CFL in the Maritimes

[kwajo]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

There is certainly a lot more room for expansion here than at Huskey Stadium in Halifax.

Well they could build straight up and go for Globe Theatre look!

[MonctonRad]

Tender awarded for track stadium



Moncton city council awarded the tender for the second phase of construction of its athletic field and stadium on the Université de Moncton campus at its meeting last night. The $10.5-million contract went to Pomerleau Inc., the lowest of five accepted bidders. Phase I of the project was the construction of the underground infrastructure track and field and the east side bleachers. Phase II includes the construction of the concrete grandstand and field house building and associated infrastructure. Work is scheduled to start in May with an anticipated completion date of early 2010. The stadium will be used to host the World Junior Track and Field Championships next summer. The above photo is an artist’s conception of the track stadium.

Personal note - I think this representation downplays the size of the bleachers. Also, the temporary bleachers for the end zone areas have not been included in the drawing. The stadium will be able to seat up to 20,000.

[q12]

The stadium the Maritimes really need for a CFL team, with all permanent seats..... http://www.halifax.ca/halifax2014arc...uesVolume1.pdf Note the capacity of 50,000. If we built it, they would have come. If Halifax didn't have retards for mayor and council and a few select anti-everything citizens then it would have happened. This needs to be moved up on the list for Halifax along with a new Metro Centre.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by q12

The stadium the Maritimes really need for a CFL team, with all permanent seats..... http://www.halifax.ca/halifax2014arc...uesVolume1.pdf Note the capacity of 50,000. If we built it, they would have come. If Halifax didn't have retards for mayor and council and a few select anti-everything citizens then it would have happened. This needs to be moved up on the list for Halifax along with a new Metro Centre.

This certainly would have been a wonderful facility and if the Commonwealth Games Stadium had been built, Moncton would absolutely have been out of the running for a CFL team. It is all very sad.

Under those circumstances, even I would have supported a Maritime CFL team based in Halifax and I would have gladly driven down to Halifax 2-3 times per year to catch some games. It would have given me a reason to visit Halifax; one of my favourite cities.

It is all water under the bridge unfortunately and we now are operating with a more level playing field. Moncton in fact has a leg up on Halifax for a CFL bid.

Only 10,000 of the seats at the World Track & Field Stadium will be permanent but it will still be the best stadium in the Maritimes and there is plenty of room at the site to add another 15-20,000 seats for future expansion.

The CFL realizes this and this is why they are looking seriously at staging up to 10 regular season CFL games at our stadium over the next five years beginning in 2010. If this deal transpires, I'm sure that those 10,000 "temporary" seats will never be removed and the permanent (non expanded) seating capacity of our stadium will be 20,000.

[q12]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

This certainly would have been a wonderful facility and if the Commonwealth Games Stadium had been built, Moncton would absolutely have been out of the running for a CFL team. It is all very sad.

Under those circumstances, even I would have supported a Maritime CFL team based in Halifax and I would have gladly driven down to Halifax 2-3 times per year to catch some games. It would have given me a reason to visit Halifax; one of my favourite cities.

It is all water under the bridge unfortunately and we now are operating with a more level playing field. Moncton in fact has a leg up on Halifax for a CFL bid.

Only 10,000 of the seats at the World Track & Field Stadium will be permanent but it will still be the best stadium in the Maritimes and there is plenty of room at the site to add another 15-20,000 seats for future expansion.

The CFL realizes this and this is why they are looking seriously at staging up to 10 regular season CFL games at our stadium over the next five years beginning in 2010. If this deal transpires, I'm sure that those 10,000 "temporary" seats will never be removed and the permanent (non expanded) seating capacity of our stadium will be 20,000.

That's all fine and dandy but in the long run the Moncton stadium falls short. Unfortanatley for Moncton if they had gone for a more permanent design they might have had a leg up. It would cost close to the same to build a new CFL world class stadium in Halifax compared to upgrading the Moncton stadium to CFL standards. I understand how Moncton would like to get excited about their chances however the reality of it is quite different. I realize though in order for Halifax to even look at the CFL it needs to get this stadium built, which hopefully the city can bring this to the front burner sooner rather than later.

