HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Urban, Urban Design & Heritage Issues


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #41  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2019, 4:37 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Sounds like a traffic nightmare. 6000 is too small. 10,000 seats would be a better compromise. I'm assuming CF would pay for the parking garage? no way the city should pay money for that.

I still hold hope that the City moves fast enough for Andaleaur's liking and a compromise is met for a 10,000 seat arena downtown.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #42  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2019, 4:41 PM
HamiltonBoyInToronto HamiltonBoyInToronto is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 452
I hate the idea of this venue at a mall on the mountain but if that's the idea then why not Eastgate mall ? Huge parking lot and Sears empty ....on the LRT line ...close to QEW and the new GO station.....
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #43  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2019, 6:07 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Quote:
Originally Posted by HamiltonBoyInToronto View Post
I hate the idea of this venue at a mall on the mountain but if that's the idea then why not Eastgate mall ? Huge parking lot and Sears empty ....on the LRT line ...close to QEW and the new GO station.....
I think the Bulldogs did a study and the majority of their fans come from Hamilton mountain(who drive to the game) so the limeridge location is their preference. Their preference may not be the best location and size for the City as a whole though.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #44  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2019, 6:43 PM
Berklon's Avatar
Berklon Berklon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Hamilton (The Brooklyn of Canada)
Posts: 3,042
Seriously, it wouldn't bother me one bit if the OHL team just relocated.
I don't like the idea of bending over backwards for something that has this small a following.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #45  
Old Posted Sep 10, 2019, 11:35 PM
ScreamingViking's Avatar
ScreamingViking ScreamingViking is offline
Ham-burgher
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 6,466
As much as I respect Andlauer for sticking it out here with the AHL and OHL, I don't think the city would have any problem finding a new regular tenant if the current edition of the Bulldogs were to leave.

I would be fine with a suitably sized Lime Ridge arena but only if private interests fund the heck out of it. But it seems like it may only be possible if the city ponies up large for both the rink and a parking garage, and that's not going to work with public money.

Cadillac-Fairview has played this smartly for their own potential gain. Can't blame them, they do need to keep their thing going up on Upper Wentworth.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #46  
Old Posted Sep 11, 2019, 4:07 AM
thistleclub thistleclub is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,728
I suspected as much with the 2022 target date, but the new Dreschel column suggests that Andlauer is working the Bob Young/Scott Mitchell playbook of using elections to squeeze concessions out of council.

Kind of like the 2010 West Harbour drama, except that the City hasn't just been awarded a Games bid that would have two-thirds of capital costs covered by senior government, and doesn't have a sizeable Future Fund reservoir to draw down. (And notably, that saga ended with the new facility basically a 90-degree rotation of the old.)
__________________
"Where architectural imagination is absent, the case is hopeless." - Louis Sullivan
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #47  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 2:41 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 19,872
Hamilton Bulldogs offering $30M toward proposed $72M Mountain arena
Owner Michael Andlauer is speaking to councillors about his pitch this morning.

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/9...ountain-arena/

Hamilton Bulldogs owner Michael Andlauer is proposing to pay up to $30 million toward the construction of a proposed $72-million OHL arena at Lime Ridge Mall.

The contentious pitch, to be made publicly this morning to Hamilton city councillors, also include a city-built $54-million parking garage at the Mountain mall, with Cadillac Fairview expected to lease the needed land for $1 a year.

Andlauer's presentation, made available ahead of this morning's meeting at city hall, also suggests a partnership with Metrolinx on the parking garage is possible via a related GO Transit park-and-ride.

The hockey team also proposes to take over management of the pitched 6,000-seat arena for 20 years, a move it suggests would eliminate the taxpayer subsidy on the current aging FirstOntario Centre downtown.

The public presentation was requested by council after The Spectator obtained and reported on a copy of a confidential arena pitch that suggested the city share the cost of a Mountain arena — but didn't reveal how much taxpayers would be expected to cough up.

The unsolicited pitch from Andlauer and Cadillac Fairview landed like a bomb amid a separate debate over whether to pursue a private-public redevelopment of all city-owned entertainment facilities downtown.

A city consultant has recommended building a $130-million, 10,000-seat arena and concert facility downtown alongside new private sector, "high-intensity" development and — eventually — a new convention centre.

Council has delayed moving ahead with that recommendation to deal with the surprise Mountain arena proposal.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #48  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 3:10 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
$72M for an arena but $54M for the parking garage. If he's giving only $30M that doesn't even cover the parking garage?

Doesn't sound like a great deal. The city would essentially be paying for a smaller arena and half a parking garage all on its own?

Also a 6000 seat arena will surely eliminate Hamilton from some of the larger concerts and events.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #49  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 3:13 PM
SteelTown's Avatar
SteelTown SteelTown is offline
It's Hammer Time
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 19,872
Total cost for the arena is $126 million, with $30 million from Andlauer the city would be on the hook for $96 million.

