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  #1401  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2020, 5:17 PM
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Originally Posted by SkyHigher View Post
Yeh shame they look horrid. Nice spikes to stop the pigeons though.
Looks like London's Cheesegrater building's evil twin.
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  #1402  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2020, 6:22 PM
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<wrong thread>

Last edited by Zapatan; Jul 7, 2020 at 7:38 PM.
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  #1403  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2020, 8:17 PM
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Originally Posted by thoughtcriminal View Post
Looks like London's Cheesegrater building's evil twin.
That's because architects are thinking about Di Fara Pizza when designing NY towers. You can change an architect, but once you get a taste of Neapolitan pies from Di Fara's, cheese graters will never leave the mind!

On a side note, Chris recommends this place: https://www.difarapizzany.com/

Some people have to go to Mecca once in their lives, well... if your in NYC, this is a must!!!
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  #1404  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 2:11 AM
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https://seekingalpha.com/article/436...all-transcript

Vornado Realty Trust (VNO) CEO Steven Roth on Q2 2020 Results - Earnings Call Transcript

Aug. 4, 2020



Quote:
Michael Bilerman

It's Michael Bilerman here with Manny. Steve, in your commentary, you said it was a great time to be looking through the fog and putting capital to work. And I wanted to know how you think about that from a Vornado perspective? And you think about the Facebook deal now being official, the progress you've made on PENN 1 and PENN 2, would you be more aggressive in, let's say, take down Hotel Penn to position yourself for the eventual next cycle. I guess, what are you thinking about in terms of putting incremental capital to work?

Steven Roth

First of all, we're in great shape, okay. We have a - we have an enormous amount of liquidity on our balance sheet, that liquidity is growing. The Farley Building basically takes a multi-billion dollar asset out of risk and puts it into secure - into the secure financial asset.

.....Your comment specifically went to the Hotel Penn. I don't really have much to say about that except that, as we continue to march - to march along from the Farley Building to 2 PENN, to 1 PENN, et cetera, the Hotel Penn is arguably one of the top two or three development sites that are available in the city. By the way, at 350 Park Avenue, many of the people in the marketplace think is the single best development site. But be as it may be. I couldn't resist getting the plug in.

So - the issue is that Hotel Penn, in order to execute on that, you have to pay par. In other words, you have to build the building and view - the land has a certain value and you're paying par for that, okay. It's not impossible that in this cycle, which I think is going to be a soft cycle for a while that our capital will be able to attract a transaction or other transaction where we will be able to buy great assets at less than par. So we have - we have all the capital we need for our development project - development program.
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  #1405  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 2:40 AM
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Based on that transcript, Steven Roth speaks almost exactly like Trump.
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  #1406  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 2:44 AM
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Sounds like a long term play, with Hotel Penn, but one that will be there when they need it. Saving the cake for later.
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  #1407  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 3:02 AM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
Sounds like a long term play, with Hotel Penn, but one that will be there when they need it. Saving the cake for later.
Yeah, they're gonna finish 1 and 2 Penn Plaza first, and move on from there. 15 Penn is still in the market should a tenant present itself. But Vornado has a lot of pieces in play, including the rezoning of the Empire Station district.

This is marked as site 7.


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  #1408  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 12:40 PM
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In my opinion Vornado speaks a lot and does little. Is still struggling with plans for 1 and 2 Penn Plaza. If we consider that Vornado has many new potential sites in the Empire Station district, given the slowness with which it proceeds with the new projects, I do not know if Vornado succeeds in completing some new towers in that district. I have many doubts about it.

Now after 1 and 2 Penn Plaza, in my opinion Vornado should focus on Sites 7 and 8 where with 5.2 million sf could build two large towers of 1,400 ft and 1,250 ft high with a hotel inside and large commercial spaces.

I would also sell sites 4 and 5 and focus on the 350 Park Avenue project.

Finally, on site 6 could be built a tower of + 1,000 ft tall.
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  #1409  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 2:13 PM
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I hope they offer competitive rates. While we are essentially looking at the future, long term for these parcels, that is an incredible amount of office commitment, even with the mixed used functionality. I wonder if they would consider with some of these parcels upping the hotel component and even the residential g.s.f.. Not that I'm being pessimistic, but I could see it being a big challenge to fill these towers (Penn Area) given so much going on in Midtown East and Hudson Yards.

Unless maybe the strategy for the office component is to get smaller commitments versus let's say a big tenant deal (someone taking 400-500k or more of space).

Hopefully they poach big to get tenants for the future. The general area is as prime as it gets, but competitive.

Hopefully some of these future towers could be built on spec.
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  #1410  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 2:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Sky88 View Post
In my opinion Vornado speaks a lot and does little. Is still struggling with plans for 1 and 2 Penn Plaza.
Which is why you should probably think less, and read more. It has been repeated on this forum that work on 1 and 2 Penn Plaza (which has long been underway, and nearing completion at 1) was being backed by the proceeds from the extremely successful 220 Central Park South. It isn't "struggling" with anything.



Quote:
If we consider that Vornado has many new potential sites in the Empire Station district, given the slowness with which it proceeds with the new projects, I do not know if Vornado succeeds in completing some new towers in that district. I have many doubts about it.
Vornado is in position to build, and will build when they can generate the rents desired. In other words, when the time is right, which it now is. That they were able to keep the Hotel Pennsylvania open is one reason they can abide their time on this project. Otherwise, 15 Penn was the first major proposal to attract a major tenant to Manhattan's west side in this era, although that later fell apart due to the financial crisis. If not for that, this tower would have been built already.



https://www.nysun.com/business/merri...midtown/60427/

Quote:
Merrill Lynch May Relocate to Midtown

By JULIE SATOW
August 14, 2007

Merrill Lynch is inching closer to a deal to relocate its headquarters to Midtown from Lower Manhattan. The investment bank, which has been headquartered downtown since its founding in 1914, has exchanged documents detailing a potential deal with Vornado Realty Trust to be the anchor tenant at a new office tower it plans to build across from Madison Square Garden.

