Phoenix CityScape Thread - Page 104

PHX31 · #**2061** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 7:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Rising

South Tower will be 417'-3" to the top and just under 400' to the top of the residential floors. Unless value engineering reduces the height of the building. The building will not get taller from those heights. Chase will remain the tallest building in Phoenix. However, South Tower will become the tallest residential building in Phoenix.

That's great you have this "information", and I'm not doubting it. And I think I can speak for everyone that we appreciate any and all tidbits of information, but can you give a source?

It's crazy when these people with no history on the site and no posts come out and give this great "insider" type information... but then give zero sources or tell us nothing about themselves or how they came up with the info. Are things like height or tenents or anything regarding a development such a big freakin secret that someone can't explain a little background information on themselves/their info? If it is a secret, why? And if so, then just say, "speaking on condition of anonimity this is the info I have..."

It's a little hard to believe someone, again, not that I don't believe Urban Rising, when their one or only two posts just blurt out info. It's like if I were to register under an alias then say with my only post "The Chase Building is structurally unsound and will be blown up by a demolition company on November 3rd at 9:15am."

Urban Rising · #**2062** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 7:39 PM**

I worked on both projects. My job is in commercial construction. I unfortunately can't state from what side of commercial construction(Architect, Engineer, Developer, General Contractor, Sub Contractor).

My only intention is to add some factual information to the forum, and hope that adds to the overall excitement that all of the new development will bring to Downtown Phoenix and the surrounding area.

HX_Guy · #**2063** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 8:27 PM**

Thanks for the info Urban Rising, it sounds like you have some inside info and very specific stuff, which is great.

The 417' 3" is right in line with that we had heard previously from Mike Ebert, which said it would be around 415'. Do you have any information on the height of the Wachovia tower? I think we've heard of 375' and 385' before.

Any other information you could share with us?
When will the condo/hotel tower start construction?
Number of residential units?
Is it true it will have 2 tower cranes?
Are these buildings cash concrete or steel frame like the Central Park East building?

Any info on the stuff going on the Patriots Square block?

Luke Skyscraper · #**2064** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 8:47 PM**

Urban Rising,
Thanks for the inside scoop. If you can address the follow up questions by HX Guy- that would be great.

I still do not make sense of the proportions in the new image posted by Davis Group. There is no way the South Tower is only 32 feet taller based on the on new image. In the image, it appears to be at least a third taller than the Wachovia building.........
I believe the stats from Urban Rising, just not the proportions of the images posted......

PHX4EVER · #**2065** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 8:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by HX_Guy

Awesome, thanks. (Now I just have to get a higher res. version...but I'll work on that.

)

Here is the new rendering, side by side with the old version. They are mostly the same, though the Davis rendering looks a bit more chiseled and looks to maybe have a stainless steel facade on the hotel portion? It also looks shorter, but the floor height is the same so it's more realistic whereas the old renderings made it look much taller then Wachovia and that won't be the case.

look at that wells fargo tower on left side.that new hotel looks like 1500' compare to that wells fargo.it looks funny.but would be nice to see that hotel at least 650' or so.....

Urban Rising · #**2066** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 9:01 PM**

North tower should top out at 368' which will make it only slightly shorter than the south tower.

Based on the schedules I have seen to date south tower should start around march and be ready for move-in around the end of 2010 or early 2011.

I unfortunately do not know how many units will be in the building. I haven't seen the drawings in a while.

The Patriots square block is currently in redesign and unfortunately the apartment portion is no longer part of the project. That's not to say it won't come back through further design changes. The source for this works at RED and was giving a project update at an industry meeting. Weitz will continue to work on the underground portions, until the project is ready to proceed.

HX_Guy · #**2067** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 9:11 PM**

Wow, that's a shocker about the Patriot's block. So basically, it's "on hold" right now? And no apartments? I really hope this does not turn into another Arizona Center.

About the height, 368' and 417'...I wouldn't call it "slightly shorter", that's a pretty big height difference. I'm still pretty surprised that RED didn't have the vision to build a new tallest. I understand it's very expensive...but they could have gotten creative, all they needed was another 70' which could have been 3-4 more floors and a 30' or so crown on top.

