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  #21  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 4:44 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
What could have been has been botched so badly that it will be almost impossible to correct without some major public oriented development that will attract the masses back to downtown. What could that be?
It doesn't have to be one thing.

It can be a simple rule: You want to build something downtown? Great. Now make it face the street and interact with it.

If it doesn't do that, it doesn't get approved. No exceptions. Ever.

That would mean growing some balls, which cheap, small-minded Ottawa has a severe shortage of.
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  #22  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:24 PM
OTSkyline OTSkyline is offline
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As much as I agree about Rideau St not being the main shopping ave as it could be (like Young or Ste Catherine) I still have high hopes for it and think it is not a lost cause...

With the Rideau Centre expansion coming up I am really banking on shops that are facing Rideau St to have a Street Entrance as well (just like the Forever 21 which is doing wonders for street presence with the mall). Also, hopefully The Bay's renovations can make for a better-looking more inviting street presence.

After that, you have a couple of shops down Rideau like Cora's, Urban Outfitters, The Beer Store, Rexall (in CP) etc... If more of those grimmy tattoo and bong shops can relocate and make way for better/more desirable shops and we can have some things like an expanded and nice Holt Renfrew a few blocks down on Rideau I really this the street could be a good main avenue and shopping destination... AT LEAST from Sussex to King Edward.
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  #23  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Uhuniau View Post
It doesn't have to be one thing.

It can be a simple rule: You want to build something downtown? Great. Now make it face the street and interact with it.

If it doesn't do that, it doesn't get approved. No exceptions. Ever.

That would mean growing some balls, which cheap, small-minded Ottawa has a severe shortage of.
That is fine and I encourage it. The problem is that much of downtown was built in the 1960s to 1980s with little street presence. I don't see those buildings being replaced in sufficient numbers to make the difference needed.

The reason why I said we need a major public oriented project downtown is because it has gotten to the point that we need to change the attitudes of average Ottawans about coming downtown. If you are not heading for the market bars or to work, who are we attracting to go downtown?

All I can say is we avoided another error when it was proposed to move the downtown library to Bayview. That would have been another nail in the coffin of downtown. That being said, we badly need to modernize our downtown library so that it appears to be more than just a daytime homeless shelter.
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  #24  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:37 PM
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Originally Posted by OTSkyline View Post
As much as I agree about Rideau St not being the main shopping ave as it could be (like Young or Ste Catherine) I still have high hopes for it and think it is not a lost cause...

With the Rideau Centre expansion coming up I am really banking on shops that are facing Rideau St to have a Street Entrance as well (just like the Forever 21 which is doing wonders for street presence with the mall). Also, hopefully The Bay's renovations can make for a better-looking more inviting street presence.

After that, you have a couple of shops down Rideau like Cora's, Urban Outfitters, The Beer Store, Rexall (in CP) etc... If more of those grimmy tattoo and bong shops can relocate and make way for better/more desirable shops and we can have some things like an expanded and nice Holt Renfrew a few blocks down on Rideau I really this the street could be a good main avenue and shopping destination... AT LEAST from Sussex to King Edward.
We can hope for better and it won't take much considering how Rideau hit rock bottom after the Rideau Centre opened. We need archor stores on Rideau and shops with unique merchandise and interesting restaurants. Cora's, the Beer Store and Rexall are better than tattoo parlours, pawn shops and pay day loan outlets, but they are the type of stores serving local residents. Good, but not attracting Ottawans from other parts of the city. A relocation of Holt-Renfrew is at the expense of Sparks Street, or what we used to call 'Uptown'. That might be like moving the furniture as the Titanic sinks.
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  #25  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Uhuniau View Post
There's a simple solution to the stubway problem.

Extend it.

But Ottawans are cheap, small-minded, idiots.
That's the plan with Stage 2, which doesn't depend on "cheap Ottawans" but on Toronto centric Queen's Park and Ottawa hater Harper.



Even without the extension, the subway will at least make it easier for people living along the line, as well as office workers in the evening, to spend some time downtown.
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  #26  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:53 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
That's the plan with Stage 2, which doesn't depend on "cheap Ottawans" but on Toronto centric Queen's Park and Ottawa hater Harper.



Even without the extension, the subway will at least make it easier for people living along the line, as well as office workers in the evening, to spend some time downtown.
The problem is that not many people live along the line. I have said it before because of the presence of the Queensway, all the stations east of downtown are better locations for business development rather than residential development. For the most part, the O-Train plans are also poorly located for residential development, the Carling Station location withstanding.
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  #27  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 5:57 PM
teej1984 teej1984 is offline
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Norml and Top of the World are also great stores on Rideau, both of which have been nicely renovated lately.

