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  #461  
Old Posted Oct 8, 2013, 5:35 PM
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Originally Posted by aquablue View Post
I don't think this building design is worthy of the most lucrative site in the world. It looks like a horrible pastiche of the ESB in a modern style done in a lazy manner. Rather disappointing I feel. I think they should not impinge upon the legacy of the ESB and move in a more modern direction. Creating a new ESB for the 21st century with a style that reflects the current cutting edge in architecture would be the better way to go. Instead they are merely rehashing old ideas that pale in comparison to what was built in he 30s. I'd like to see a stunning organic or futurist tower here that would mark the vanguard of the next generation of NYC skyscraper innovation.
It doesn't look bad at all. It's an office building in New York City, I don't know what people expected. Like the World Trade Center somehow looks better? This is at least on par with Hudson Yards, which is good looking already. I'll be waiting for that "better design for the spot."
     
     
  #462  
Old Posted Oct 8, 2013, 6:02 PM
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It doesn't look bad at all. It's an office building in New York City, I don't know what people expected. Like the World Trade Center somehow looks better? This is at least on par with Hudson Yards, which is good looking already. I'll be waiting for that "better design for the spot."
Agreed.

It's not just the physical shape that matters. WTC 4 doesn't have a particularly interesting design, but the spectacular glass facade ads a real touch of class to it. This building could have a so so design (even though I think the spire/pinnacle is quite well done) but if the more subtle details are done correctly, it could be a real winner.
     
     
  #463  
Old Posted Oct 8, 2013, 7:31 PM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
I wish this would be quicker because I fear the economy would kill something like this. With the shutdown, and deficit nonsense, idk. It just doesn't seem like luck will be generous towards it. Whats a reasonable time frame for a demo. Like 2015?
Work cannot begin here until 2017, with below grade work getting a year head start because of the transit connections they will have to make. Anyone moving in won't be able to do so until 2020, according to city planning. This is a building for the longer term, not immediate future.



Quote:
Originally Posted by aquablue View Post
I don't think this building design is worthy of the most lucrative site in the world. It looks like a horrible pastiche of the ESB in a modern style done in a lazy manner.....I'd like to see a stunning organic or futurist tower here that would mark the vanguard of the next generation of NYC skyscraper innovation.
I believe this to be the concept of what they are putting together for the short term. They won't even be allowed to build this large unless the design passes a "superior design" test that will be implemented with the new zoining. Hines has had experience firsthand (Tower Verre) with the approvals process when that element wasn't even involved. In the long run, the design will be brought up to standards.



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  #464  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 4:02 PM
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I've been thinking about KPF's possibilities when designing the top, and thought about their work on the Ping An Finance Center, as far as public space goes...

I think there's a lot of potential here when thy finally get down to it.




http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=517647




http://www.archdaily.com/259188/ping...ce-center-kpf/



Or even their planning for the Hudson Yards deck...










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  #465  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 6:18 PM
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This is not a bad design at all. It's a tall, stong, good looking tower. The fact that it is getting slender as it goes up reminds me of the pre-war towers (without set-back). The top is very nice with its big atrium and and its glass antenna. It will perfectly fit in the NYC's skyline.

Too bad it will take so long to see it rise. Midtown south is in dire need of a tower like that for it clearly misses a tall signature tower. BOFA's tower could have fulffilled that task if it had been higher or much less bulky at the bottom (both would have been better of course). Given its location, I have always considered Bofa's tower as a missed opportunity (another Dust mistake).

One question: NYC will soon have a new Mayor, and given the last poll it will be Bill de Blasio. It seems De Blasio wants to erase a large part of Bloomberg's legacy. Does someone know his position on big projects? Can the future city council vote a new ordinance to cancel the rezoning of south Midtown?

Thanks in advance for your answer.
     
     
  #466  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 6:24 PM
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The design will change quite a bit, I think, especially given the modification to allow residential - which is much more profitable than commercial development at the moment. I think we see this get taller and more 'wedding-cake-y'.
     
     
  #467  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 6:58 PM
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Originally Posted by FMIII View Post
One question: NYC will soon have a new Mayor, and given the last poll it will be Bill de Blasio. It seems De Blasio wants to erase a large part of Bloomberg's legacy. Does someone know his position on big projects? Can the future city council vote a new ordinance to cancel the rezoning of south Midtown?
Bill DeBlasio is a pandering idiot, but he's generally pro-development. Most observers think he'll be basically the same as Bloomberg in terms of development policy.
     
     
  #468  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 8:04 PM
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Bill DeBlasio is a pandering idiot, but he's generally pro-development. Most observers think he'll be basically the same as Bloomberg in terms of development policy.
Thank you for your answer.

I was a bit scared that some future projects like this one would be jeopardized because of him. Especially if one take into account his stance on rich people. This guy must have been French in a previous life

Again, great project and awesome tower.
     
