The NHL is coming closer to Quebec City

[Slug]

It's just a contingency plan to have places for failed sunbelt NHL franchises to stay until the toxic investment climate in the States subsides. Not too many cities have a 10k+ seat arena that can support a NHL team besides KC and I'm not even too sure Vegas has one. Also, it could be a fence mending PR campaign by the NHL after the Phoenix debacle brought back raw emotions in Canadian cities that had their teams 'Relocated'.

[Distill3d]

Originally Posted by Ayreonaut

I think most Albertans would love to see a resurrection of the Jets.

Agreed. As a Flames fan, I would love to see a team in Winnipeg again.

Originally Posted by Ayreonaut

I don't know if Albany could support a team, but I'm sure Hartford could. I don't think the relocation of the Whalers had anything to do with a lack of fan support

I think we've all learned that the NHL doesn't specifically care about the ability to support a franchise. Just look at the Coyotes...

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Slug

It's just a contingency plan to have places for failed sunbelt NHL franchises to stay until the toxic investment climate in the States subsides. Not too many cities have a 10k+ seat arena that can support a NHL team besides KC and I'm not even too sure Vegas has one. Also, it could be a fence mending PR campaign by the NHL after the Phoenix debacle brought back raw emotions in Canadian cities that had their teams 'Relocated'.

Tons of cities in the US have 17,000 to 20,000-seats arenas that can be used for hockey, in places like Milwaukee, Des Moines, Omaha, etc. Las Vegas has the Thomas and Mack Center which I believe seats just under 19,000 and is used for minor league hockey.

The question is whether there would be enough interest in hockey in these cities to keep NHL teams afloat. I think we all suspect what the answer is for most of them...

Anyway, let's just hope Bettman and the NHL aren't playing us for fools by lightly flirting with Quebec (and also Winnipeg, if we remember what Bettman said about it earlier this year).

[Ayreonaut]

To me, I would prefer Winnipeg and Quebec over Hamilton, but all three would obviously be the best situation.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I don't see where your perception of negativity about Winnipeg (vs. Quebec) comes from. Except for Graupner here, but in his case you almost drew him into it...

I think if there has been any negativity about Winnipeg and the NHL here, it's been mostly from your fellow Westerners two provinces over.

ha, yeah, or fellow winnipeggers....it came from the fact that we have a thread in the manitoba section like this and its like a hundred pages of winniepg sucks and this thread was very positive...i was just curious...didnt want to hijack the thread about it....to me both quebec and winnipeg would be so good for the league...i dont mind if the other crap franchises like nashville and tampa etc. move to better markets like KC (if that is better) or milwaukee, but i see no reason that the league cant handle more canadian content as well.

i hope when it happens that both teams go back to their WHA roots and resurect the names and logos from that era....quebec had the best logo in the NHL.

i actually think that balsille has helped cities like winnipeg and quebec...betman wont want to be seen as anti-canadian (1/3 of league revenues come from canada), but he doesnt want to allow another team in the toronto market (at least not without being on his terms), so he will be more likely to be supportive of another canadian city so he can prove that he is pro canadian while still getting his way in toronto...i suspect it is why he was all of a sudden so welcoming to winnipeg earlier this year.

speaking of rivalries...in winnipeg we thought we had this huge rivalry with the flames....when i was young i dated a girl from calgary....i went to a game in the saddledome with her dad, who was a season ticket holder, and spent the entire time jabbing him about the flames....in the third period, he turned to me and said, "so is there like a rivalry between the flames and jets or something?....most people i know, the jets are their second favourite team"....there is nothing worse than having a rivalry if the other side doesnt know it.

[Ayreonaut]

Haha, that sucks. It can change though, I don't think Vancouver was much of a rival until we kicked their ass out of the '04 playoffs, not they are arguably our biggest rival.

[Distill3d]

Originally Posted by Ayreonaut

To me, I would prefer Winnipeg and Quebec over Hamilton, but all three would obviously be the best situation.

As much as I agree, Hamilton has been waiting 84 years for another NHL franchise, Winnipeg and Quebec have been waiting 13 and 14 years. I'm pretty sure both can wait a while longer while Hamilton is considered.

[Distill3d]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Tons of cities in the US have 17,000 to 20,000-seats arenas that can be used for hockey, in places like Milwaukee, Des Moines, Omaha, etc. Las Vegas has the Thomas and Mack Center which I believe seats just under 19,000 and is used for minor league hockey.

The question is whether there would be enough interest in hockey in these cities to keep NHL teams afloat. I think we all suspect what the answer is for most of them...

Anyway, let's just hope Bettman and the NHL aren't playing us for fools by lightly flirting with Quebec (and also Winnipeg, if we remember what Bettman said about it earlier this year).

Des Moines? Omaha? I think you're drawing straws a little about where to put an NHL franchise. A Milwaukee franchise would create a good rivalry between the Minnesota Wild and the Chicago Blackhawks. Wisconson, being a northern state, is more of a traditional hockey market than Des Moines or Omaha. So, honestly, it makes sense to have a team there.

[Slug]

You guys think if it does happen will they be called the Jets/Nordiques or will they change it up like with the Wild? They could keep the old names like Calgary did so they could be the Winnipeg Thrashers and the Quebec Panthers.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Distill3d

Des Moines? Omaha? I think you're drawing straws a little about where to put an NHL franchise.

Well, I was responding to a poster that said that few cities in North America had NHL-sized arenas. If you some research, you will find that many cities in the U.S. that are smaller or about the same size as Quebec City and Winnipeg have NHL-sized arenas.