Hooch is also a nice addition in my opinion!
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  #28  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 6:01 PM
OTSkyline OTSkyline is offline
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With Ottawa always getting the short hand of the stick and not getting much can we REALLY save both Sparks St AND Rideau St at once?
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  #29  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 6:05 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
The problem is that not many people live along the line. I have said it before because of the presence of the Queensway, all the stations east of downtown are better locations for business development rather than residential development. For the most part, the O-Train plans are also poorly located for residential development, the Carling Station location withstanding.
I agree that the current u/c line has limited population and that the eastern stations (Train to Blair) has limited potential. That said, Bayview, Lebreton and Hurdman have tremendous potential. The extension east will make it much more desirable for Orleans commuters to hang out downtown after work and nearly all west extension stations are in dense neighborhoods and/or have potential for further development.

As for the O-Train, Carling and Carleton can support an important amount of ridership and growth. Same goes for added stations such as Gladstone and Walkley.
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  #30  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 6:23 PM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
I agree that the current u/c line has limited population and that the eastern stations (Train to Blair) has limited potential. That said, Bayview, Lebreton and Hurdman have tremendous potential. The extension east will make it much more desirable for Orleans commuters to hang out downtown after work and nearly all west extension stations are in dense neighborhoods and/or have potential for further development.

As for the O-Train, Carling and Carleton can support an important amount of ridership and growth. Same goes for added stations such as Gladstone and Walkley.
Yes, there is more potential for residential development west of downtown. Those are more desireable locations. I have my doubts about Hurdman. I know many here look at the potential there but it is federal land and much of it an old dump. I wouldn't count on it. Walkley has less potential than it had 10 years ago. The area has largely been redeveloped recently or presently under construction. Carleton is a great transit destination but not a place where Ottawans actually live.

When considering the overall city, only a tiny portion of the population will ever have direct access to downtown by the proposed LRT route. We need it but it won't make downtown dramatically more accessible for the average Ottawan.
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  #31  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 7:56 PM
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That's the plan with Stage 2, which doesn't depend on "cheap Ottawans" but on Toronto centric Queen's Park and Ottawa hater Harper.
While there's truth to both these things, keep in mind that federal and provincial funding somehow came about for Phase 1.

John Baird's riding would see a siugnificant part of Phase 2, so don't rule out pressure from a high-ranking cabinet minister. There are elections to worry about!
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  #32  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2013, 9:23 PM
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It's getting harder to find anything downtown that isn't a starbucks, shoppers, pub or cupcake store.

Sears is gone, Zellers is gone, crappy tire is long gone, both first run movie theatres are now gone, tommy and lefabre is going, I wonder if the Bay and Giant Tiger aren't far behind.

I don't know which is the chicken and which is the egg (i.e. are downtown residents choosing to drive/bus to suburban box stores and screwing urban stores or is the closing the urban stores forcing downtown residents into the burbs.
This is so true.

What's the incentive to live downtown currently here in Ottawa? You still pay the high costs of living downtown(not just in money, but also traffic) with very few/none of the benefits(commodities and entertainment options just a walk away). The only real incentive seems to be that you live close to work if you work for the government.

For someone looking to move into a new home, even if they're single or a childless couple, and they don't work in the government, it seems like the suburbs are a better option because you pretty much have everything available to you right at your fingertips.
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  #33  
Old Posted Dec 24, 2013, 7:32 PM
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waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
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negotiations underway with a different theatre operator... here's hoping
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/World+E...065/story.html
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  #34  
Old Posted Dec 24, 2013, 8:44 PM
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Agreed. Finding new operators for World Exchange, Rideau Centre and other cinemas in the Centretown/ByWard/Lowertown core neighbourhoods is a priority. The city government recognizes that, to their credit. The relevant business players, though, don't seem inclined to co-operate with reality so far.
I think that's very much the case, rather than this being a symptom of municipal neglect. In my opinion, Lansdowne isn't downtown and doesn't serve the same market. Also, these "exclusion areas" of 5 km or whatever (the distance seems to be elastic from one year to the next, depending on what is being justified) are completely blind to what the nature of downtown really is, which is the hub of entertainment. Downtown should have the first-runs of all movies, the nicest movie houses, the big premieres, etc. - then those movies go on to the neighbourhoods. It's not just the desperate, reductionist "catering to downtown condo dwellers" we should be talking about here, it's how downtown is constructed in the cultural geography of the city.

