Major cities that are weirdly overlooked and nobody seems to care about

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Zeej

Permit me the quick edit, but I wouldn't put Montreal in the "weirdly overlooked" category. While English Canada has turned its attention elsewhere, the city is arguable more global now than it's been in recent memory.

For one, it's consistently a top-5 immigration city in North America by sheer numbers, which counts for something when much larger metropolitan areas are lower on the list.

It's anglo-Canada that pays attention to Montreal while the larger world beyond our borders doesn't. I've lost track of the number of foreign tourists who 'discover' Montreal and perplexed as to why 'no one' knows about it. A lot of Australians see Vancouver first and stunned when you tell them its not even 2nd largest city in Canada.

'More global' doesn't mean it's as highly visible as it should be. Foreigners, for the most part, see Toronto and Vancouver before they think of Montreal. That despite, Montreal being solidly our #2 metro and all of its history, attractions, etc. Immigration counts do matter but they don't tell the whole story. Outside the francophone world, Montreal's visibility isn't where you'd expect it to be.

In the Mastercard list of 'Cities by Most International Visitors' Montreal (51st) was well behind Toronto (29th) and Vancouver (34th). So I disagree with you completely. Montreal gets nowhere near the attention or international tourists it should.


Mastercard 2016 Arrivals
TORONTO: 4,520,000
VANCOUVER: 3,900,000
MONTREAL: 2,240,000

Mastercard 2016 Income in USD
TORONTO: $2.16 Billion
VANCOUVER: $2.12 Billion
MONTREAL: $1.08 Billion


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ional_visitors

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by Zeej

For one, it's consistently a top-5 immigration city in North America by sheer numbers, which counts for something when much larger metropolitan areas are lower on the list.

I'm skeptical. The only NA cities with more immigrants are NY, LA, Miami and Toronto? Montreal has more immigrants than Dallas, Houston, Chicago, SF, DC, Vancouver?

Also, I'm not sure what that has to do with the thread topic. What does share of immigrants (super high in Luxembourg, super low in Tokyo) have to do with importance or visitor attractiveness?

[Shawn]

As a New Englander, I’m totally confused at the notion Montreal is overlooked. It probably is the second-highest profile city outside the region after NYC.

[dubu]

Originally Posted by Shawn

As a New Englander, I’m totally confused at the notion Montreal is overlooked. It probably is the second-highest profile city outside the region after NYC.

i was thinking thats why montreal doesnt stick out much because ny and toronto are not far away. its like in a courner by its self. i guess what you said makes sense.

[Zeej]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I'm skeptical. The only NA cities with more immigrants are NY, LA, Miami and Toronto? Montreal has more immigrants than Dallas, Houston, Chicago, SF, DC, Vancouver?

Also, I'm not sure what that has to do with the thread topic. What does share of immigrants (super high in Luxembourg, super low in Tokyo) have to do with importance or visitor attractiveness?

I suppose this thread has taken on more of a visitor attractiveness route, but my point was to convey that its difficult to overlook a place that receives a fair amount of people choosing to settle in it.

To clarify, I'm quoting annual growth in immigration - not total foreign born population.

For immigration stats, forumer Kora posted this in the Statscan thread in the Canada subform:

Originally Posted by kora

Immigration by metro area, 2018, top 10

New York: 168,931
Toronto: 106,460
Miami: 80,341
Los Angeles: 74,032
Montreal: 43,795
Washington: 37,796
Houston: 36,263
Vancouver: 35,265
Chicago: 35,045
San Francisco: 31,918

US Lawful Permanent Residents, 2018, DHS
https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/fi...dents_2018.pdf

Admissions of Permanent Residents, 2018, StatsCan
https://open.canada.ca/data/en/datas...9-9b8aff9b9eda

I believe in 2019, Vancouver edged out Montreal, but all the same - ahead of Chicago, Dallas, San Francisco, DC and Houston.

[Acajack]

I travel all over the world and do not find Montreal is overlooked. It depends where you are of course. In some parts of the world even Vancouver overshadows it even if it is only number 3 in Canada, but in a decent chunk of the world most people still think Montreal is the biggest city in Canada and know it better than Toronto.

Go to Paris, Beirut, Casablanca or Port-au-Prince and ask the average joe to name a Canadian city and see what they say.

[niwell]

Not that I would really consider it overlooked now, but historically Toronto has been the overlooked Canadian city compared to Montreal. In the same vein as São Paulo, Madrid, Johannesburg, etc. I think this has changed in recent years though.

[dubu]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I travel all over the world and do not find Montreal is overlooked. It depends where you are of course. In some parts of the world even Vancouver overshadows it even if it is only number 3 in Canada, but in a decent chunk of the world most people still think Montreal is the biggest city in Canada and know it better than Toronto.

Go to Paris, Beirut, Casablanca or Port-au-Prince and ask the average joe to name a Canadian city and see what they say.

theres 2 million more people in toronto. but i learnd something today, bigger isnt better known in cities to some people.

i always thought toronto was always the biggest canada city. so nevermind

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by niwell

Not that I would really consider it overlooked now, but historically Toronto has been the overlooked Canadian city compared to Montreal. In the same vein as São Paulo, Madrid, Johannesburg, etc. I think this has changed in recent years though.

If anything, when you consider its size and heft, Toronto is a bit underrated. When you think of how big it is, arguably it should not be mentioned in the same breath as Montréal (à la Sydney vs Melbourne) but it often is.

[Yuri]

Montreal is not overlooked at all. It’s featured heavily in those YouTube travel channels. It definitely punches above its weight in this regard, ahead Boston, Philadelphia or even Washington DC. Considering the Northeast/Midwest, I’d say only New York, Toronto and Chicago gets more atention.

