CHICAGO | Highrise Projects & Construction, v7 - Page 776

the urban politician · #**15501** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 2:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicubs111

As space becomes scarce and land values increase... zoning changes are an absolute necessity (especially this area which is probably the most densest\pricest in downtown).. the aldermans use the zoning change as leverage not to approve increases (either there personal or supposed "community" opinion) which is the problem with this whole process... We all been talking on this forum for years about land values and as empty lots get gobbled up downtown the taller buildings will arrive more frequently as times goes on (ala manhatten) ...well thats not gonna happen without zoning changes, especially when the type of zoning for a lot of land 30 years ago might not make sense now. Yes the developer is not entitled to build but seems like pretty bad business practice for not allowing to maximize your land values in extremely high demand areas!

It's all about playing the game.

The developer probably had a hunch he would get stuck building something shorter, so now he'll come back with a less dense proposal.

And the Alderman gets to save face.

It's all a big game of bullshit

rgarri4 · #**15502** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 2:40 PM**

On 845 Madison I thought the brick would continue all the way, just with a different color for the upper floors. That's a dam shame that it doesn't.

RedCorsair87 · #**15503** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 2:49 PM**

I like the brick on 845 Madison. The rest looks like dogshit. Shameful

Handro · #**15504** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 3:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by marothisu

New construction building permit was issued for 800 W Fulton Market aka 331 N Green St. Foundation up through the lower levels. This is the SOM designed office building - 18 stories, 36 parking spaces and ground floor retail/commercial.

https://chicago.curbed.com/2019/3/13...arket-thor-som
[IMG//cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/DAuyGAgbqN640XDpEIUizP23iTw=/0x0:5000x2813/920x613/filters:focal(2100x1007:2900x1807):format(webp)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/63231707/800_West_Fulton__c__SOM__2_.0.jpg[/IMG]

Is it just me or did this one move pretty fast from proposal stage to building permit? Not complaining, really like this one and what it will add to the neighborhood.

Sohcatoah · #**15505** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 3:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by marothisu

-----

New construction building permit was issued for 800 W Fulton Market aka 331 N Green St. Foundation up through the lower levels. This is the SOM designed office building - 18 stories, 36 parking spaces and ground floor retail/commercial.

https://chicago.curbed.com/2019/3/13...arket-thor-som

Hell yes. This is my favorite proposed building in West Loop. Can’t wait to see this one when it is finished. Love the weird looking x bracing.

killaviews · #**15506** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 6:08 PM**

Website for 800 Fulton Market. Maybe some new renderings?
https://800fultonmarket.com/renderings

harryc · #**15507** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 7:30 PM**

Aug 27

Chicago by Harry Carmichael, on Flickr

#TallShipWindy

gebs · #**15508** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 7:30 PM**

I love images like this because given the million projects happening in Fulton Market, it can be challenging to remember where all these developments are. Renderings like these do a great job of that:

maru2501 · #**15509** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 7:59 PM**

wow. big impact from the kennedy. I hope they do the plantings like that as well .. cool

SamInTheLoop · #**15510** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsmith318

Now that the window wall is going up on the upper floors of 845 W Madison (first five are window with brick, upped er floors are window wall), is this an awful case of value engineering?

Check out the rendering on Buck's website vs. actual photos I took yesterday. A whole lot less glass and a whole lot more coated metal wall. The finish is pretty ugly too when you see it in person (pictures aren't doing it justice). It's two tone colors of grey with like a truck liner finish to the metal.

Reminds me of a highway exit quick serve hotel - just need to punch through the packaged HVAC units for each unit to complete the look.

Wow. Certainly appears to be the case. This is incredibly disappointing. I had high hopes for this one. John Buck and Lendlease should really be ashamed of this. Beneath them both.

SamInTheLoop · #**15511** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

It's worth bearing in mind that the only way Hopkins gets to say no is because the developer is asking to build more than is allowed by law.

While true, would you assert this decision constitutes good public policy? Hopkins clearly believes it’s good politics.

What’s more, while I’m not certain the maximum size current zoning would allow for, would you agree that the triggers for a required PD are too low for downtown? I definitely think they are, and this may be applicable in this case.

I certainly agree with TUP that this may likely be a classic developer-aldermanic game that’s been mapped out at work.

SamInTheLoop · #**15512** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sohcatoah

Hell yes. This is my favorite proposed building in West Loop. Can’t wait to see this one when it is finished. Love the weird looking x bracing.

I’ve been looking forward to this one as well, from a design standpoint. The program, again, not so much, as west of the expressway makes much less sense for significant office from a sound urban planning perspective (a smattering of smaller boutique new and adaptively re-used office buildings and mixed-use including office would be a different matter).

SamInTheLoop · #**15513** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by marothisu

Garage at 50 E Randolph (Randolph & Wabash) got a demolition permit yesterday. A new 25 story, 190 unit building will go there in its place:
[url]https://chicago.curbed.com/2018/12/28/18159026/loop-development-apartments-50-east-randolph

Good. This tower will be going up at the same time as 300 North Michigan.

