SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2

[DTSDguy]

Downtown Development Map
Hi all, does anyone know how to access the map? The site below is not working for me any longer, is it a paid site now?

https://www.arcgis.com/sharing/oauth...serOrgUrl=true

[aekrid]

Originally Posted by DTSDguy

Downtown Development Map
Hi all, does anyone know how to access the map? The site below is not working for me any longer, is it a paid site now?

https://www.arcgis.com/sharing/oauth...serOrgUrl=true

The city migrated the site, here is the new link. https://sandiego.maps.arcgis.com/app...800c6d55944c09

[Will O' Wisp]

Originally Posted by Will O' Wisp

The Airport is so close to final approval of T1, I can almost taste it. Shovels in the ground by December boys! There's going to be a video walkthough of the latest render released soon which I think you guys will really enjoy, be on the lookout for it

Hope you guys enjoy!

• Video Link

[SamFlood]

Across the street on Harbor Island it looks like Mobile construction offices are set up.

[dl3000]

Originally Posted by Will O' Wisp

Hope you guys enjoy!

• Video Link

YESSSS! I was looking forward to this!

It's growing on me. I would have liked more glass on the airside like the early renderings, but I guess that adds to the cooling demand. The cyber truck cameo is funny.

Anything beats the two rotundas and whatever you wanna call gates 1 and 2, and this will be excellent for the whole facility. I think this is full buildout of the gate count then, right? On to Miramar!!!

[Will O' Wisp]

Originally Posted by dl3000

YESSSS! I was looking forward to this!

It's growing on me. I would have liked more glass on the airside like the early renderings, but I guess that adds to the cooling demand. The cyber truck cameo is funny.

Anything beats the two rotundas and whatever you wanna call gates 1 and 2, and this will be excellent for the whole facility. I think this is full buildout of the gate count then, right? On to Miramar!!!

Those renderings were very, very early. Practically no architectural work had been done at that point, the renderings were designed more for ascetics than actual function. The roof is too tall for a structure that close to the runway, the support columns are too thin for such a large interior void, and the interior is a mess (all of the security lines, restaurants/shops, and bathrooms are shoved into the middle of the building to maintain that hollow greenhouse look).

The full buildout of 63 gates is actually more than San Diego needs, the gate capacity outweighs the capacity of a single runway. If/when Terminal 2 east is renovated a few gates will be deleted.

[Streamliner]

Originally Posted by Will O' Wisp

The full buildout of 63 gates is actually more than San Diego needs, the gate capacity outweighs the capacity of a single runway. If/when Terminal 2 east is renovated a few gates will be deleted.

Yes once this is all done Terminal 2 East will be the ugly duckling of the airport.

[mello]

Originally Posted by Streamliner

Yes once this is all done Terminal 2 East will be the ugly duckling of the airport.

Just watched the whole video and not to be a downer, I'm very underwhelmed. Is this what it is actually going to look like? Nothing unique about it, bland architecture, looks super generic. I'm hoping the finished product will look different. Like Will said where is the glass on the airside, looks like a Terminal at Karachi International from the runway

[Will O' Wisp]

Originally Posted by mello

Just watched the whole video and not to be a downer, I'm very underwhelmed. Is this what it is actually going to look like? Nothing unique about it, bland architecture, looks super generic. I'm hoping the finished product will look different. Like Will said where is the glass on the airside, looks like a Terminal at Karachi International from the runway

Hey, Karachi International is pretty nice!



The rendering is accurate to the geometry, but doesn't include cladding, paint, artwork, etc. That will effect the final look somewhat.

But between the height restrictions, limited ground space, and CA earthquake laws there are some pretty significant constraints to how architecturally daring you can be while still providing for the thousands of passengers that will use this everyday. This is, ultimately, a piece of transportation infrastructure after all. Functionality comes first.

[HurricaneHugo]

Yeah. I've been to a lot of airports and wouldn't be able to tell you architectural details of the inside of one. Doubt I'll recognize any from the inside, save for O'Hare and it's flags. (I love flags).