That's far more than the city contributed to Tim Hortons Field, $40 million.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #50  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 3:16 PM
interr0bangr interr0bangr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Landsdale
Posts: 559
Fuck that. Keep the arena downtown or get the hell out of town.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #51  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 10:25 PM
StEC's Avatar
StEC StEC is offline
Burger Connoisseur
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 581
Quote:
Originally Posted by interr0bangr View Post
Fuck that. Keep the arena downtown or get the hell out of town.
Agreed! This is a farce, the Arena renovated or brand new must be downtown. Where is Cadillac Fairviews money in this proposal? They are a multi billion dollar mega corporation and they are not funding anything??? They are laughing all the way to the bank if this gets approved!
__________________
Living in and loving Hamilton since Jan. 2014!
Follow me on Instagram & Threads where I feature the beauty of Hamilton, Niagara & Toronto!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #52  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2019, 10:27 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Quote:
Originally Posted by StEC View Post
Agreed! This is a farce, the Arena renovated or brand new must be downtown. Where is Cadillac Fairviews money in this proposal? They are a multi billion dollar mega corporation and they are not funding anything??? They are laughing all the way to the bank if this gets approved!
I guess their contribution is the land in kind?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #53  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:34 AM
bigguy1231 bigguy1231 is offline
Concerned Citizen
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 1,335
If the city is going to spend a hundred million then they can spend it on upgrading FOC. Why would we downgrade to a 6000 seat arena at a suburban mall that would add no value to this city.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #54  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:42 AM
matt602's Avatar
matt602 matt602 is offline
Hammer'd
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamilton, ON
Posts: 4,751
On top of that entire thing being ridiculous, I can't see GO Transit being interested in running a bus up to Limeridge when they can't even get proper ridership #'s at the stations in the lower city.
__________________
"Above all, Hamilton must learn to think like a city, not a suburban hybrid where residents drive everywhere. What makes Hamilton interesting is the fact it's a city. The sprawl that surrounds it, which can be found all over North America, is running out of time."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #55  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:43 AM
HamiltonBoyInToronto HamiltonBoyInToronto is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 452
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguy1231 View Post
if the city is going to spend a hundred million then they can spend it on upgrading foc. Why would we downgrade to a 6000 seat arena at a suburban mall that would add no value to this city.
this 1000%. This!!!!!!!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #56  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:46 AM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguy1231 View Post
If the city is going to spend a hundred million then they can spend it on upgrading FOC. Why would we downgrade to a 6000 seat arena at a suburban mall that would add no value to this city.
Watch this turn into THF 2.0 where they spend 100m at FOC either renovating or demolishing and building new.

Thing is Bulldogs owner is pretty adamant he wants something much smaller than FOC.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #57  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 10:06 AM
thistleclub thistleclub is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,728
Quote:
Originally Posted by king10 View Post
Watch this turn into THF 2.0 where they spend 100m at FOC either renovating or demolishing and building new.

Thing is Bulldogs owner is pretty adamant he wants something much smaller than FOC.
A new 6K arena is still probably 2K bigger than the team technically needs. He might want to look into the cost of doubling the seating capacity of Andreychuk Arena, a legacy OHL facility located about a kilometre west of LRM.
__________________
"Where architectural imagination is absent, the case is hopeless." - Louis Sullivan
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #58  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:46 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Quote:
Originally Posted by thistleclub View Post
A new 6K arena is still probably 2K bigger than the team technically needs. He might want to look into the cost of doubling the seating capacity of Andreychuk Arena, a legacy OHL facility located about a kilometre west of LRM.
I think thats a non starter for him. That is more of a community rink, he wants commercial development opportunity which that arena doesn't provide. Also the 6,000 may be too big for weeknight regular season games, but it would sell out for marquee games and playoffs.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #59  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 1:50 PM
drpgq drpgq is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Hamilton/Dresden
Posts: 1,808
If I remember the consultant report stats, didn't the Bulldogs basically make no money for the stadium while the other events generated all the revenue that there was for First Ontario?

In some ways I'm surprised the parking lot is even necessary given the colossal amounts of parking at the mall, but I guess a Saturday afternoon game would interfere with mall crowds and could potentially go over capacity.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #60  
Old Posted Oct 3, 2019, 3:16 PM
king10 king10 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 2,761
Quote:
Originally Posted by drpgq View Post
If I remember the consultant report stats, didn't the Bulldogs basically make no money for the stadium while the other events generated all the revenue that there was for First Ontario?

In some ways I'm surprised the parking lot is even necessary given the colossal amounts of parking at the mall, but I guess a Saturday afternoon game would interfere with mall crowds and could potentially go over capacity.
even if there is a parking garage built, can you believe all the traffic chaos around the holiday shopping season(Black Friday, Christmas)? It's backed up onto the Linc as it is, imagine another 6000 people when the area is already rammed. Recipe for disaster IMO.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Hamilton > Urban, Urban Design & Heritage Issues
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 6:48 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.