Did the "California Dream" finally end this week after a long struggle?

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by mhays

I'm trying to understand your point. Many of LA's denser and more pedestrian-oriented nodes have freeways and underpasses, and seem like fine places to walk (I'm a guy, if that matters).

Here's one of many: https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0389.../data=!3m1!1e3

In your pic you show Sawtelle, which has street life, but the restaurants/shops are not separated by the freeway.

What's another example you have?

Hollywoods, Westlake, Koreatown least pedestrian areas are by the 101. West Hollywood, Beverly Hills don't have freeways. You can show me all the maps you want, but you have to see it in real life, I guess. Chicago was the same, from what I remember.

[The North One]

Originally Posted by LA21st

It's not like the freezing cold, something you have to deal with every day in the winter. Lets be real.

lol so predictable for you to deflect to winter, as if a typical season is at all comparable to what's going on in California. I guess keep telling yourself this if it makes you feel better.

[LA21st]

Well, you're the one who said "put up with". Most people deal with it just fine, but keep telling yourself everyone's going crazy over it.

Obviously the winter cold is more of a common thing that everyone there has to put up with. You're right, it's not the same at all.

[dimondpark]

Originally Posted by CaliNative

Fires statewide, including one caused by lightening in the Santa Cruz Mountains
that appears to have sadly destroyed some of the ancient redwoods of Big Basin. Record heat. Record homelessness. Crime soaring. Housing out of reach. The pandemic. California has been through tough times before, but his time it seems much worse. California may bounce back, but maybe not to the old heights. I am contemplating a move to upstate New York, perhaps to the shores of one of the Finger Lakes. Goodbye California. It was great.

Yes, you need to leave immediately. It's not anyone's job here to convince you of anything and honestly, nobody really cares.

[Buckeye Native 001]

Originally Posted by craigs

Yes, it's all over. Now go home.

Arizona is full. Go bug Nevada or Oregon

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by dimondpark

Yes, you need to leave immediately. It's not anyone's job here to convince you of anything and honestly, nobody really cares.

I wouldn't be as annoyed but he's been posting these gloom and doom things for awhile now. I didn't like NOVA, but I wouldn't do this kind of thing before I left. I just left. People who leave California like to announce to the world they're leaving for some place "better". It's honestly strange behavior. I've seen NYers do this as well, usually if they're moving to the south or something.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by LA21st

People who leave California like to announce to the world they're leaving for some place "better". It's honestly strange behavior. I've seen NYers do this as well, usually if they're moving to the south or something.

Ditto for Chicago/land.

Moving to a completely brand new region can induce a lot of fear in many people.

I think one of the coping mechanisms for some is to denigrate the place they're leaving to reassure themselves that they're making the correct decision.

These types of externally-oriented people often never find their shangri-la because the root of their issue(s) is internal, not their surroundings.

[LA21st]

I was about to say Chicago too. It's common.

[destroycreate]

As long as people don't start waking up one day saying, "OMG, I want to move to New Jersey!" or "Delaware is where I need to be!" which nobody ever does, let's be honest, the California dream will always have allure and draw for millions. Other places just don't have the it factor.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by destroycreate

As long as people don't start waking up one day saying, "OMG, I want to move to New Jersey!" or "Delaware is where I need to be!" which nobody ever does, let's be honest, the California dream will always have allure and draw for millions. Other places just don't have the it factor.

No kidding. I know several people back east saving/planning on moving to California in the next few years. Mostly professionals. They visited so they're aware of the homeless but they dont think it negates the positives. They're aware of the fires, but I think outsiders think it's worse than it actually is. In terms of personal/property damage anyway. The majority happen in remote wlderness.

Their biggest concern are the housing prices.

[the urban politician]

California is dying. It's a complete shithole

LA in particular is in shambles.