[isaidso]

I hope if the Maritimes lands a CFL team that they have the sense to bury the athletics track. They need to get absolutely everything right to make pro football on the east coast a success. An athletics track is definitely starting with one foot in the grave.

Let's get real here; football will be the primary tenant, and football is what needs to be the focus of a stadium. Multi purpose? Hell no!

[StormShadow]

The Moncton Stadium is being built for a Track&Field event, it would have to be modified to put a full time CFL team in there. But it's initial configuration is fine for exhibition games. They could eliminate the track and lower the field so they can add seats and bring them closer to the sidelines.

[MonctonRad]

That would certainly be an option. (I'm only responding to this now to bump the thread).

[newflyer]

Are there any updates on the track and field stadium.

As a new CFL season is apon up .. I look forward to the day I can watch a CFL team from the east coast play in Canada's oldest and most successful professional sports league. I also think it would be great to make a trip in late November and watch the Grey Cup one day!!

[MonctonRad]

Grid icons land in Metro
Published Monday June 15th, 2009

Young players snap photos with Grey Cup and former CFLers
BY GREG WESTON
TIMES & TRANSCRIPT STAFF

The day after fellow-Maritimer Sidney Crosby collected the Stanley Cup with the Pittsburgh Penguins, a group of Moncton athletes was celebrating with another piece of venerable Canadian hardware.


GREG WESTON/TIMES & TRANSCRIPT
Former-CFL players from left: Stewart Fraser, Jan Carinci, Eugene Belliveau and Matt Dunigan chat with a young Moncton Football Association player during a photo shoot with the Grey Cup. They took part in a mini-training camp at the Rocky Stone Memorial Field in Centennial Park on Saturday to celebrate the organization’s 50th anniversary The Grey Cup was in Moncton on Saturday as part of the Moncton Football Association's 50th anniversary festivities.

Players teamed up with former-Canadian Football League players, including Canadian Football Hall of Fame quarterback Matt Dunigan, for a practice at the Rocky Stone Memorial Field in Centennial Park before posing for pictures with the 100-year-old trophy. Also in attendance were association alumni Stewart Fraser and Eugene Belliveau, both of whom went on to play in the CFL.

"Stewie and Eugene have played on the field right over here back in the day and have gone up through the ranks," said Dunigan, who was guest speaker at Saturday night's anniversary dinner and won the Grey Cup with Edmonton and Toronto. "It's important for these kids to have a glimpse of hope and dreams of aspiring to play at higher levels. It all begins right here and this shows them that."

Now a studio analyst for TSN and the host of his own cooking show, Dunigan threw the third-most touchdown passes in CFL history during his 14-year career and still holds the record for most passing yards in one game -- 713 while playing for Winnipeg in 1994. The only player in league history to play in the championship game with four different teams, he was inducted into the Canadian Football Hall of Fame in 2006.

Dunigan said having the Grey Cup at the event will create a lot of memories for the aspiring players.

"It's great. A lot of them have never seen that and a lot of them have never seen a game in the CFL. It's important to introduce that to them and plant that seed and then, over the years, water it. These are our future fans and some football players. That's how it works, that's what grassroots football's all about," he said.

Fraser, who played in the CFL for seven years, said the day brought back memories from when he started playing with the association as an 11-year-old in 1970.

"Actually, I tried out in 1969 but I got cut. I didn't even make the team, they sent me back," he said with a laugh. "If you really are passionate about something, you keep on trying. You have to have a passion for things in life. Anything."

Now a teacher in Salisbury, Fraser is also the football coach at Bernice MacNaughton High School and has coached various age levels within the organization.

"The people in football are just so kind, so gregarious. I've felt that it's just a natural fit to do something else with the association. It's just a really, really nice family association."

The association runs development programs for children aged six to 15. They host spring and summer training camps and play in a competitive season during the fall. Brian Agnew, played in the association as a youth and has been coaching in the program for about 20 years. There are currently about 500 young players working their way through the association.

"People gave us time and guidance and we want to do the same for the next generation coming up," he said.

Dunigan, raised in the football hotbed of Texas, noted a key similarity between his home state and the players in New Brunswick.

"Passion is passion, no matter where you're at. The love of the sport, it comes out, no matter if you're in Moncton or Dallas. To see it thriving here in Moncton, it warms my heart. It's absolutely amazing to see the support."

