DENVER | Transportation Thread

[CastleScott]

Well heres some great news:

Feds announce funding for Denver rail lines
The Associated Press
Posted: 08/31/2011 06:46:20 AM MDTUpdated: 08/31/2011 05:59:03 PM MDT


RTD and the Denver Union Station in August 2011. (The Denver Post | RJ Sangosti)ARVADA, Colo.—U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood has signed an agreement committing $1.03 billion in federal funds for two planned light rail lines in Denver.
One line will link downtown to Denver International Airport. The other will link downtown to the northwest suburbs of Arvada and Wheat Ridge.

The $1.03 billion award that LaHood announced Wednesday is the last piece of funding needed for the $2.1 billion Eagle P3 project, which includes both light rail lines and is part of the FasTracks program to expand transit in the Denver area. Local funds and privately arranged financing are funding the rest of Eagle P3.

The announcement comes as President Barack Obama is making a push for spending on infrastructure as a way of keeping construction employees at work.

THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier story is below.

Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood was in Colorado on Wednesday to announce $1.03 billion in federal funds for two planned light rail lines in Denver.

One line will link downtown to Denver International Airport, and the other will link downtown to the northwest suburbs of Arvada and Wheat Ridge. Both are scheduled to be ready for service in 2016.

The $1.03 billion federal award is the last piece of funding needed for the $2.1 billion Eagle P3 project, which includes both light rail lines and is part of the Regional Transportation District's FasTracks program to expand transit in the Denver area. Local funds and privately arranged financing are funding the rest of Eagle P3.

Among those expected to attend the announcement Wednesday were Federal Transit Administration Administrator Peter Rogoff, along with Gov. John Hickenlooper and Reps. Diana DeGette​ and Ed Perlmutter.

President Barack Obama made a push Wednesday for spending on transportation projects and other infrastructure as a way of keeping construction employees at work. A jobs plan that he plans to reveal to a joint session of Congress next week is expected to include proposals for infrastructure spending.

Costs for the overall FasTracks project are estimated at about $6.8 billion, or about $2 billion more than what had been presented to voters in 2004. RTD officials have blamed the increase in part on rising costs for material, labor and rights of way, and some changes in project plans. Meanwhile sales tax revenues to support FasTracks have been lower than expected.

The district's board has decided to wait until at least 2012 to ask voters in the eight-county district to approve a sales tax increase to help fund FasTracks. However, district officials have said a tax increase will be needed soon if FasTracks is to be completed by 2020. Otherwise, the district has said, it won't be fully completed until 2042.




Read more: Feds announce funding for Denver rail lines - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/ci_18794967#ixzz1WfEOFo1k
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[CastleScott]

Heres the press release off the FTA site:

U.S. Transportation Secretary LaHood Signs $1 Billion Federal Funding Agreement for Denver’s Eagle P3 Commuter Rail Line, Project Expected to Create an Estimated 4,700 Construction-Related Jobs

What is this?
08-31-11
Contact: Paul Griffo
Telephone: (202) 366-4064


Officials Break Ground on Eagle P3’s Western ‘Gold Line’ Segment


Watch live stream of the Full Funding Grant Agreement signing ceremony and the Gold Line Groundbreaking here on Wednesday at 3 p.m.


DENVER – U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood today signed an agreement committing $1 billion to Denver’s Eagle P3, a 30-mile two-pronged commuter rail project that will significantly expand transportation choices in the greater Denver area, create jobs and cut by nearly half the amount of time it now takes to get from downtown Denver to the airport.

Secretary LaHood signed the funding agreement at a groundbreaking ceremony for the Gold Line in Olde Town Arvada today, alongside Federal Transit Administrator Peter Rogoff, Colorado Governor John Hickenlooper, U.S. Representative Ed Perlmutter, U.S. Representative Diana DeGette, Denver Mayor Michael Hancock and other area officials.

“Through the Eagle P3 project, the Obama Administration and the Denver Regional Transportation District are putting greater Denver on a smart path to sustainable growth, while generating thousands of good local jobs,” said Secretary LaHood. “Eagle P3 provides Denver with transportation choices that reduce congestion, promote clean air and reduce our nation’s dependence on costly oil.”

The Denver Regional Transit District (RTD) is the first transit agency in the nation to successfully pursue a comprehensive public-private partnership, or P3, that encompasses the design, construction, financing, operation, and maintenance of its regional transit projects. The federal funding agreement covers roughly half of the $2 billion cost of the entire project, which is expected to generate roughly 4,700 construction-related jobs in the Denver metro area.