[the urban politician]

The politics, horrible finances, etc etc of course get me wondering about leaving Chicagoland, but then I can't fathom leaving the sheer wonder, inspiration, and excitement of stuff like this:

Originally Posted by harryc

Aug 17

Chicago | One Chicago by Harry Carmichael, on Flickr

It's like being in an abusive relationship but you can never leave your partner because they rope you back every time with their charm and sweet-talking..

[destroycreate]

Originally Posted by LA21st

No kidding. I know several people back east saving/planning on moving to California in the next few years. Mostly professionals. They visited so they're aware of the homeless but they dont think it negates the positives. They're aware of the fires, but I think outsiders think it's worse than it actually is. In terms of personal/property damage anyway. The majority happen in remote wlderness.

Their biggest concern are the housing prices.

There's aways going to be huge drawbacks no matter where you go, just as there are upsides.

I left CA 6 years ago for Seattle because it seemed way cleaner, way less expensive, etc., but then as much as I loved it, it wasn't California. People were super insular and not as dynamic, there wasn't a ton to do for 8 months out of the year because of the constant rain, nightlife and food scene not nearly as good, and then it ended up becoming just as expensive (in fact Seattle rents are higher than LA for sure). I like the sexy factor and diversity CA offers me. I'm willing to put up with a lot of BS because there's just too much to offer me here.

Sure I could move to Houston and live in a mansion and perhaps have much more disposable income, but I'm not really into the Texas pride/more conservative culture that pervades much of that region. You win some you loose some, it's down to preferences.

[bossabreezes]

I think the ''California Dream'' was never a reality for most people, but the allure of Coastal California is not gone.

I'm planning to move somewhere in the state, hopefully in the next year or two. Likely Los Angeles now, before I was gravitating towards SF due to my career options there. Lately LA is starting to make something of itself with Silicon Beach and all, and it's more affordable than SF, so why not? Great weather, interesting culture, beautiful scenery. I'm excited about it.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by destroycreate

I left CA 6 years ago for Seattle because it seemed way cleaner, way less expensive, etc., but then as much as I loved it, it wasn't California.

^ CHAZ didn't fit your idea of dream livin'?

[destroycreate]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ CHAZ didn't fit your idea of dream livin'?

I lived in Capitol Hill actually, but left for LA in 2018 so I never saw the ~shocking decline~ conservatives speak of. My friends who all still live there are totally fine.

[Centropolis]

i was working in the bay area last fall and was putting together a plan for an eventual permanent move there, as i kept getting requests to stay for work. however the blackouts and wildfires in sonoma county last fall (i had to call the fire dept TWICE homeless people kept starting fires by my clients property) coupled with the insane disparity between housing costs and salaries in the bay area pushed the door closed. we have two dogs and a daughter and my wife wants more room and our budget isnt 7 figures - not happening in sonoma unless we have a massive housing crash...

the covid era has probably locked that door for good.

[Six Corners]

Fine by me. The more of you who leave, the more likely the real estate market will come down to a point where I can more affordably move there.

The California dream is not dead. I think you just take it for granted.

[Centropolis]

it’s hard to make a move like that once you’ve tasted the middle class. outside of finance or tech it’s hard to make that sort of jump to a place with such a disparity between housing prices and income. theres a difference between this and having access to family resources that can make up the difference even if you have a good career. i see this a lot and it really muddies the waters in discussions like this.

if you are going to make the move - make it when you are younger or otherwise don’t “need” the trappings of middle class american life...unless you are in finance, independently wealthy, tech, etc.

in my opinion, the “california dream“ was a very middle class dream. you pack your shit up in the midwest to take a better paying job and a life “upgrade” as dictated by middle century american popular culture.

that version died in the 90s in my opinion. places like dallas or whatever took up the torch and it lost some of the je ne sais quoi. it’s something different now, my friends that live in california have doubts and struggles with it.

but everyone is having more doubts and struggles everywhere.

[Centropolis]

the even better california dream were countercultural middle class baby boomers that ended up there in the 60s and fell upwards into cultural assimilation and economic mobility...but that’s a different story and a one in a million lottery jackpot of human history and experience...