Spring Garden Streetscape

[Empire]

Originally Posted by Dartguard

The photo in question seems to refer to a private investment. The Prudential center in Boston has little to do with Civic intentions off the main sidewalk.

HRM can take advice from private investors in Boston if that works better....

Ref. Google maps - Planters at Pier 21 should have been the standard for Spring Garden Rd....
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.6380...7i16384!8i8192

[Dartguard]

Originally Posted by Empire

HRM can take advice from private investors in Boston if that works better....

Ref. Google maps - Planters at Pier 21 should have been the standard for Spring Garden Rd....
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.6380...7i16384!8i8192

That picture looks like its from Ottawa which is not surprising as Pier 21 is a National museum. I agree SGR should have had the same attention to detail.

[OldDartmouthMark]

If you look at the details that are in place: the rust from the textured steel bleeding onto the paver stones, cobblestone detail, rough cut stone, etc., it appears that they were going for the rustic look. As bad as the concrete planters look (or will look), they fit into the motif, I guess. I don't think they look out of place, FWIW.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

If you look at the details that are in place: the rust from the textured steel bleeding onto the paver stones, cobblestone detail, rough cut stone, etc., it appears that they were going for the rustic look. As bad as the concrete planters look (or will look), they fit into the motif, I guess. I don't think they look out of place, FWIW.

I don't think so either. The Pier 21 landscaping is nice but very much of its time (looks 90ish to my eyes).

I think SGR looks great, for the most part. The plantings could use some love.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

I don't think so either. The Pier 21 landscaping is nice but very much of its time (looks 90ish to my eyes).

It's worth noting that the Pier 21 budget was quite small. I think it was in the $10-20M or so range for the whole thing back around the early 2000's. It wasn't a gold-plated project that the federal government sank lots of money into (in those days they barely spent any money on Halifax), even though eventually it was declared a national museum due to the subject.

I don't think that putting granite on the planters is a significant budget item for HRM. They just didn't do it for one reason or another, or maybe "value engineered" the SGR project to a large degree due to rising costs. I think HRM often cheaps out too much on important projects while taking too much on. Maybe that's just inherent to having a sprawling municipality.

[Empire]

Had a good look at the Spring Gdn. Rd. planters today and they are much worse than I expected in terms of landscaping. There doesn't seem to be a theme, with haphazard plantings and of course trees that aren't suitable for the location. Looks like maple, birch, oak and all in poor condition. Trees should have been ornamental and perhaps all the same such as cheery so they would provide a consistent vista when in bloom. Native species albeit cheap to purchase will be very unruly and unsightly as they likely won't be pruned unless they compete for space with no parking signs.

Concrete planters are chipped and pitted with lots of construction scars and the wooden insert benches are fading already. The rust from the steel sidewalk locator plates is rusting and I really doubt that was part of some nouveau rustic theme. The modest flower plantings are competing for space with cigarette butts and coffee cups. I hope someone on this forum who is well versed in horticulture will have a look and provide an assessment. This is a huge lost opportunity and an eyesore in such a prime location!

[Hali87]

Originally Posted by Empire

Had a good look at the Spring Gdn. Rd. planters today and they are much worse than I expected in terms of landscaping. There doesn't seem to be a theme, with haphazard plantings and of course trees that aren't suitable for the location. Looks like maple, birch, oak and all in poor condition. Trees should have been ornamental and perhaps all the same such as cheery so they would provide a consistent vista when in bloom. Native species albeit cheap to purchase will be very unruly and unsightly as they likely won't be pruned unless they compete for space with no parking signs.

Concrete planters are chipped and pitted with lots of construction scars and the wooden insert benches are fading already. The rust from the steel sidewalk locator plates is rusting and I really doubt that was part of some nouveau rustic theme. The modest flower plantings are competing for space with cigarette butts and coffee cups. I hope someone on this forum who is well versed in horticulture will have a look and provide an assessment. This is a huge lost opportunity and an eyesore in such a prime location!

The plants/soil seem really unfinished/temporary and not very well thought out. I'm guessing they ran into budget problems or something came up in terms of drainage etc and they'll need some time to figure out how to make things work. As it is it's pretty underwhelming and by far the worst element of the streetscaping.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Empire

Had a good look at the Spring Gdn. Rd. planters today and they are much worse than I expected in terms of landscaping. There doesn't seem to be a theme, with haphazard plantings and of course trees that aren't suitable for the location. Looks like maple, birch, oak and all in poor condition. Trees should have been ornamental and perhaps all the same such as cheery so they would provide a consistent vista when in bloom. Native species albeit cheap to purchase will be very unruly and unsightly as they likely won't be pruned unless they compete for space with no parking signs.

Thanks for your observations. It all sounds like it wasn't thought out very well.

Originally Posted by Empire

Concrete planters are chipped and pitted with lots of construction scars and the wooden insert benches are fading already.

Not good.

Originally Posted by Empire

The rust from the steel sidewalk locator plates is rusting and I really doubt that was part of some nouveau rustic theme.

LOL... I was trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. FWIW, I hate rust stains on anything and think rusty/rustic (just like brand new "distressed" furniture) looks like crap (but that's just my personal opinion).

I think that "underwhelming" is a good descriptor for a makeover of what should be one of the city's showcase streets. Disappointing.