The federal funding agreement clears the way for construction to begin on the western segment of Eagle P3, also known as the Gold Line, which will serve the suburbs of Arvada and Wheat Ridge. The East Line of Eagle P3, which has already begun construction using local funds, will run from Denver’s historic Union Station nearly 23 miles east to Denver International Airport and will connect to existing light rail and bus service.

“Denver and its suburbs are executing one of the most ambitious and far-reaching public transportation programs in the country—one that will allow millions of Coloradans to enjoy new and improved access to transit right in their neighborhoods,” Federal Transit Administrator Peter Rogoff said. “This will give working families more reliable, affordable transportation that will allow them to spend more time at home and less money at the gas pump."

The Eagle P3 project and Denver Union Station’s ongoing renovation are part of RTD’s far-reaching FasTracks program, a voter-approved, multi-year, multibillion-dollar transit expansion program covering 140 miles of rail and bus corridors that will help Denver to successfully manage growth and compete for business for years to come.

The Federal Transit Administration (FTA) is the major federal funder through a combination of grants and loans. A consortium of private companies, known as the Denver Transit Partners, is responsible for financing the rest through tax-exempt private-activity bonds issued by RTD and other means.

To ensure that Denver’s citizens participate as fully as possible in the jobs created by this work, the FTA recently awarded nearly half a million dollars towards the innovative Denver Regional Workforce Initiative Now. The effort brings local transportation, education, and business leaders together to train, hire, develop and retain transit workers eager to work on Denver’s federally-funded transportation infrastructure projects.

The entire project is slated for completion in 2016. The new railcars slated for use on the commuter line will be assembled in the United States and will consist of at least 60 percent US-made components, consistent with the Administration’s Buy America requirements.

[matteric]

For those of you interested in RTD's cashless fare system, it's basically exactly the same type of system that's in use in Houston, which they call a "Q Card" (dunno what they're going to call it here). I've seen a few new readers popping up here and there as RTD starts piloting the system. There's some info on Houston's system here: http://www.ridemetro.org/fareinfo/default.aspx

Basically, you tap your card on the reader when you board the bus or enter the light rail platform, and it deducts the charge for the trip. Then the fare inspectors have readers so they can tell if you tapped your card or not. Transfers are handled automatically by the system. Not sure how it works for an unlimited-ride pass; Houston doesn't appear to have those, so I don't know whether you'd need to tap it at the light rail platform, or if the fare inspector's reader would just go "oh, ok, unlimited use". For that matter, their zone system is a little different than ours, being based entirely on trips to or from the city center and which station you tap your card at when you get on. We've got a lot of rides in Denver that don't ever hit downtown.

[enjo13]

Originally Posted by matteric

For those of you interested in RTD's cashless fare system, it's basically exactly the same type of system that's in use in Houston, which they call a "Q Card" (dunno what they're going to call it here). I've seen a few new readers popping up here and there as RTD starts piloting the system. There's some info on Houston's system here: http://www.ridemetro.org/fareinfo/default.aspx

Does this mean that I still need cash to buy an individual ticket? If so, what a waste of time.

[Cirrus]

These things are great. Once you start using them you'll wonder how you ever lived without them. They work like a debit card. You put however much money you want on them, and then it deducts from your account whenever you tap your card to the reader. Computer software tells it not to deduct for free transfers, etc. You do not still buy a paper ticket.

They're good for the train system because they eliminate the need to have to stop and buy a ticket when you want to get on a train, which is good for you because you miss fewer trains and good for RTD because they don't have to spend the money to print a bunch of paper tickets every day.

But the really awesome utility of these cards is on the bus system, because once you've got one they completely eliminate the need to worry about whether or not you've got enough cash for a bus ticket. People are much, much more likely to ride buses more often when they can just hop on than when they have to worry about gathering a cash fare. Also, these cards dramatically speed up boarding of buses, because it takes much less time to tap a card than to insert cash.

All the major transit agencies are shifting to smart cards, because they really are that much better.

[bunt_q]

Where will the card reader go at a light rail station, I wonder? With a fare zone system there still has to be some sort of TVM where you can enter your destination (or at least number of zones required) before tapping your card.

Or will you tap when you board, and again when you exit, like at a Metro (DC) turnstile? Can't do that because then the fare inspectors won't know that you tap out at your destination. So some sort of machine, still. Like somebody else mentioned, we can't do it like the Houston one, pay by start-of-trip location only, because not all trips are to downtown.

Sure would be easier with flat-rate fares...

[Cirrus]

Matteric says he's seen readers pop up. Where? In trains or at stations?