[SDCAL]

Originally Posted by Will O' Wisp

The full buildout of 63 gates is actually more than San Diego needs, the gate capacity outweighs the capacity of a single runway. If/when Terminal 2 east is renovated a few gates will be deleted.

Are there any recent studies that project when we will run out of runway capacity at this site? I’m guessing it’s decades away if they are putting this much $$ into this airport.

Also, not only are we limited by one short runway, we are also limited by curfews. If you look on flight radar, we are the only urban area our size that doesn’t have flights incoming in the middle of the night.

Not to be a downer, but this seems like it might be looked at as a big fail in a decade or two if we are starting to reach capacity. People will scratch their head and wonder why the city was focused on this instead of planning for the long-term future.

[Will O' Wisp]

Originally Posted by SDCAL

Are there any recent studies that project when we will run out of runway capacity at this site? I’m guessing it’s decades away if they are putting this much $$ into this airport.

Also, not only are we limited by one short runway, we are also limited by curfews. If you look on flight radar, we are the only urban area our size that doesn’t have flights incoming in the middle of the night.

Not to be a downer, but this seems like it might be looked at as a big fail in a decade or two if we are starting to reach capacity. People will scratch their head and wonder why the city was focused on this instead of planning for the long-term future.

Capacity is a squishy science, and demand forecasting even more so, but the last major study showed the airport will begin facing major capacity constraints by 2024, although these could be alleviated somewhat by changes in fleet mix and scheduling. However by 2035 these constraints will likely prevent any further increases in passenger counts. This was pre-COVID though.

But then, there just aren't any feasible scenarios where the current San Diego International is wholesale replaced within the next 30+ years. You name a potential location for a new airport and I guarantee it has already been studied and rejected. Decades spent refusing to upgrade the terminals at SDIA in favor of study after study of alternative airport locations is how we ended up with the cramped, crowded, and inefficient Terminal 1 we have today.

[Filambata]

Super excited about the following game-changing developments over the next decade!

*Chula Vist Bayfront Development
*Riverwalk Mission Valley
*SDSU West Campus
*IQHQ RaDD
*Ballpark Village
*Midway/Sports Arena Redevelopment
*SPAWAR Redevelopment
*Millenia Chula Vista

[dl3000]

Originally Posted by Will O' Wisp

Capacity is a squishy science, and demand forecasting even more so, but the last major study showed the airport will begin facing major capacity constraints by 2024, although these could be alleviated somewhat by changes in fleet mix and scheduling. However by 2035 these constraints will likely prevent any further increases in passenger counts. This was pre-COVID though.

But then, there just aren't any feasible scenarios where the current San Diego International is wholesale replaced within the next 30+ years. You name a potential location for a new airport and I guarantee it has already been studied and rejected. Decades spent refusing to upgrade the terminals at SDIA in favor of study after study of alternative airport locations is how we ended up with the cramped, crowded, and inefficient Terminal 1 we have today.

Thanks for consolidating that info. The last study for relocation said Miramar or bust, and unless and until the Marines’ mission there changes, not sure how palatable that would be to the electorate. Last time there was a vote we were in the Iraq War and SD politics was different. Books could be written about the missed opportunities for airports in SD. Maybe there already is one. Montgomery Field is a remnant of a large land reserved that early leaders had earmarked for a future airport, the City passed on Miramar back in the day, etc etc. I’m no expert on that. Sorry about all the airport talk. I got into airports because I wanted SD to have skyscrapers and wondered why not and stumbled into airports. Grateful to have Will here to give us the fantastic intel.

[SDCAL]

Originally Posted by dl3000

Thanks for consolidating that info. The last study for relocation said Miramar or bust, and unless and until the Marines’ mission there changes, not sure how palatable that would be to the electorate. Last time there was a vote we were in the Iraq War and SD politics was different. Books could be written about the missed opportunities for airports in SD. Maybe there already is one. Montgomery Field is a remnant of a large land reserved that early leaders had earmarked for a future airport, the City passed on Miramar back in the day, etc etc. I’m no expert on that. Sorry about all the airport talk. I got into airports because I wanted SD to have skyscrapers and wondered why not and stumbled into airports. Grateful to have Will here to give us the fantastic intel.