Now to see how the transit-only experiment will work...

[Haliguy]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Thanks for your observations. It all sounds like it wasn't thought out very well.



Not good.



LOL... I was trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. FWIW, I hate rust stains on anything and think rusty/rustic (just like brand new "distressed" furniture) looks like crap (but that's just my personal opinion).

I think that "underwhelming" is a good descriptor for a makeover of what should be one of the city's showcase streets. Disappointing.

Now to see how the transit-only experiment will work...

Other than the planters I think it turned out well. Big improvement to the street.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Haliguy

Other than the planters I think it turned out well. Big improvement to the street.

But the planters...

[Empire]

The landscaping in front of the Doyle should have been an indication of HRM's vision for the rest of the street. This section has very unruly flower plantings and the trees are the least desirable for this application. If I'm not mistaken these are oak trees. Oak trees are very slow to leaf out in the spring and the leaves just turn brown in the fall providing no colour to the streetscape. The size of these trees will be an obstruction in the future. If in fact these are not oak trees I withdraw my comment.

Ref: google maps
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.6435...7i16384!8i8192

[Keith P.]

It just occurred to me that with HRM banning the evil car from SGR that updates to Google Street View are unlikely to happen from now on.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

It just occurred to me that with HRM banning the evil car from SGR that updates to Google Street View are unlikely to happen from now on.

They could always mount a Go Pro to the roof of a city bus.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Empire

The landscaping in front of the Doyle should have been an indication of HRM's vision for the rest of the street. This section has very unruly flower plantings and the trees are the least desirable for this application. If I'm not mistaken these are oak trees. Oak trees are very slow to leaf out in the spring and the leaves just turn brown in the fall providing no colour to the streetscape. The size of these trees will be an obstruction in the future. If in fact these are not oak trees I withdraw my comment.

Ref: google maps
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.6435...7i16384!8i8192

Indeed. I don't really get the negativity towards the streetscaping; I was down there a couple of days ago and it looked great. I agree the rough concrete of the planters could be a little more polished, but that's a minor quibble. The real problem is the lack of vegetation, and the poor/small state of the plantings. But that, of course, is not a problem with the actual hard infrastructure, and can easily be remedied. The rest of it was great. The street furniture was well-used when I was there, the wide sidewalks full, the cobbles and paving stones in great shape. It all looked pretty good to me.

[Arrdeeharharharbour]

There must be a reason why the planters are not yet filled with soil or properly planted. I can't figure out what it might be but surely there's a good reason....?

It occurs to me that with no auto traffic and inbetween transit buses passing by that the street will be sitting empty. It seems likely that pedestrians will regularly spill out on to the street, jaywalk and not bother to wait for crosswalk 'walk' signals to cross the street. Could it be that buses will have to slow down to avoid hitting pedestrians? Time will tell I suppose.

[MonctonRad]

Very likely. I suspect a pseudo-Argyle Street vibe, with pedestrians wandering everywhere. Bus drivers will have to be hyper vigilant to prevent a catastrophe.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

Indeed. I don't really get the negativity towards the streetscaping; I was down there a couple of days ago and it looked great. I agree the rough concrete of the planters could be a little more polished, but that's a minor quibble. The real problem is the lack of vegetation, and the poor/small state of the plantings. But that, of course, is not a problem with the actual hard infrastructure, and can easily be remedied. The rest of it was great. The street furniture was well-used when I was there, the wide sidewalks full, the cobbles and paving stones in great shape. It all looked pretty good to me.

Sounds wonderful, like there's no more need to discuss the makeover any more. Concrete planters are fine, and they've been designed to double as benches for those who like to sit around and people watch. Presumably a vegetation plan will follow. It's great, people love it, the street is vibrant. That's good.

Next to see how the transit-only thing will work. I still think the best scenario is to make it full pedestrian, if you're going to go that way. Otherwise, open it to all traffic, as it wasn't really 'broken' before. Having buses zipping down a street does not improve the pedestrian experience, and in fact could prove to be more dangerous than when people are always expecting a car or truck to come along. However, it is just an "experiment", so hopefully there will be some data and observations to follow, resulting in a concrete (sorry) plan for the street.

[Jonovision]

I think it was in Waye Masons last update letter that I read that the city was not happy with the plantings done by the contractors as they were not up to the standard asked of in the contracts. So they should be coming through to fix it soon.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

I think it was in Waye Masons last update letter that I read that the city was not happy with the plantings done by the contractors as they were not up to the standard asked of in the contracts. So they should be coming through to fix it soon.

What plantings? I was there no more than 2 weeks ago and most of the planters were sporting 3'-5' holes in the ground with no plantable soil at all. They looked more like excavated grave sites waiting for a casket to be dropped in, except for the rocks and street litter at the bottom. As usual, the Councillor for the area is being his usual slippery self.

[ILoveHalifax]

Halifax has always done very poor plantings around the city - little tiny gardens like the one coming off the bridge with scrawny little plants AND WHY wait until July to plant for the season, the summer is practically over by then - the city needs to invest in greenhouses and quality labor to prepare seedlings ahead of time - The most impressive seasonal plantings that I've seen is Brampton ON which has a reputation with plants and flowers - they are stunningly beautiful