[newflyer]

I would wager to bet that Canada has among the fewest 20K+ stadiums per capita in all of the Americas and Europe.

Many nations view sport as an important part of lsociety, in Canada its more of an afterthought.

I say build a stadium in the Maritimes already, as its the only region without a sizable outdoor facility.

[Finiteman]

Originally Posted by brettinhalifax

Thanks. Long time lurker... first time poster.

IMO, even Winnipeg and Quebec City are long shots to get NHL teams. Hamilton, K-W or a second team in Toronto or Montreal is a lot more likely. I agree with Acajack, NHL in Halifax is a pipe dream.

I did a spreadsheet about populations and major league sports in North America. Out of the 47 cities in North America with NHL, NFL, MLB or NBA teams (or multiple teams) the average is about 1.3 million people per team. Only 6 cities have less than 750,000 people per team. 3 of those (Buffalo, New Orleans and Nashville) are in real danger of losing one of their teams. Calgary, Edmonton and Ottawa are IMO pretty much the smallest cities that can support an NHL team.

Nova Scotia is a pretty good football area especially considering there is no pro team out here. We have pretty good CIS football attendance at Acadia, SMU and St.FX. If there was a bigger stadium in Halifax, SMU might get 10,000+ to some games. As much as I'd like a CFL team in HFX, I've started to think smaller.

I'd love to see a 14,000 seat football stadium (expandable to 28,000) built, for Halifax to host the Vanier Cup on a regular basis and for the SMU football program to be marketed/run like the Laval Rouge et Or program. The R&O were ranked #1 for every week this year and their average attendance was over 14,000 a game in 2007. If SMU averages 12,000 per game and a stadium is already half built, then I bet the CFL comes knocking.

IMO it'll be a lot easier to get the gov't to fund construction of a 14,000 seat university stadium than a 28,000 seat CFL stadium.

I thought this was a very interesting post. If the CFL's first game in Moncton is a sellout, confirming sufficient football interest in the area, you might see Moncton emerge as another rival for hosting the Vanier cup. It would be the best facility and largest capacity north of Montreal and would be a "neutral site" as U de moncton doesn't play football (yet). If they were to land the Vanier cup, that could inspire people in NB to push U de Moncton and UNB to start playing CIS football.

With regards to a new Halifax stadium, where would you put it? Isaidso and I independently reached the same conclusion ---that really ideally it should be in the area west of SMU and NE of Dalhousie to capitalize on both student bodies and provide a stadium home for both universities should Dalhousie ever rejoin the rest of the G13 in playing football like major universities should. Would you chose a different location?

Regarding capacity, I would think 25K is an ideal capacity for a smaller community like Halifax (small enough to regularly sell out, big enough to break even and cover the random dog turnout game). I think you'd likely have to build a 16K expandable stadium (8K on each sideline) to hit that number properly. That's as big as I can see a college football team utilizing in Canada, even a popular one like SMU. It seems workable. (I might be wrong on the capacity thing though. As there are less corporate dollars in smaller metro areas, the team might need to make up revenue shortfalls with selling more regular tickets. Still, I think for a startup, the key is getting to a point where sellouts are common.)

Maybe with big time schools like Queens & McMaster building new stadia there might be some support for it if SMU decides they need one. Saputo Soccer stadium in Montreal was built for $14M, seats 13K and is designed to be expanded in the future to 20K. Certainly it proves that good stadiums can be built on the cheap. For SMU (and Dalhousie) only, a 9-10K stadium might be ideal. Basically Saputo stadium without the end zone seating. One would think that could probably be built for $15M based on the Saputo design if the city greases the process and factors like material costs and the like are back to being reasonable with the lower fuel costs. Temporary seating could always be added in the endzone to bring seating up to 15-16K if needed for a bowl game or something.

SMU is leaving money on the table with their current stadium and could want to reclaim the stadium area at some point for buildings. That could motivate them to want a near campus stadium built. Who knows what it would take to motivate Dalhousie? They have the money. One would think shame and student and alumni demands might.

I think I'd be worried that SMU might want to stay in their stadium to thwart a return of Dalhousie football or a permanent CFL presence. I am sure they enjoy being the recipient of all football love in the city.