Agree thanks to Will for posting this info!

It seems the city has relegated itself to not doing anything until the public feels the impact. What I mean by this is, the city seems to feel the only way the airport will ever be moved is if there is pressure from the public, and the only way there will be pressure from the public is if (God forbid) there’s a major air disaster here or if things start getting backed-up and people start encountering significant wait times because the one runway can’t keep up with demand.

Other possibilities could be corporate/economic pressure or people complaining if we need to start lifting curfews in order to accommodate more air traffic.

Of course, a competent city would solve the issue well before anything like this happens, but our city has shown grotesque incompetence on a massive scale over the last many decades on this issue.

Your point about the Miramar vote is an interesting one. It was never binding in the first place, but the city felt having the public behind them would be the only leverage powerful enough to convince military leadership. You are correct that a lot has changed since then, I’m not sure how people would vote now. But most people only live in the moment, and since there aren’t really any tangible problems travelers noticeably encounter now, a lot of people wouldn’t support moving the airport. They don’t consider the huge amount of time it would take to plan, get permits, construct, etc. We are probably talking a decade or more from the point a decision is made to having an actual airport. That’s why waiting until there’s tangible problems with capacity is so dangerous, because even when it gets to that point, we will have a decade more to deal with it.

I’m wondering if our city has ever tried (or would try) help from Washington on this issue. Both from a military and infrastructure perspective. Having some decisions from Washington D.C. to move Miramar and provide some funding through infrastructure could help “shield” some of the public backlash our local leaders fear. Anyway, that’s my airport rant for the day

[SDCAL]

Any news of 7th/Market, the Ritz Carlton/ Cisterra project?

I got excited the other day because I saw workers at the parking lot and thought they were removing the parking sign. They were just fixing/replacing it. I’m guessing that means it’s going to be remaining a parking lot for the foreseeable future?

I’m wondering how long this one can fester before it would need to update plans, etc ? It’s now about 6 years since the original plans were announced and the renderings seem pretty much the same with some minor tweaks.

[Streamliner]

Originally Posted by SDCAL

I’m wondering if our city has ever tried (or would try) help from Washington on this issue. Both from a military and infrastructure perspective. Having some decisions from Washington D.C. to move Miramar and provide some funding through infrastructure could help “shield” some of the public backlash our local leaders fear. Anyway, that’s my airport rant for the day

Although we're not a military town anymore, the vague idea that we need to support our troops (aka the military's needs aka the base itself) would be hard to overcome. That, combined with the NIMBYism of the wealthy north county types that would be most affected by the airport, I am pretty pessimistic about getting an airport at Miramar.

[mello]

Originally Posted by SDCAL

Any news of 7th/Market, the Ritz Carlton/ Cisterra project?

Hmm Cisterra is still acting like a ground breaking is eminent and that financing is just an inch away. Like a football team with first down at the 1 yard line, oh they will score...

I do have interesting news on the huge parking lot caddy corner to Vantage Point and Symphony towers on 8th and B. I parked there on Monday and an employee came out to her car and said her company is looking for new places for them to park because construction is about to start soon on that lot

Anyone hear about this?

[aekrid]

Originally Posted by mello

Hmm Cisterra is still acting like a ground breaking is eminent and that financing is just an inch away. Like a football team with first down at the 1 yard line, oh they will score...

I do have interesting news on the huge parking lot caddy corner to Vantage Point and Symphony towers on 8th and B. I parked there on Monday and an employee came out to her car and said her company is looking for new places for them to park because construction is about to start soon on that lot

Anyone hear about this?

Likely Bosa's 8th and B project. 40 stories, 514 apartments. Not much more info on it.

[SAN Man]

First post, occasional lurker from time to time to see what's being built.

With 9 days until the opening of the Blue Line extension, is anybody else going out on opening day to ride and document the experience?