You're right that Des Moines and Omaha appear to be strange places for potential NHL clubs... although this is an ice hockey league with teams in Phoenix, North Carolina, Nashville, Tampa and Sunrise, Florida, and none in many large and largish cities in the northern half of the continent. Nothing would surprise me.

Originally Posted by Distill3d

A Milwaukee franchise would create a good rivalry between the Minnesota Wild and the Chicago Blackhawks. Wisconson, being a northern state, is more of a traditional hockey market than Des Moines or Omaha. So, honestly, it makes sense to have a team there.

Yes, Milwaukee would probably be a good addition.

[b31den]

Originally Posted by Ayreonaut

Albany and Hartford are virtually the same size, which is comparable to the two Alberta cities. Though Hartford is closer to other centres such as Bridgeport and New Haven.
I don't know if Albany could support a team, but I'm sure Hartford could. I don't think the relocation of the Whalers had anything to do with a lack of fan support.

Although Albany is supposedly "similar" in size to the Alberta cities it really can't hold a candle to them. Albany is more like Regina, Kelowna, or perhaps Halifax if you feel really generous:


Image from Wikipedia

There are at least 6-8 american teams that should either move or fold. Several would have to fold as the NHL has overexpanded and there are a limited number of cities left which could support new teams.

Also, Las Vegas is death for pro sports teams, no one will touch that. Not the NFL, MLB, NBA or even the desperate NHL.

I guess the bottom line is the NHL's problems stem from:
1) Overpaid Players
2) Seeking to become a "major sports league" in the US when most of it doesn't care about hockey
3) The NHL is too focused on making money (aka losing money)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by b31den

Although Albany is supposedly "similar" in size to the Alberta cities it really can't hold a candle to them. Albany is more like Regina, Kelowna, or perhaps Halifax if you feel really generous:


Image from Wikipedia

There are at least 6-8 american teams that should either move or fold. Several would have to fold as the NHL has overexpanded and there are a limited number of cities left which could support new teams.

Also, Las Vegas is death for pro sports teams, no one will touch that. Not the NFL, MLB, NBA or even the desperate NHL.

I guess the bottom line is the NHL's problems stem from:
1) Overpaid Players
2) Seeking to become a "major sports league" in the US when most of it doesn't care about hockey
3) The NHL is too focused on making money (aka losing money)

Although I would agree that the NHL in Albany will happen when pigs fly, it is at the centre of a polycentric region of more than 1 million people with other cities like Schenectady, Saratoga Springs, Troy, and dozens of other small towns of 20,000 people or so. Many metro areas in the northeast U.S. are structured like this, as opposed to those in Canada (especially the west) where the central city municipality makes up 80 or 90% of the metro's population.

It all adds up, and a million people in a whole bunch of contiguous, smaller municipalities is still the exact same number of potential customers as one million people in one large city.

But as I said, I don't think the NHL would ever go to Albany. Although they do have an arena that is bigger than anything you'd find in Winnipeg or Quebec City at the moment:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Union_Center

[DHLawrence]

That's the same way Hamilton promoted themselves to the NHL--the city is rather small by NHL standards (only half a million if you include the suburbs), but it's surrounded by one of the most densely-populated areas in North America. We've got a bit more bulk on our side than Albany, though.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by DHLawrence

That's the same way Hamilton promoted themselves to the NHL--the city is rather small by NHL standards (only half a million if you include the suburbs), but it's surrounded by one of the most densely-populated areas in North America. We've got a bit more bulk on our side than Albany, though.

... and more genuine, established interest in hockey!

[MTLskyline]

Alright, here's my proposition:

Florida Panthers > Quebec City
Phoenix Coyotes > Winnipeg (how's that for justice?)
Atlanta Thrasher > Hamilton (I like the name Bulldogs, they ought to use the same name as their current AHL team)
Nashville Predators > Milwaukee

Perhaps teams to Seattle, Hartford, Cleveland or Salt Lake City as well.

[mintzilla]

^ i would love a team in Seattle. we could finally be rid of those Minnesota dogs in the Northwest conference

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by MTLskyline

Atlanta Thrasher > Hamilton (I like the name Bulldogs, they ought to use the same name as their current AHL team)

Naw, if Hamilton ever gets an NHL team they should be named after the original... the Tigers. It's got hockey history and fits in with the Ti-Cats.

[Distill3d]

Originally Posted by MTLskyline

Alright, here's my proposition:

Florida Panthers > Quebec City
Phoenix Coyotes > Winnipeg (how's that for justice?)
Atlanta Thrasher > Hamilton (I like the name Bulldogs, they ought to use the same name as their current AHL team)
Nashville Predators > Milwaukee

Perhaps teams to Seattle, Hartford, Cleveland or Salt Lake City as well.

Okay, I can agree to that. Except, lets merge a couple teams together. Like Tampa and Florida, then move them to Quebec. We could merge the LA Kings and Anaheim Ducks into one team and leave them as the Los Angeles Kings of Anaheim. This leaves the NHL open for expansion to Seattle and Salt Lake City.

[cornholio]

Quebec, Winipeg and Hamilton wont have teams within our lifetimes...sigh....i cant beleive i still have to repeat for 3 years now.

Sorry for being a downer but its the sad truth.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by Berklon

Naw, if Hamilton ever gets an NHL team they should be named after the original... the Tigers. It's got hockey history and fits in with the Ti-Cats.

Well, of course the Hamilton Tigers were formerly the Quebec Bulldogs.