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View Poll Results: Which cities are more alike than not
New York City & Chicago 13 20.63%
Los Angeles & Houston 7 11.11%
San Francisco & Boston 13 20.63%
Atlanta & Dallas 14 22.22%
Austin & Nashville 27 42.86%
Charlotte & Indianapolis 8 12.70%
Denver & Minneapolis 18 28.57%
St. Louis & Memphis 4 6.35%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 63. You may not vote on this poll

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  #21  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 8:02 PM
Camelback Camelback is offline
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It's tough to compare San Francisco to any other city IMO. Race, income, history, urban setting, urban fabric, suburban fabric, mentality, climate and more. The only other city that might hit some of these is Seattle and I fell like that is a stretch.
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  #22  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 8:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Camelback View Post
It's tough to compare San Francisco to any other city IMO. Race, income, history, urban setting, urban fabric, suburban fabric, mentality, climate and more. The only other city that might hit some of these is Seattle and I fell like that is a stretch.
I fully agree... not that I've ever been to Seattle.

But in comparing cities that are often compared, I also don't agree that Chicago and NYC are similar at all. Both have totally different vibes, cultures, ethnicities, cuisine, etc. When I compare a place I've visited/stayed at, I also think of the intangibles.

Speaking of race and income, a few years ago, I learned that Asians/Asian-Americans are the poorest ethnic group in New York City. I'm wondering in which other cities that is also the case.
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  #23  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 8:57 PM
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NYC is a little different from other U.S. metros, in that it has very large working class Asian enclaves living very in very urban environments. Bangladeshis in the Bronx, Pakistanis on Coney Island Ave., Fujianese in Sunset Park, etc.

CA has some of this, but it's more about the giant SGV, Northern OC and Silicon Valley suburban-style communities. And, at least in the Bay Area, the Asian population is very professional-oriented and higher income. NYC metro has upper income Asian ethnoburbs, in NJ and on LI, but not to the same extent as CA.
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  #24  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 9:00 PM
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Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, Louisville and St. Louis.

Gee, wonder what's the common thread there?
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  #25  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 9:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
NYC is a little different from other U.S. metros, in that it has very large working class Asian enclaves living very in very urban environments. Bangladeshis in the Bronx, Pakistanis on Coney Island Ave., Fujianese in Sunset Park, etc.

CA has some of this, but it's more about the giant SGV, Northern OC and Silicon Valley suburban-style communities. And, at least in the Bay Area, the Asian population is very professional-oriented and higher income. NYC metro has upper income Asian ethnoburbs, in NJ and on LI, but not to the same extent as CA.
Looking it up, according to Data USA, these are San Francisco's and Los Angeles' numbers (2018, cities proper):
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  #26  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 9:43 PM
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
But in comparing cities that are often compared, I also don't agree that Chicago and NYC are similar at all. Both have totally different vibes, cultures, ethnicities, cuisine, etc.
NYC and chicago get compared to each other on this board so often because of the obvious skyscraper connection, but beyond that superficial point, the rest of it starts to break down shortly thereafter.

NYC operates on such a different scale and level of urbanism within the US that it's fundamentally more different than it is similar to any other american city, IMO.

a better one for chicago might've been an alternate history detroit that didn't crash so hard.



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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
NYC is a little different from other U.S. metros, in that it has very large working class Asian enclaves living very in very urban environments. Bangladeshis in the Bronx, Pakistanis on Coney Island Ave., Fujianese in Sunset Park, etc.
chicago has some of that in its (still authentic) chinatown and the devon corridor of west ridge, but as pointed out above, the urbanism level is obviously several rungs down compared to urban NYC.
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  #27  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 9:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Handro View Post
I don't think Chicago and New York are similar at all, except for "skyscrapers." But even those are different in each city (NY tall/skinny, Chicago shorter/wide). New York has no counterpart in North America, IMO. Someone said Chicago and Toronto and I think that's a good one.

Boston/SF maybe, that's an interesting comparison. Clearly different cities with different building styles, but similar feelings of density distribution and demographics (as far as class and education go).