[Finiteman]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Not much progress over the wintertime I'm afraid. The stadium seating on one side of the field is mostly complete but they have not started yet on the seating on the other side (next to the CEPS, the existing university athletic centre). They are going to build a physical connection between the CEPS and the new stadium as well.

I'm going to look at U de Moncton maps to try and figure out where that is, but would you happen to know off-hand what the longitude and latitude coordinates of the field are? I have built maps for a lot of stuff in google maps and I'd love to be able to put a virtual pin in the 55 yard line if you have the coordinates.

Thanks for any help you can provide on this.

[benvui]

Originally Posted by Finiteman

I'm going to look at U de Moncton maps to try and figure out where that is, but would you happen to know off-hand what the longitude and latitude coordinates of the field are? I have built maps for a lot of stuff in google maps and I'd love to be able to put a virtual pin in the 55 yard line if you have the coordinates.

Thanks for any help you can provide on this.

The Stadium is at 46.108295, -64.783207 (I don't know the exactly location of the 55 yard line, but the stadium is directly behind the CEPS building the UdeM campus. I zoomed in approximately where the 55 yard line would be in my estimation, maybe someone can go onto the field with a GPS device and get the actual coordinates.

[Finiteman]

Originally Posted by ErickMontreal

Moncton is no longer alone in the race.

Due to the interesting outcome of the market assesment studie, a group in Quebec city has been able to find more than half of the financing for a franchise. Moreover, the Provincial Government would invest 19-million dollars in a new stadium located in St-Augustin, the private sector will pay the balance required. (25 000-Seats)

I haven't had any luck finding an article on this, do you have a link?



While I am cheering for Moncton, I don't think they will get a CFL team.

I think the CFL is going to try to leverage Moncton into getting Halifax to pony up the dough on a new stadium. See how many years Halifax residents will put up with a CFL regular season game in Moncton and not Halifax. Local top government officials will regularly get voted out over this and a stadium of some sort will be built in 10 years (by 2020). It doesn't take many votes to swing an election and sports fans can be very petty.

I kind of feel bad for Moncton as they will probably get used by the CFL, but I think they get that. Why else would they only build a stadium that EXPANDS to like 18K after all the talk of a CFL ready 25K stadium? I think some people in the government didn't believe they would get a stadium even if they built a permanent 25K stadium and didn't want to get stuck with an albatross. Imagine if they built the stadium and 3 years down the road halifax built a matching stadium and the team moved to Halifax. There is a sneaky logic to it --- don't know if it will work better this way, but it is there. An 8K stadium that is expandable to 18K is a lot more flexible in scale of activities hosted there and is legitimately viable to house U de Moncton football if they should start it up, where a 14-25K stadium would just be cavernous and might lead to an early demise. Having an occasional/semi-annual CFL game is really the best a city of 126K SHOULD anticipate. Really if they end up getting 1 CFL game a year, Lots of concerts, Maybe the vanier cup a few times, the championship thing the stadium was built for, and say U Moncton starts playing football in this 8K (permanent seated capacity) stadium, the small city of Moncton has, IMO, hit a homerun with the stadium. Frankly the CFL games could drive the creation of a successful say Sherbrooke-level football program at U de Moncton.

Really 1-2 CFL "special" games a year that are likely sellouts is really higher profile for them than having a struggling team calling Moncton home and I think the CFL understands that that works for them as well. The league wants games played in the Atlantic to drive TV and marketing revenue up in the Maritimes, but do they really want to roll the dice on actually having a team in the region? Do they really want to put a team in Moncton where a good chuck of game attendance would be from out of town or would they want to put it in Halifax where the stadium at best seats half their break even capacity? Neither sounds like a winning proposition. I suspect the BOG are of two minds on putting a team in the maritimes vs. simply playing a game in the maritimes.

Financially it COULD make quite a bit of sense to take the 2 games that are likely to draw the smallest crowds in their normal stadiums and relocate them to Moncton. That way it might not be as bad of a financial hit to the team playing. Having expansion Ottawa play a game (or possibly two) a year in Moncton would likely help. It would drop season ticket prices a bit (possibly getting a few more fans to bite in the early years) and would take the likely worst game off their home schedule.