Ideally you'd have both. Put a reader at the station so people waiting can tap in there, but also put one on the train so people hurrying to catch it can go ahead and board right away (but if you do put the reader on a train, put it deep in the train, away from the door, so those folks don't hold up boarding for others).

[Cirrus]

Oh, in regards to this:

Or will you tap when you board, and again when you exit, like at a Metro (DC) turnstile? Can't do that because then the fare inspectors won't know that you tap out at your destination.

I don't think that's really a problem.

If you require a tap out in order to close your current trip, then it's easy to write the software so that the system won't let you start a new trip until you've tapped out. So if you skip tapping out, then the next time you try to tap in, the computer will just assume you're tapping out from your last trip.

This happens in DC from time to time even with fare gates. If you follow someone out of the gate too closely the computer might not capture your tap. So then you come in the next time you want to ride and you tap in, but the computer actually taps you out from your last trip and asks you to tap in again.

This does mean that someone could theoretically cheat the system out of one trip per card, but if you charge people a couple of dollars to get a card then it's not worth it for them.

The problem with this for RTD would be providing enough tap out locations so that people aren't waiting in line after they've gotten off a train. Nobody wants to wait to leave.

[bunt_q]

That could be very problematic at downtown stations (the tapping out)... 16th & California, in particular. I cannot seeing them installing 6 or 8 pedestals on that sidewalk. Knowing RTD, I bet you anything they make you pre-pay (tap-in and tap-out with your intended destination) at a machine before boarding. The only thing the card system saves, then, is paper tickets. And makes buses much easier.

They're not going to want to have their fare inspectors doing too much thinking - making them look that riders have "tapped-in," but at the same time making them confirm a date and time, so riders can't leave one trip open for a week. Or at least for the whole day, for a round-trip. The print tickets now make it pretty brainless for them because it shows start, intended destination, and time... all they have to do is make sure you're somewhere in between. But maybe... If the fare inspectors' machines give them "time from tap-in" and RTD says you have to tap out within 90 minutes, maybe that's brainless enough for enforcement. But then when folks forget to tap out it'd be hard (or impossible) to distinguish between an accident and a legit ticket. I guess they just have to buy a new card when they forget, and that's the punishment? But then you've got to make the card cost at least as much as the priciest ticket. There'd have to be more than a $2 penalty, otherwise people would just risk it.

It'd much much easier with controlled-access stations.

[Cirrus]

>That could be very problematic at downtown stations (the tapping out)... 16th & California, in particular. I cannot seeing them installing 6 or 8 pedestals on that sidewalk

You could put the tap out on the inside the of the train door, where access is controlled anyway, but that would slow egress a bit.

There are other cities with light rail and smart cards. Seattle and Baltimore have them, off the top of my head. I wonder what they do. *Off to try and find out.

[bunt_q]

Excellent. Looked at Seattle. They charge for the most expensive trip if you forget. Makes sense.

And the cards themselves cost more than the most expensive trip, so it works out.

http://www.soundtransit.org/Fares-an...card.xml?tab=3

EDIT: Of course, RTD will have to change the fare structure. Otherwise they'll have to charge $10 for the dumb card, because longer light rail trips are getting so bloody expensive.

[bunt_q]

I think we're still better off finding a way to install more pedestals at stations, like the current validation stations, only more plentiful. A very large number of peak hour RTD riders have passes. I'm not sure why RTD would make them tap in and tap out, unless just to track ridership better. Assuming they only have to show a pass when asked, putting the readers on the inside the train doors would be more trouble than it's worth.

[Cirrus]

If you have an unlimited ridership pass then they could probably write software that would allow you go through with only a tap-in. Software flexibility is one of the nice things about this system. Also, if the current system allows pass users to just get on, then pass users will probably just not bother buying smart cards. Not everybody has to use them... or has RTD said it's going to phase out other payment options?

Baltimore has a flat fare for light rail, so you just tap in and that's it.

Seattle has distance-based fares and requires a tap-out at the destination station. The pads are quite small:


by oran viriyincy on flickr

[matteric]

Originally Posted by enjo13

Does this mean that I still need cash to buy an individual ticket? If so, what a waste of time.

No, as far as I can tell the project includes replacing all the TVM's with ones capable of taking credit/debit cards. I think this is how RTD has been justifying not replacing them with CC-capable ones immediately; they're rolling out the whole cashless thing, so they don't want to spend money on the TVM's until they do (not saying it's a good justification, mind you...)

Originally Posted by Cirrus

Matteric says he's seen readers pop up. Where? In trains or at stations?