I'd hesitantly compare Cincinnati and Baltimore.

The great lakes cities are probably more alike than different--Milwaukee, Cleveland, Buffalo all have lots of similarities.
I asked a co-worker from in Toronto, schooled in Chicago and living in Atlanta, which city Toronto was more like - Chicago or New York. He thought a minute and said Toronto was definitely more like Chicago than New York.
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  #28  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 10:02 PM
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a better one for chicago might've been an alternate history detroit that didn't crash so hard.
Interesting you should say this, Steely.

A cousin of mine, HER cousin (who is not a blood relative of mine), lives in Chicago and another one of her cousins lives in Detroit. Yet another relative, visiting LA from the Philippines, asked me, after visiting the cousin in Detroit, "Have you ever been to Detroit?" I said "No, but I've been to Chicago." Her take was "Detroit's alright. It's kind of like Chicago, but with fewer things to see and do."
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  #29  
Old Posted Mar 25, 2021, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
Interesting you should say this, Steely.

A cousin of mine, HER cousin (who is not a blood relative of mine), lives in Chicago and another one of her cousins lives in Detroit. Yet another relative, visiting LA from the Philippines, asked me, after visiting the cousin in Detroit, "Have you ever been to Detroit?" I said "No, but I've been to Chicago." Her take was "Detroit's alright. It's kind of like Chicago, but with fewer things to see and do."
Yeah, Chicago is "familiar" if you're from Detroit, especially if you're an older millennial or above, that can remember the more densely built areas of Detroit before they went on a demolition spree 10-20 years ago.

This reminds me. I made the comparison between Detroit and Philly before, and I would also pair up Philly and Chicago.
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  #30  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 12:54 AM
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Yeah, Chicago is "familiar" if you're from Detroit, especially if you're an older millennial or above, that can remember the more densely built areas of Detroit before they went on a demolition spree 10-20 years ago.

This reminds me. I made the comparison between Detroit and Philly before, and I would also pair up Philly and Chicago.
Detroit is pretty overwhelmingly black, while Philly is not (78% to 42%). Philly and Chicago have relatively similar demographic breakdowns with Philly having a somewhat higher black population and slightly more Asians while Chicago is much more hispanic. I don't know if Philly looks all that much like Chicago but it definitely doesn't have much in common with Detroit from a built perspective. Philadelphia and Chicago have roughly similar drop offs from their mid-century population peaks while Detroit's population loss was way worse. Philly definitely isn't in Chicago's class in a lot of ways, but the comparison probably makes more sense to the extent you need to compare distant cities.
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  #31  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 2:12 AM
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Originally Posted by eixample View Post
Detroit is pretty overwhelmingly black, while Philly is not (78% to 42%). Philly and Chicago have relatively similar demographic breakdowns with Philly having a somewhat higher black population and slightly more Asians while Chicago is much more hispanic. I don't know if Philly looks all that much like Chicago but it definitely doesn't have much in common with Detroit from a built perspective. Philadelphia and Chicago have roughly similar drop offs from their mid-century population peaks while Detroit's population loss was way worse. Philly definitely isn't in Chicago's class in a lot of ways, but the comparison probably makes more sense to the extent you need to compare distant cities.
Fun fact: Philadelphia and Detroit have pretty close to the same number of black residents.
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  #32  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 2:24 AM
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Diversity

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Originally Posted by eixample View Post
Detroit is pretty overwhelmingly black, while Philly is not (78% to 42%). Philly and Chicago have relatively similar demographic breakdowns with Philly having a somewhat higher black population and slightly more Asians while Chicago is much more hispanic. I don't know if Philly looks all that much like Chicago but it definitely doesn't have much in common with Detroit from a built perspective. Philadelphia and Chicago have roughly similar drop offs from their mid-century population peaks while Detroit's population loss was way worse. Philly definitely isn't in Chicago's class in a lot of ways, but the comparison probably makes more sense to the extent you need to compare distant cities.
Someone from New York told me once, that one thing he likes about NY is the diversity. I said I thought Chicago was pretty diverse and he said no, it's different.