Additionally, what if, as has been reported in this thread, the CFL's 10th team is Quebec? A duel of expansion teams might be a tough sell in the 3rd or 4th year and the game might be a candidate for relocation. Quebec vs. Ottawa might generate a lot more buzz in Moncton (home of a french speaking University) than if it were played in Halifax.

[Finiteman]

Originally Posted by benvui

The Stadium is at 46.108295, -64.783207 (I don't know the exactly location of the 55 yard line, but the stadium is directly behind the CEPS building the UdeM campus. I zoomed in approximately where the 55 yard line would be in my estimation, maybe someone can go onto the field with a GPS device and get the actual coordinates.

You are the man! I have been trying to find the co-ordinates for months.

Thank you!

[someone123]

They could overhaul the Gorsebrook field area with a stadium that would be within walking distance of both Dal and SMU.

Eventually Halifax will just build a stadium and probably get a team. Unfortunately, things move very slowly there.

[newflyer]

I have absolutely no doubt that the maritimes could support a CFL team. Its really a no brainer in my books. While cities like Toronto have proven to be poor football markets, in terms of the CFL, CIS and the NFL, I believe a city like Halifax or Moncton would witness alot of local and regional support, as the team would garner the title as the only professional team in the maritimes and would become a focal point of the local sports media.

Take a look as the smallest CFL market, which is Regina. The team has recieved a huge following among the Saskatchewan population. The city itself has been a significant benefactor as the site of the Rider's stadium. There is little surprise the city of Regina is pushing hard to be the home of the Roughriders new stadium, which has shown up on the political radar as of late. It is a boon to the local economy 9 or 10 times a year, as hotels, restaurants and shops get a big boost during weekends the team plays at home, as they play host to thousands of people from across the province. This in addition to the local university team who also plays out of this stadium and the odd big ticket concert, which also draws thousands.

If a small city like Regina has figured out the successful formula .... a larger city which has no regional professional competition of any type, should witness similar levels of success, if marketed correctly.

In my mind .. the only questions would be what colours should the team wear .. and what should the name of the team be?

Truth be told I have played with various fantasy concept versions on John Madden football. Lots of fun!!

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Finiteman

While I am cheering for Moncton, I don't think they will get a CFL team.

I think the CFL is going to try to leverage Moncton into getting Halifax to pony up the dough on a new stadium. See how many years Halifax residents will put up with a CFL regular season game in Moncton and not Halifax. Local top government officials will regularly get voted out over this and a stadium of some sort will be built in 10 years (by 2020). It doesn't take many votes to swing an election and sports fans can be very petty.

I kind of feel bad for Moncton as they will probably get used by the CFL, but I think they get that.

If you want to be Machiavellian about this, there is certainly a very good chance that you may be right.

It makes a certain amount of logical sense that intercity rivalry could provoke Halifax into building a new stadium to compete with Moncton and thwart our own chances to land a CFL team........ Moncton's recent successes at the concert business (Rolling Stones, AC/DC, Bon Jovi, The Eagles etc.) has certainly put a burr under Halifax's saddle and stimulated a similar interest down there that I believe would otherwise have remained nacent and unexploited.

Moncton is a smaller city than Halifax and does not have a similar national stature but this should not necessarily preclude us from consideration for a new CFL franchise.



The above table shows that Moncton actually compares quite favourably to Regina. There are 420,000 people within a 90 minute drive of downtown Moncton. This is similar to the HRM population.

Moncton is more centrally located and can draw from a larger potential market than Halifax. This is especially important for football vs. say a professional hockey team. With only 9-10 home games a season, and always on the weekend, it is relatively easier to get fans to commute from a distance.

I think that if the CFL remains open minded on the issue and does not have a hidden political agenda, that Moncton might possibly be successful in the long run.

The real test of course will be if we can get sellout crowds of 20,000 to the proposed 10 CFL games that are going to be staged in Moncton beginning in 2010 or 2011. If we can fill the stands with enthusiastic fans, that will get the CFL's attention!

[ErickMontreal]

If in the coming years either Halifax or Quebec cities get a proper stadium , they will get a team prior Moncton.

Just for the deep culture of football existing in both cities, they deserve it.