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  #281  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 1:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin7 View Post
Bar owner is a hero. Count me among those who believe we are better off with narrower, more varied buildings. Don't turn Philly into Phoenix.



The corner property is owned by the same developer, yes. I don't recall any announced projects for the site, but I could have missed it.
Good point
As long as we don't end up with 20 floor blank walls
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  #282  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Justin7 View Post
Bar owner is a hero. Count me among those who believe we are better off with narrower, more varied buildings. Don't turn Philly into Phoenix.
I don't think we're in any danger of that.

As noted above me though, the 20 floor blank wall thing is an issue. That one building on Walnut irks the hell out of me and I would hate to see that become a trend. Is there a way to zone that out? Like, a certain number of floors above existing directly attached buildings requires a small setback somewhere in the shared wall line with windows.
     
     
  #283  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mja View Post
That one building on Walnut irks the hell out of me and I would hate to see that become a trend. Is there a way to zone that out? Like, a certain number of floors above existing directly attached buildings requires a small setback somewhere in the shared wall line with windows.
You have the same type of build on S. 16th Street next to Monk's.
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  #284  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 1:15 PM
PHLtoNYC PHLtoNYC is online now
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Originally Posted by mja View Post
I don't think we're in any danger of that.

As noted above me though, the 20 floor blank wall thing is an issue. That one building on Walnut irks the hell out of me and I would hate to see that become a trend. Is there a way to zone that out? Like, a certain number of floors above existing directly attached buildings requires a small setback somewhere in the shared wall line with windows.
It's almost always due to party / property walls, they are everywhere in Manhattan. Unless the neighboring structures are zoned to disallow overbuilds, then that is what we get.

I can't think of many ways around it, except curtailing overbuilds (which I don't want). Or possibly faux windows or decorative cast concrete party walls, which would be costly. If neighboring structures have lower zoning overbuild heights, then you could add side windows to the upper floors, but that scenario would be unusual.
     
     
  #285  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 2:01 PM
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Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC View Post
It's almost always due to party / property walls, they are everywhere in Manhattan. Unless the neighboring structures are zoned to disallow overbuilds, then that is what we get.

I can't think of many ways around it, except curtailing overbuilds (which I don't want). Or possibly faux windows or decorative cast concrete party walls, which would be costly. If neighboring structures have lower zoning overbuild heights, then you could add side windows to the upper floors, but that scenario would be unusual.
mja is proposing a setback from the property line so windows can be added. I think that is a reasonable suggestion but it will come at the cost of lost square footage.
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  #286  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 3:05 PM
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mja is proposing a setback from the property line so windows can be added. I think that is a reasonable suggestion but it will come at the cost of lost square footage.
Right. It wouldn't even have to extend the whole length of the party wall, perhaps a small break near the center to create some visual interest or something. Anything to break up massive blank walls.
     
     
  #287  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 4:21 PM
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Are there any renders from the bar direction? Is it going to be a blank wall for this reason? I would imagine the bar property would have an overbuild height limit that they could put windows past, especially since the developer owns the lot next door.
     
     
  #288  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 4:33 PM
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Originally Posted by PurpleWhiteOut View Post
Are there any renders from the bar direction? Is it going to be a blank wall for this reason? I would imagine the bar property would have an overbuild height limit that they could put windows past, especially since the developer owns the lot next door.
Go back to page 6 - all the pics from the CDR are there.
Only the south side (back of this building) will have panels - a portion of blank wall.
     
     
  #289  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2021, 5:50 PM
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The angled façade on the bar side would appear to address the concern about future development on the bar site.
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  #290  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2021, 12:33 PM
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  #291  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2021, 2:01 PM
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^ Actually a good example of a building responding well to its surroundings. Needing to account for the shared property line results in a more interesting building than we'd likely see if this was able to fill the block.

(Still not happy about the south facade.)
     
     
  #292  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2021, 2:39 AM
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It is a very nice project.
IMO a little short for this section of Market. and that's a dead horse
Definitely pleased with this project.
It will transform Market here.
I'm thinking it will be very photogenic!
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Last edited by SEFTA; Sep 18, 2021 at 2:55 AM.
     
     
  #293  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2021, 12:20 PM
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  #294  
Old Posted Sep 20, 2021, 1:51 PM
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  #295  
Old Posted Sep 25, 2021, 1:45 AM
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2222 Market Street Nearly Topped Out In Center City West





Read/view more here:
https://phillyyimby.com/2021/09/2222...city-west.html
     
     
  #296  
Old Posted Sep 25, 2021, 2:27 AM
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That was quick.
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Philadelphia Transportation Thread: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=164129
     
     
  #297  
Old Posted Sep 25, 2021, 7:53 PM
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Did the design for this change? The rendering on the first page depicts the west side of the building with bump outs or cantilevers (not sure the right term) every few floors. As it is now, the west side is completely flat. I hope that aspect of the design didn't get value engineered out, I thought it looked super cool.
     
     
  #298  
Old Posted Sep 26, 2021, 1:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Insoluble View Post
Did the design for this change? The rendering on the first page depicts the west side of the building with bump outs or cantilevers (not sure the right term) every few floors. As it is now, the west side is completely flat. I hope that aspect of the design didn't get value engineered out, I thought it looked super cool.
That is a really good observation. Compare the original renderings. (first posts from page 1 of this thread) to the CDR renderings from January 2020 (page 5 of this thread). The west side of the building is much more flat than the original renderings depicted. Now I am not sure what to expect based on what we are seeing from the current pictures which look like a tall flat wall.
     
     
  #299  
Old Posted Sep 26, 2021, 1:21 AM
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Unless it’s NOT nearly topped out and about to start on those setbacks
     
     
  #300  
Old Posted Sep 26, 2021, 1:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Frontst17 View Post
Unless it’s NOT nearly topped out and about to start on those setbacks
I should have said page 6 of this thread for the CDR link (June 24, 2020 post).

In any case, upon further inspection I think you are right. This is not at the topping off level. If you look at the renderings, you can divide the building into 6 distinct sections. The west wall is relatively flat through the first four. I think we are currently looking at the steel for those four sections. So now we get the more meaningful setback, and then two more sections to go.
     
     
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