I also wonder about the small lot adjacent (to the north) to 50 E Randolph....it’s targeted for that small City Club Apartments project....will that be going up concurrently as well? Nice and evidential boost in this part of the Loop.

the urban politician · #**15514** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop

Good. This tower will be going up at the same time as 300 North Michigan.

^ How do you know that?

the urban politician · #**15515** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 8:52 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop

as west of the expressway makes much less sense for significant office from a sound urban planning perspective

A theory of yours that has been debunked over and over and over again, but you've decided that "being a broken record" makes one sound knowledgeable, so carry on....

SamInTheLoop · #**15516** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 9:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ How do you know that?

Recent media report that construction start for 300 N is in Nov.
50 Randolph just got its demo permits and landed construction financing per media report a couple months ago.

Follow?

SIGSEGV · #**15517** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 9:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

A theory of yours that has been debunked over and over and over again, but you've decided that "being a broken record" makes one sound knowledgeable, so carry on....

Why is it so crazy? It would be better for most office jobs to be as central as possible so as many people as possible can get to them easily using existing infrastructure. Obviously, if there was no more room left in the loop it would be a different story.

SamInTheLoop · #**15518** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 9:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician

A theory of yours that has been debunked over and over and over again, but you've decided that "being a broken record" makes one sound knowledgeable, so carry on....

Major LOLZ.

Do tell - how have I been shown wrong that it is poor urban planning to allow for meaningful density of large scale office space in Fulton Market?

You seem to be mistaking market demand in some cases (and actually also new market supply in many cases, as a lot of these are now pure spec buildings that have not been leased, or with very little leasing)....in other words, private market forces, for sound planning principles. That a city planning department is toothless, and plays completely in the background to politics (in not directing heavy office to the transit core, and in allowing for residential to effectively be blocked from Fulton Market is a separate issue from what you are incongruently arguing debunks my ‘theory’ that all of this office in Fulton is incompatible with sound urban planning principles.

This stuff isn’t even really difficult, or subtle, or nuanced. It’s really simple, basic - baby stuff, even.

SIGSEGV gets it.

Also, I just have to ask: what’s with the weird, Trumpy quotes around “being a broken record”?

Mr Downtown · #**15519** Posted **Sep 5, 2019, 10:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop

would you assert [denying the PD for 1130 N State] constitutes good public policy?

I haven't yet heard Ald. Hopkins's rationale, but I've usually found Ald. Reilly's reasons pretty convincing. Base zoning here is an FAR of 7, and several bonuses easily kick you up to 10 or 11, meaning you can pretty easily do a 25-30 story building with very efficient dimensions on a site this large. Stay under 30 stories and 350 units and you never even have to go see the alderman.

Now if Hopkins is just pandering to the folks in 1133 N. Dearborn whose views might be blocked, or Gold Coasters thinking these new folks will take their onstreet parking—then let him have it with both barrels.

Quote:

would you agree that the triggers for a required PD are too low for downtown?

I'm pretty happy with the triggers, and I think they're a good compromise between negotiated planning and unfettered free-market development. I definitely want DPD doing a careful look at the urban design, streetscape, and traffic/delivery aspects of all big developments.

aaron38 · #**15520** Posted **Sep 6, 2019, 1:29 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop

...in not directing heavy office to the transit core, and in allowing for residential to effectively be blocked from Fulton Market...

I keep looking at the map and I keep on not seeing the problem. The major Metra transit hubs are all between the Kennedy and the River. If west of the Kennedy doesn't make sense, east of the river doesn't make sense either.
But east of the river does make sense, so...

From the west, get off at Morgan. From the NW, get off at Grand, walk down. From the north, transfer to the Green, too bad. From the South, take the Green to Morgan. From the burbs, walk the same distance west you'd walk east.
For burbs to the west, put in a Green Line station at Western, allow for Metra to CTA transfers at Western.
The West Loop around Morgan is not some isolated transit desert only accessible by fleets of cars. It's just not, and I don't understand this thinking.

As for residential around Morgan, it's the same. The west loop there has great transit access. Residential is best put further out on the spurs. There is tremendous room for residential growth west on the Green Line, and elsewhere. Build, build, build.
I've said it before, I'll say it again. Don't build residential districts within a 15 minute walk of Ogilvie/Union Station. Nor Morgan. Some scattered infill residential is fine. But the west loop around Morgan is not a place for families trying to raise kids. It's fast becoming an office district, just embrace the change and go with it.

Case in point: WeWork is taking office space at 167 N. Green. That's a 10 minute, 1/2 mile walk from the Ogilvie exit on Clinton.
I've walked from Ogilvie to the WeWork office at 332 S. Michigan Ave. That's a 27 min, 1.3 mile walk. So which one makes more sense for the most people?