Merrill Lynch is "trading paper with Vornado now" to relocate to a proposed 2.5 million-square-foot office tower at the site of the Hotel Pennsylvania, a real estate professional close to the negotiations said.

While Merrill does appear to be moving ahead with Vornado, there is no term sheet on the table. The investment bank also has six more years before its lease expires, and it is in ongoing discussions with Silverstein Properties about possibly relocating to one of the new towers at the World Trade Center site. Its current landlord at the World Financial Center, Brookfield Properties, is also working hard to keep its tenant, even proposing to build the bank a new 500,000-square-foot trading pavilion attached to Tower 2.


http://www.nypost.com/p/news/busines...3388CC0A85AC3C

Quote:
Merrill Lynch execs would prefer to be at Vornado Realty Trust's Hotel Pennsylvania site opposite Madison Square Garden, sources told The Post.

While Brookfield Properties and Battery Park City officials have been able to enlarge their proposed trading floor addition by eating into the lobby of 2 World Financial Center, it would still mean relocating all of the employees for three to four years, as the investment bank doesn't want to endure a disruptive floor-by-floor renovation job.

"What Larry [Silverstein] has decked up financially is not superior to [Vornado's] Hotel Pennsylvania, and it's not big enough," our source said.

Top execs are expected to meet with city officials within a week to chomp the numbers and the land-use review time frame on the 3 million square-footer proposed by Vornado.
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  #1411  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 4:20 PM
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Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
Which is why you should probably think less, and read more. It has been repeated on this forum that work on 1 and 2 Penn Plaza (which has long been underway, and nearing completion at 1) was being backed by the proceeds from the extremely successful 220 Central Park South. It isn't "struggling" with anything.





Vornado is in position to build, and will build when they can generate the rents desired. In other words, when the time is right, which it now is. That they were able to keep the Hotel Pennsylvania open is one reason they can abide their time on this project. Otherwise, 15 Penn was the first major proposal to attract a major tenant to Manhattan's west side in this era, although that later fell apart due to the financial crisis. If not for that, this tower would have been built already.



https://www.nysun.com/business/merri...midtown/60427/





http://www.nypost.com/p/news/busines...3388CC0A85AC3C
After Merrill Lynch it was the turn of Facebook as the anchor tenant of the 2.8-million-square-foot, but nothing materialized. It was MAY 7, 2020. The truth that Vornado revolves around the two projects -1 and 2 Penn Plaza- and nothing more.
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  #1412  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 6:57 PM
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^^^^

They are in a good position to build, with conditions that minimize risk and make any sort of capital expenditure in the future worthwhile with respect to Penn 1/2.

This is a prime location, super prime... and eventually, it will manifest in some form or another. The positive position only aids its prospects along with the developers stance at the moment and going forward.

I'd look to the success of Manhattan West and the Hudson Yards as a performance indicator for the general area. Right next to Penn, and you have an added bonus. Hopefully they are competitive with thier rates, even if there is an added figure to the area exclusivity per say, but not enough to have prospects bounce to non-Vornado properties.
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  #1413  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 7:50 PM
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15 Penn Plaza would be nearly a decade old at this point, if not for the financial collapse in 2008. Merrill Lynch had a preliminary lease signed.

In any case, I have no doubt this tower will rise in the coming years, though wouldn't be surprised if 350 Park gets developed first. But I bet you the 15 Penn anchor tenant will be tech, while the 350 Park anchor tenant will be finance.
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  #1414  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 11:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sky88 View Post
After Merrill Lynch it was the turn of Facebook as the anchor tenant of the 2.8-million-square-foot, but nothing materialized. It was MAY 7, 2020. The truth that Vornado revolves around the two projects -1 and 2 Penn Plaza- and nothing more.
I see you obviously don't know much about Vornado, or what's going on in the city. So I won't waste my time, other than to tell you that you're just wrong.
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  #1415  
Old Posted Aug 6, 2020, 12:10 AM
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Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
I see you obviously don't know much about Vornado, or what's going on in the city. So I won't waste my time, other than to tell you that you're just wrong.

... but just for the record, here are 402 pages of he is wrong from jump street:


http://books.vno.com/books/mzcd/#p=1
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  #1416  
Old Posted Aug 6, 2020, 3:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
... but just for the record, here are 402 pages of he is wrong from jump street:


http://books.vno.com/books/mzcd/#p=1

Of course. All of these big companies are in it for the long haul. The city will always be a great place to do business, through all the ups and downs. That's why so many see it as a good investment.
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  #1417  
Old Posted Aug 25, 2020, 3:06 AM
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After everything we've seen, I think there will be yet another redesign. Looking at the rezoning that is proposed for the Empire Station, we now see the Manhattan Mall being upzoned to accommodate a tower the size of 15 Penn. In fact, if you look at the proposed zoning, both towers, on paper, are nearly identical. But it's the retail component of 200,000 sf each that suggest to me a redesign. The combined 400,000 st of retail is nearly double what is currently at the Manhattan Mall site.











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  #1418  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2021, 8:40 PM
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  #1419  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2021, 8:48 PM
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can we nip this "side core" concept at the bud? Blank walls on supertalls = bad.



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  #1420  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2021, 9:06 PM
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Is this Brutalist?
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