[AviationGuy]

Originally Posted by yuriandrade

I’ve commented before, but I think Naples is the most overlooked city in the world. 4 million people, one of largest historic centers of Europe, distinct culture, beautiful surroundings. Barcelona is hyped to extreme while Naples are forgotten.

Was in Naples in 2000. Loved it. Surprisingly hilly with very steep streets, beautiful bay. Sort of rough around the edges in places, but lots and lots of character.

[AviationGuy]

Originally Posted by Maldive

Naples earns bonus points for its proximity to the most beautiful inhabited coast on planet earth (Amalfi).

Four trips so far to Amalfi/Sorrento/Napoli including one honeymoon. I've visited almost every slice of Italy which is clearly, by every metric, the most delicious country on the third rock from the sun.

The only thing wrong with Italy, is that dreaded limoncello liqueur... get rid of it and you have a perfect 10.

Also, Naples is a very short ferry ride out to the island of Capri, one of the most beautiful islands I've ever been to. Awfully touristy, but I loved its beauty. From the top of the mountain on Capri, I looked across the bay at Naples, Sorrento, and Mt. Vesuvius. I think the Amalfi coast may be visible from parts of the island.

[dubu]

Originally Posted by yuriandrade

Montreal is not overlooked at all. It’s featured heavily in those YouTube travel channels. It definitely punches above its weight in this regard, ahead Boston, Philadelphia or even Washington DC. Considering the Northeast/Midwest, I’d say only New York, Toronto and Chicago gets more atention.

the most attention to me would be

1. california
2. east coast (i woulnt count montreal i that)
3. florida up to the east cost cities (dc, philli, ny ect)
4. midwest (toronto i would count as midwest)
5. down to states or providences.

i dont really think of cities in those populated areas because it all blends together.

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by dubu

the most attention to me would be

1. california
2. east coast (i woulnt count montreal i that)
3. florida up to the east cost cities (dc, philli, ny ect)
4. midwest (toronto i would count as midwest)
5. down to states or providences.

i dont really think of cities in those populated areas because it all blends together.

There is a whole world outside of the United States, you know.

[dubu]

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

There is a whole world outside of the United States, you know.

if i had a boat..

[craigs]

To Naples I'll add Palermo, which I think is even more overlooked and underrated, especially in light of the amazing examples of Greek, Norman and Arab architecture.

I personally know several people who seem to truly hate Brussels (the biggest criticism I can agree with is that it's not a great place to ride a bicycle), but I found it a fascinating, handsome city with a lot to do. It has great architecture, it's dense, and it felt huge to me even when I knew its population stats. If it were in North America, it would be the greatest city after New York and Mexico City.

[SIGSEGV]

I'll add the city I was born in, Bucuresti (Bucharest). Tourists to Romania often go to better-preserved medieval places, like Brasov, Sibiu, and Sighisoara, which are all great too, but they' are not major cities by any stretch.

Unfortunately, much of the old city was destroyed by Ceausescu, although that did result in some grand architecture:

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4272...7i13312!8i6656

The pedestrian old town is great:
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4319...!7i5120!8i2560

As is Calea Victoriei:
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4347...7i13312!8i6656

There are old churches, grand art nouveau buildings, modern buildings, and commie blocks, all intertwined in a chaotic fabric that's really fun to walk around in:

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4343...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4383...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4378...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4370...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4439...7i13312!8i6656

Don't drive there, the drivers are crazy, but public transit is cheap and plentiful (as are taxis). The city is compact enough you can just walk everywhere too, more or less. Not sure how easy it is to get around if you don't speak Romanian (plenty of people speak English, but not everybody, and most signs are just in Romanian).

Edit: here's a random blog post focusing on some of the more interesting buildings: https://virginia-duran.com/2017/07/2...-architecture/

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

Salzburg, by the way, doesn't get talked about here a lot but it's a gem.

It doesn't come up much on SSP, but it's very much on the tourist circuit. Obnoxiously so, these days.

In no small coincidence it's probably my least favourite European city amongst those I've visited. In spite of its obvious prettiness.

Originally Posted by yuriandrade

When will Napoli happen?!?! This Covid thing and all transformations indicate we'll have rough times ahead, but Napoli will be discovered one day.

We should be the first, let's get apartments there, enjoy it while it's fun and not spoiled by mass tourism and when gentrification arrives, we'll become rich!

Naples seems like an obvious candidate to become a "next Berlin" type of city; but I think the main barrier it has is that northern European cities are just easier to live in for the largely-expat artist crowd that drives those sorts of trends. They're more English friendly and have less of the local cultural "particularities" that can be hard for outsiders to navigate.

Meanwhile, it has too enduring of an image of roughness and crime to attract the mainstream tourist hordes.


Good call on Palermo above as well. Some of those southern Italian cities can almost feel more like the tattered ancient cities of the Middle East or North Africa than they do anywhere in first-world Europe.

[destroycreate]

On the topic of Montreal from a NA perspective...it is interesting that the majorit of American (anectodal west coast POV here) youngsters only seem to plan on going to Mexico for drinking escapades. You'd think Montreal and its counterparts, super easy to get to, would be a tourist mecca for the 21 and under set. Surprised those cities' tourist baureas haven't really capitalized on that yet.

[jbermingham123]

I used to live in Kunming, Yunnan, China

Kunming is a city nested in a valley on a lake at 6,234 feet above sea level, with an urban population of 4,575,000



Also everything said here about ChongQing is spot on. Far and away the most insane place I've ever been