The downtown core needs two or three swanky multi-screen cinemas: one or two on Rideau Street; one or two around Bank & Sparks or Bank & Laurier.
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  #35  
Old Posted Dec 24, 2013, 8:50 PM
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A bigger question, also, is the health of the movie exhibition industry in general. Cinema operators, unless they are independent, have been completely reactive and on the defensive in relation to the onslaught of the various home options that have just kept getting better and more convenient. Going 3D was the only meaningful difference they were able to come up with to entice people into going to cinemas. But they have been short sighted, in my opinion. There should be a renewed "deal" between Hollywood and theatre companies to guarantee exclusives to cinemas, at the very least, lest Hollywood become just another TV studio. Some things are meant for the big screen: figure out what they are and offer those movies on the basis of the big screen only. Going to a movie is a night out, but it should be different than "a night out at the big box stores" - I don't care if there's a Chapters or a Future Shop on the other side of the parking lot, I care if there's good bars or restaurants close to the cinema. Etc.
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  #36  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2013, 7:52 AM
S-Man S-Man is offline
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This letter was hyped by the Citizen today. Wasn't sure where else to put it, so here it is:

Quote:
Re: World Exchange hopes to sign new theatre operator, Dec. 26.

On early Christmas Eve afternoon, a friend informed me that the cinemas at the World Exchange Plaza will not remain open after all past December. This literally breaks my aging heart.

(However, I'm still keeping my fingers crossed after reading on Thursday that Bentall Kennedy, which manages the World Exchange, is now working to reach a new deal with a different theatre operator sometime in the new year.)

While shopping in November, I found out that The Exchange Pub and Restaurant at the Rideau Centre closed while I was outside the country last fall, as well as the lovely bookstore on the mall where, if you were lucky, you could run into a "good" senator, MP or CBC or CTV News personality from time to time checking out the same books that you were.

I considered these locales special neighbourhood respite havens of mine, where the staff and management were always welcoming, service-oriented and joyful. I was the customer who showed up when the suburbanites and tourists vacated Centretown en masse.

I will miss these establishments very much, but most of all I regret not having been able to thank in person the people who made them a place where I wanted to go. I wish them all the best. They made up the fabric of the Ottawa that I learned to know and love.

Unfortunately, downtown Ottawa has lost its compass in recent years.

Those of us who live and spend their time and money in Centretown are watching its demise with bewilderment and sadness as condos are built by the dozen to block out the only thing that might be left: the sky.

I think of all those who lost their jobs in the tide of this year's corporate and municipal decisions and hope to see them in new establishments in 2014.

I wish for all our city leaders and planners to take the time to walk a mile in the shoes of those who reside downtown in 2014.

May there be some enlightenment to the bleak days of our winter besides electrical strings of seasonal glitz.

SuzAnne Doré, Resident of downtown Ottawa

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen

Sorry, but I shake my head at everything said here. So, does THE CITY run that book store or restaurant you liked, or did it just 'go under', as businesses sometimes do?

"This year's corporate and municipal decisions"???? huh?

And having more people living downtown (those damn condos in the middle of the city - who does that?) would somehow be bad for those businesses? Seems to me it is 'change' that is happening here, not a scorched earth retreat (a la NCC urban renewal).

Of course, SuzAnNe might just see anything other than complete stagnation and inertia as 'everything's destroyed', a sentiment we've seen in this city before.
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  #37  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2013, 3:42 PM
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The World Exchange theatre closed last night http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...oors-1.2478379

Last edited by waterloowarrior; Dec 30, 2013 at 5:42 PM.
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  #38  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2013, 9:08 PM
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It's too bad, but it's about a private landlord and private business owner not agreeing on terms, nothing more, nothing less.
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  #39  
Old Posted Dec 30, 2013, 11:49 PM
m0nkyman m0nkyman is offline
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It's too bad, but it's about a private landlord and private business owner not agreeing on terms, nothing more, nothing less.
Not 100%. There is a history to this site getting a lot of financial support from the city in exchange for certain things.
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The Canlands' building programme mandated an office building, a hotel, significant civic space both opened and enclosed, commercial development, public and cultural amenities, and community facilities. The whole block would be excavated for an underground parking garage of 1000-1500 stalls.
source Urbsite

There are valid reasons why the city would have some say into what uses are allowed in the theatre space, and in my opinion, the city dropped the ball by not putting enough pressure on the landlord to make a deal.
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  #40  
Old Posted Dec 31, 2013, 9:02 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is online now
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A friend an I were planning to see a specific movie yesterday that had been playing at the World Exchange. The alternate location was Kanata. We didn't go. The alternative was the Bytowne but there were 1 hour parking restrictions it seemed everywhere. It is becoming so difficult to enjoy our downtown.

If Kanata Centrum is becoming the cultural centre of the city, we are in big trouble.
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