art of City Building" conference inside has concentrated the urban planners and wannabes all in one place. Some of the stuff being said is simply laughable. Example #1: "Park all cars 18" from the curb to induce traffic calming without added cost!" Jeepers.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

To you potential e-bikers: why would you consider an e-bike and not a motorcycle? Is it the lack of regulations/responsibility that goes along with a bicycle? The cost? The size/weight? What is it?

No special licensing requirements, you can ride them on bike paths, park them in bike parking (or wherever), you can pedal to get exercise when you want, and they're much cheaper. I also wouldn't feel very safe going at motorcycle speeds on a road. I would not ride an electric bike at 50 km/h or more, and you don't need the same protective gear when you're only going 10-20 km/h.

Then there are the advantages of electric over gas. For some reason I don't see a lot of electric motorcycles, although they must exist.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Ahhh makes sense.

Electric bikes do seem to gray the line between bicycles and motorcycles, though. I wonder if there will be issues in the future as they will most likely become better/faster.

Actually, just noticed that there are already issues with how to classify some e-bikes: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...tion-1.5278601

Reading a random article on the net, it does seem like the latest fad:
https://cyclingtips.com/2019/09/euro...-and-the-ugly/

I think it would have been safe to call Eurobike an e-mobility show with a few non-assisted bikes crammed into the crevasses. ...snip... And for the most part with each brand, their latest ‘e’ offering was getting all the attention.

It was kind of hilarious to read one person's comments below the article... the pushback from the 'purist' cyclists seems snobbish at best:

I'm just not interested in looking at these motorbikes any more, or reading about them. It was sort of "novel" a couple of years ago, now it just belongs somewhere else ( no offense guys, nice video etc etc )

It's about suffering, working, doing your best to go a little harder and enjoying that incredible rewarding feeling of having smashed a PB.

E-Bikes seem to want to go directly to the result without the process, without the involvement. They may get more people riding bikes, but I'm not sure they will get more people cycling.

...all from the same person, but seems to purvey the elitist attitude that sickens myself, at least. IMHO, it's not about proving how athletic you are, it's about getting from one place to another efficiently. If e-bikes help more people do it, then it can't be a bad thing.

It will be interesting to see where all this goes.

[MonctonRad]

The main problem I have with E-Bikes is the potential for theft.

They are reasonably expensive, which makes them a lucrative target for thieves, and at the same time pretty easy to steal (and conceal once stolen, like in the back of a van). I imagine they are also pretty easy to fence as well.

[Keith P.]

Cyclists seem to take pride in the hairshirts they so love to wear. Bizarre.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

The main problem I have with E-Bikes is the potential for theft.

They are reasonably expensive, which makes them a lucrative target for thieves, and at the same time pretty easy to steal (and conceal once stolen, like in the back of a van). I imagine they are also pretty easy to fence as well.

That's an aspect I hadn't considered. Sounds like a whole new opportunity out there for thieves, though one would think that standard bike locks might offer a similar level of deterrence as they do for regular bikes. But if a thief wants something, he will find a way to get it regardless...

How much do these things cost?

[OldDartmouthMark]

I thought this was interesting:
E-scooters are coming to Canada — but they're not as eco-friendly as you might think: study

After performing a life-cycle analysis of electric scooters, Johnson and his team determined the average greenhouse gas emissions per scooter mile traveled is just over 200 grams of CO2.

That's half the amount associated with a car, but 20 times that of a personal bicycle.

The problem, Johnson said, is that most people aren't using the scooters to replace car rides.

His team conducted a survey of scooter users in Raleigh and found 49 per cent would have biked or walked if they didn't have access to a scooter; 34 per cent would have used a car or ride-hailing service; 11 per cent would have taken a bus and seven per cent wouldn't have bothered at all.

That's because of what Johnson calls the "hidden environmental impacts" associated with scooters.

They are made from aluminum, steel and lithium-ion batteries, all of which take emissions to produce. Manufacturing is responsible for roughly half the scooters' carbon footprint, the study found, a high rates of theft and vandalism mean the scooters must frequently be replaced.

"A big reason for that is that these scooters have a relatively short lifetime. So if you think about the per-mile impacts, those materials and the manufacturing burdens carry a lot more weight," Johnson said.

But the biggest cost, he said, is moving the scooters around.

Every day, people have to drive around, pick up dead scooters, bring them to charging stations, and then distribute them around the city.

"There aren't the burdens of redistributing your personal bike," he said. "You drive your bike and you bring it home."

It does bring the question to mind as to where e-bikes fit in. Certainly they will have a larger carbon footprint than a regular bicycle, but are likely more durable than these scooters and are perhaps more likely to be owned by individuals rather than being distributed about in a share situation.

Food for thought..

[atbw]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

It does bring the question to mind as to where e-bikes fit in. Certainly they will have a larger carbon footprint than a regular bicycle, but are likely more durable than these scooters and are perhaps more likely to be owned by individuals rather than being distributed about in a share situation.

Food for thought..