Ideally you'd have both. Put a reader at the station so people waiting can tap in there, but also put one on the train so people hurrying to catch it can go ahead and board right away (but if you do put the reader on a train, put it deep in the train, away from the door, so those folks don't hold up boarding for others).

The one's I've seen are actually at the 16th and Stout station, on the sidewalk sort of near the paper ticket validators. There doesn't appear to be enough of an interface to register your destination, it looks more like a "tap and it beeps" type of thing. There is a small LCD display. I'll see if I can get a picture the next time I'm over there.

And yeah, like bunt_q was saying, I really hope they're planning more readers than they have validators now. As it is, the readers at 16th and stout are pretty much a block away from the last car in the four-car trains they've been running, which is a problem if, say, you're running to catch the train. You'd theoretically have to go nearly all the way to the mall end of the station first. It's less of an issue at the outlying stations where there's only a few well-defined entrances.

[Wizened Variations]

Originally Posted by bunt_q

That could be very problematic at downtown stations (the tapping out)... 16th & California, in particular. I cannot seeing them installing 6 or 8 pedestals on that sidewalk. Knowing RTD, I bet you anything they make you pre-pay (tap-in and tap-out with your intended destination) at a machine before boarding. The only thing the card system saves, then, is paper tickets. And makes buses much easier.

They're not going to want to have their fare inspectors doing too much thinking - making them look that riders have "tapped-in," but at the same time making them confirm a date and time, so riders can't leave one trip open for a week. Or at least for the whole day, for a round-trip. The print tickets now make it pretty brainless for them because it shows start, intended destination, and time... all they have to do is make sure you're somewhere in between. But maybe... If the fare inspectors' machines give them "time from tap-in" and RTD says you have to tap out within 90 minutes, maybe that's brainless enough for enforcement. But then when folks forget to tap out it'd be hard (or impossible) to distinguish between an accident and a legit ticket. I guess they just have to buy a new card when they forget, and that's the punishment? But then you've got to make the card cost at least as much as the priciest ticket. There'd have to be more than a $2 penalty, otherwise people would just risk it.

It'd much much easier with controlled-access stations.

Of course, for the sake of argument, let's assume very large computer systems always work.

There are three ways to record smart card data, IMO. The first is on the card via a smart chip, the second, at a central data bank, the third, on both.

In a wireless environment with 100% reliability , fare inspectors could simple check a bar code (or bar code like) ID in a wireless reader, to see if the rider's card has the time stamp and the correct fare paid.

This, as Bunt, points out, is far easier in a controlled axis station, as the security turn styles control entry and no fare checking would be necessary onboard. But, as that is not the case (and we could have had a far better system if it was...sigh...), human fare checkers will have to be part of the system (which also puts law enforcement on trains, which in our turbulent society may not be a bad thing anyway, besides there are far too many of the unemployeed.).

The whole system is based upon trust, I guess.

[glowrock]

I'll have to check this out when I get into town this Sunday, especially since I won't have a car for the week!

A brief reminder, I'm open for meeting anyone/everyone any evening next week who might just happen to be in or near the downtown area. Staying at the Hyatt Convention Center, so we could always meet at Peaks Lounge! Haha

Aaron (Glowrock)

[matteric]

So I snapped a couple of pictures of the new readers at 16th/stout this morning. There are two of them, mounted right next to the validator posts, which sort of implies they'd work in a similar manner (swipe if you have a stored value card, similar to a ticketbook, just get on if you have a pass and have the fare inspector read it). I still don't know how they'd determine zones unless they're having you swipe at the destination as well, which would be kind of a pain if, say, you're getting off downtown from the fourth car of the train, which is clear at the far end of the block from the readers.

BTW, those white triangles don't appear to be buttons; the front of the reader is smooth and there's no tactile change for the buttons. I suppose they could be touchscreen-type buttons, but that would seem to be both prohibitively expensive to maintain, and probably not ADA-compliant.





(photos taken by me)

[Octavian]

In other transportation news, B-Cycle is adding 25 stations and 250 bikes in Highlands, City Park, Capitol Hill and Washington Park by next year.

[awholeparade]

I really hope that includes some on/near South Broadway.

[Fritzdude]

Originally Posted by Octavian

In other transportation news, B-Cycle is adding 25 stations and 250 bikes in Highlands, City Park, Capitol Hill and Washington Park by next year.

I guess I didn't realize how expensive it is to rent these bikes. I rode my own bike on Labor Day and rented a bike for my gf so that we could tool around town for 4 hours. I was then billed $29 for that experience.

Yeah - last time I do that.