Hysonk · #**2068** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 9:58 PM**

I'm excited to learn that the second tower is scheduled to begin (fingers crossed) in March. That's a lot better than what we were hearing that it wasn't ever going to get done. Hopefully the Patriot's Park redesign is better than the one proposed. I was never a big fan of the design, perhaps a more striking entrance to Cityscape is in order. Overall, good news and thanks for all the new info.

Vicelord John · #**2069** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 9:59 PM**

how long ago did i say this is collier center #2??

Classical in Phoenix · #**2070** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 10:50 PM**

With the shape of the financial markets right now, I am real concerned about any building that is not coming out of the ground yet. I think money for development is going to be very hard to get for a while.

HX_Guy · #**2071** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 10:59 PM**

Very true. We've heard that RED recently got $250M which they will use part of for Cityscape, so that is good, but you're right...anything that gets built in this market we should be thankful for.

Also, just because construction starts on a tower, does not mean it will finish. Look at Elevation Chandler here in the valley and also there is a tower going up in Chicago that has stopped construction somewhere around the 15th floor. I believe the Chicago Spire is also on hold even though they already started the foundation work.

CANUC · #**2072** Posted **Sep 17, 2008, 11:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Rising

North tower should top out at 368' which will make it only slightly shorter than the south tower.

Based on the schedules I have seen to date south tower should start around march and be ready for move-in around the end of 2010 or early 2011.

I unfortunately do not know how many units will be in the building. I haven't seen the drawings in a while.

The Patriots square block is currently in redesign and unfortunately the apartment portion is no longer part of the project. That's not to say it won't come back through further design changes. The source for this works at RED and was giving a project update at an industry meeting. Weitz will continue to work on the underground portions, until the project is ready to proceed.

Hold on, hold on. I’m calling shenanigans on this guy. How is that the Wachovia tower with more floors than the BofA building and roughly the same number of floors as OCPE will be shorter then even 44 Monroe? Now he comes on here and claims PSP is on hold and is re-designed and no apartments blah, blah, blah. I’ll believe it when I see it.

HX_Guy · #**2073** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 12:30 AM**

A) Why would the guy lie?

B) The numbers are in line with that we have heard from reps at RED.

HX_Guy · #**2074** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 12:58 AM**

Thanks to Loveithigh, who mailed me a copy of AZRE Magazine, here is a high res. of the new Cityscape hotel/condo tower.

It looks to be a bit more "value engineered" as Combusean put it...let glass, not as flashy. It's sort of disappointing compared to the original, looks sort of office tower-ish, especially the hotel portion.

Here is a link to the original design:

http://nitnelav.com/CityScapeConstru...yscapenew3.jpg

PHX31 · #**2075** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 2:30 AM**

The hotel portion looks exactly like that Hilton hotel at the base of the Qwest Tower on Thomas Rd... only a different color.

I'm very happy something is being built there, but I'm definitely disappointed in CityScape...

PHX4EVER · #**2076** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 2:48 AM**

I can't see what kind of steakhouse is that?

HX_Guy · #**2077** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 3:53 AM**

It seems to say "Johnathan's Steakhouse" but it may just be a generic name.

ljbuild · #**2078** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 3:56 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHX4EVER

I can't see what kind of steakhouse is that?

I cant wait to "EAT IN IT" !

PhxPavilion · #**2079** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 9:00 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CANUC

Hold on, hold on. I’m calling shenanigans on this guy. How is that the Wachovia tower with more floors than the BofA building and roughly the same number of floors as OCPE will be shorter then even 44 Monroe? Now he comes on here and claims PSP is on hold and is re-designed and no apartments blah, blah, blah. I’ll believe it when I see it.

The BofA tower is 23 floors at 360', the Wachovia tower was originally going to be 26 floors, what about 368' sounds so absurd? If you calculate the height of each floor at those numbers the BofA's is about 15' 5" per floor and Wachovia's would be about 14' per floor assuming it's still 26 floors.

plinko · #**2080** Posted **Sep 18, 2008, 4:27 PM**

Just curious, is the 368' to the roof or to the top of the parapet? If it's to the roof then the parapet would be about 385'? Just a clarification.

I know the City of Phoenix only counts to roof height (or at least that's how it used to be).

Shameful to hear about the PSP block. Isn't that where PF Chang's and AJ's were supposed to go? I don't remember.