Something else to consider with E-bikes is they have the potential to be much more useful than a scooter in terms of carrying loads. With a rack and panniers, lots of errands can be done on an e-bike, whereas with a scooter you're limited to a backpack. Scooters seem fun and easy for getting yourself places, but for grocery runs or just bringing some extra stuff, an e-bike is a solid alternative to a car for may trips.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by atbw

Something else to consider with E-bikes is they have the potential to be much more useful than a scooter in terms of carrying loads. With a rack and panniers, lots of errands can be done on an e-bike, whereas with a scooter you're limited to a backpack. Scooters seem fun and easy for getting yourself places, but for grocery runs or just bringing some extra stuff, an e-bike is a solid alternative to a car for may trips.

Interesting point. I'm wondering what it would do to battery consumption to hook up a small cargo trailer to one... then you could haul most small to moderate items that one would tend to put in their car trunk on a regular shopping trip.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by someone123

No special licensing requirements, you can ride them on bike paths, park them in bike parking (or wherever), you can pedal to get exercise when you want, and they're much cheaper. I also wouldn't feel very safe going at motorcycle speeds on a road. I would not ride an electric bike at 50 km/h or more, and you don't need the same protective gear when you're only going 10-20 km/h.

Then there are the advantages of electric over gas. For some reason I don't see a lot of electric motorcycles, although they must exist.

I fell over an article about one this morning:

https://www.harley-davidson.com/us/e.../livewire.html

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Interesting point. I'm wondering what it would do to battery consumption to hook up a small cargo trailer to one... then you could haul most small to moderate items that one would tend to put in their car trunk on a regular shopping trip.

As if riding bicycles on busy, congested streets wasn't hazardous enough, now you want to hitch a cargo trailer to one? Good luck with that.

I think those bike trailers I see for infants are bad enough and should be banned for the sake of the poor tykes forced to ride in them. Cargo trailers are quite possibly more deadly for the rider as the added weight would slow them down even further and make the assembly much less maneuverable.

[Keith P.]

In other news, Colorado cyclists are now waging war against pedestrians, hikers and runners as well as the evil car. I wonder how long it will take before this spreads here and is embraced by the perpetually disaffected cycling community?

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens...rail-1.5286813

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

As if riding bicycles on busy, congested streets wasn't hazardous enough, now you want to hitch a cargo trailer to one? Good luck with that.

I think those bike trailers I see for infants are bad enough and should be banned for the sake of the poor tykes forced to ride in them. Cargo trailers are quite possibly more deadly for the rider as the added weight would slow them down even further and make the assembly much less maneuverable.

FWIW, I don't think infants or small children should be carried on any bicycle - too dangerous and the child has no way to save themselves nor any protection other than one of those better-than-nothing helmets that are made for bicyclists.

But, I'm talking about e-bikes, which would have the advantage of added torque to offset the extra weight of the trailer/load. Of course one would presume upgraded brakes would be a good addition. And, not a load of patio stones from Home Depot, but perhaps an average grocery order which can be voluminous in physical dimensions but not all that heavy/dense.

And, we're talking about bicycle lanes and cycle-centric streets, though large trucks and buses regularly plug up busy streets, so a cycle/trailer can't provide more of an issue than those.

Just musing mostly...

[atbw]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

FWIW, I don't think infants or small children should be carried on any bicycle - too dangerous and the child has no way to save themselves nor any protection other than one of those better-than-nothing helmets that are made for bicyclists.

But, I'm talking about e-bikes, which would have the advantage of added torque to offset the extra weight of the trailer/load. Of course one would presume upgraded brakes would be a good addition. And, not a load of patio stones from Home Depot, but perhaps an average grocery order which can be voluminous in physical dimensions but not all that heavy/dense.

And, we're talking about bicycle lanes and cycle-centric streets, though large trucks and buses regularly plug up busy streets, so a cycle/trailer can't provide more of an issue than those.

Just musing mostly...

Lots of cargo bike options out there could probably handle a few patio stones tbh. Electic assist going uphill and hydraulic brakes going downhill.

[IanWatson]

The tender is out for the Hollis Street bike lane. Required completion by June 15, 2020.

[Keith P.]

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by atbw

Lots of cargo bike options out there could probably handle a few patio stones tbh. Electic assist going uphill and hydraulic brakes going downhill.

I wasn't sure exactly the type of bike you were referring to until I saw this:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/c...ries-1.4437511

But in many cities around the world, including Montreal and Vancouver, a different technology is being tried out: electric cargo bikes.

While Amazon is testing drones to deliver just 2.3 kilograms, cargo bikes can carry up to 350 kilograms — more than some fully loaded vans are carrying, advocates say. An electric motor helps the operator with loads that are too hard to move by pedalling alone.

Neat! Looks like a good solution, though using one in icy/snowy conditions could prove challenging.

[Keith P.]

350 kg? Good luck for the operator unloading that by him/herself. Seems quite silly really. Use the appropriate tool for the job.

[Agricola]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

350 kg? Good luck for the operator unloading that by him/herself. Seems quite silly really. Use the appropriate tool for the job.

If one person can unload said cargo from a cube van , what is the difference in unloading it from the back of a cargo bike?