What diversity means in NY is that if you take four random people on any street corner, one's from the Philippines, one's from Syria, one's from Honduras and one's from Buffalo.

But what diversity means in Chicago, is that if you pick four random people, one went to Michigan State, one to Indiana, one to Wisconsin and one to U of I.
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  #33  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 2:46 AM
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I know there are major differences in terms of the racial/ethnic composition and general vibe of each city, but I do find SF and Boston to feel similar. They feel similarly sized and the populations of both skew very well educated. You have the Cal and Stanford research powerhouses outside, but close to, SF, which is similar to the MIT/Harvard dynamic in Cambridge. Both cities feel somewhat boutique-y. Idk...the last time I was in Boston I kept feeling the SF comparison.

Cleveland and Baltimore are literally nothing alike at all. Not in built form, industry, demographics...nothing really. I think Baltimore and Philly could be a decent comparison. Pittsburgh and Cincinnati is another one. Detroit and Cleveland.

There are parts of St. Louis that look VERY similar to inner Cleveland burbs of Cleveland Heights and Shaker Heights.

St. Louis

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6364...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6496...7i13312!8i6656


Cleveland Heights

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5079...7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5102...7i16384!8i8192
This is right to me.
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  #34  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 2:47 AM
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Originally Posted by TR Devlin View Post
Someone from New York told me once, that one thing he likes about NY is the diversity. I said I thought Chicago was pretty diverse and he said no, it's different.

What diversity means in NY is that if you take four random people on any street corner, one's from the Philippines, one's from Syria, one's from Honduras and one's from Buffalo.

But what diversity means in Chicago, is that if you pick four random people, one went to Michigan State, one to Indiana, one to Wisconsin and one to U of I.
Depends where in the city that question is. Rogers Park would have a different answer than downtown or Lincoln Park. But agreed, it's not like NYC diversity.
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  #35  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 3:25 AM
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I've spent most of my life in either San Francisco or Boston and I think the similarities people are citing are superficial, and pale in comparison to the significant differences in climate, topography, vernacular architecture, economy, cost, demographics, etc. Just the fact that SF is nearly 40% Asian-American significantly differentiates the two.
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  #36  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 3:32 AM
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Originally Posted by TR Devlin View Post
Someone from New York told me once, that one thing he likes about NY is the diversity. I said I thought Chicago was pretty diverse and he said no, it's different.

What diversity means in NY is that if you take four random people on any street corner, one's from the Philippines, one's from Syria, one's from Honduras and one's from Buffalo.

But what diversity means in Chicago, is that if you pick four random people, one went to Michigan State, one to Indiana, one to Wisconsin and one to U of I.
while i get the humor behind the joke because chicago is certainly nowhere close to being as diverse as NYC is, and it also has a very large contingent of big 10 grads (FTR, NYC has its fair share of 'em as well, even if they're way more diluted), it's important to remember the vast majority of chicagoans did not go to a big 10 school, and the city is actually still fairly diverse, even if it's not quite at the same level as the usual suspects like NYC, LA, Miami, etc.
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  #37  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 3:35 AM
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Originally Posted by craigs View Post
I've spent most of my life in either San Francisco or Boston and I think the similarities people are citing are superficial, and pale in comparison to the significant differences in climate, topography, vernacular architecture, economy, cost, demographics, etc. Just the fact that SF is nearly 40% Asian-American significantly differentiates the two.
Plus SF isn't a wicked pissah either.
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  #38  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 5:30 AM
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  #39  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 9:28 AM
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Socially, Toronto feels more like San Francisco (of all places) than either Chicago or New York.
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  #40  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 11:08 AM
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To amuse, and horrify, myself I compared the climate of my city to the two metros that bookend it. Turns out my city has more or less the exact same climate as Charlotte, while it gets both hotter and colder on average than Atlanta.

Greenville and Charlotte: Miserable summer climate besties!
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