     
  #469  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 8:41 PM
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Details for KPF's Midtown Giant One Vanderbilt



Quote:
1) The tower, located just west of Grand Central on Vanderbilt Avenue between 42nd and 43rd streets, is going to be tall, likely approaching the 1,500-foot mark. Just look at its height in relation to the Chrysler and MetLife buildings.
2) The angular apex of the 1.55-million-square-foot skyscraper, a refreshing departure from typical tapered tops with antennae, is reminiscent of Hudson Yards' architecture, which makes sense given KPF's masterminding role over there.
3) KPF's James von Klemperer envisions it as a "Grand Central West," with lots of pedestrian access to the transit hub. The area's imminent rezoning will allow greater density and traffic to the neighborhood, and KPF's plan includes a large, open public space at the base.
Quote:
At the moment, the crown of One Vanderbilt is meant to be accessible to the public. But when if the rezoning passes, NY YIMBY notes, the building could get even taller, and residential development would be allowed, which might get in the way of the best-laid plans for a public observatory. In short, what we see from these renderings may not be what actually get built, but it's a taste of a major Midtown player on the horizon.
http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/1...vanderbilt.php

I believe that the tower at the end will be much taller than 1500 feet, not only for the possible residential units, but also because SL Green wants a tower more big with at least 2.2-2.5 million square feet.
     
     
  #470  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2013, 9:06 PM
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It looks 1500' especially with the model of the Coach towerr next to it.
     
     
  #471  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2013, 12:46 AM
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  #472  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2013, 1:38 AM
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Originally Posted by FMIII View Post
One question: NYC will soon have a new Mayor, and given the last poll it will be Bill de Blasio. It seems De Blasio wants to erase a large part of Bloomberg's legacy. Does someone know his position on big projects? Can the future city council vote a new ordinance to cancel the rezoning of south Midtown?

This is De Blasio's own response to the Midtown rezoning. Read it if you really want to know how he feels about it, and form your own opinion.






If that isn't enough of a clue on where he stands on development issues, here's a few more tidbits...


http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article...GS04/130829865

Quote:
Mr. de Blasio's appointee to the City Planning Commission voted with the administration 91% of the time, including to approve Extell Development Co.'s residential project that reportedly will include a separate entrance for subsidized tenants.

http://capitalnewyork.com/article/po...ent-pragmatist

Quote:
.....de Blasio’s record as a councilman demonstrated a willingness to work with developers to spur economic development and tackle the city's affordable housing crisis, using an approach to land use that at times bore a strong resemblance to Bloomberg's own. For instance, de Blasio, like Bloomberg, was a staunch backer of the Atlantic Yards project, on the basis of the developer's promise to provide union construction jobs and more than 2,000 units of below-market housing.

In 2009, he pushed through a rezoning of a development site on the Gowanus Canal so Toll Brothers could build 447 condos there. And, when Toll Brothers said they would pull out if the federal government declared the canal a Superfund site, de Blasio backed a Bloomberg alternative cleanup that the city promised would take fewer years and have the added benefit of not scaring developers away by stigmatizing the neighborhood with the "Superfund" label.

And, like Bloomberg, but to the consternation of some very vocal Brooklyn Heights residents, he supported the development of condos in Brooklyn Bridge Park to help fund the park's operations.

Not trying to take you off point here. But the bottom line is that De Blasio won't be a whole lot different than Bloomberg when it comes to development issues. But for the East Midtown rezoning specifically, De Blasio doesn't feel it goes far enough, and is too restrictive.
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  #473  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2013, 3:59 AM
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Not trying to take you off point here. But the bottom line is that De Blasio won't be a whole lot different than Bloomberg when it comes to development issues. But for the East Midtown rezoning specifically, De Blasio doesn't feel it goes far enough, and is too restrictive.
I red his letter and his recommendations are quite good. Especially his concern regarding the fact that "the proposed scope of the EIS too narrowly defines qualyfing sites" and hence should be broaden. One could argue about his stance on hotels development but it makes sense regarding the primary goal of the rezoning.

I am glad also to learn that he voted with the bloomberg's administration 91% of the time. I can now say that I am 91% reassured

Thanks a lot for this precise and detailed answer. It couldn't be clearer.
     
     
  #474  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2013, 11:09 AM
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I am glad also to learn that he voted with the bloomberg's administration 91% of the time. I can now say that I am 91% reassured
That's not to say Bloomberg was 100% right on these issues all the time, just that there is not a large difference in how the two see development. However, since de Blasio doesn't think the rezoning is broad enough, I do wonder if later he will try to include smaller sites. But I don't know that he would want to start a fight like that, especially since the rezoning won't even kick in for a few years, and it's going through a lot of obstacles to get to even this point. (He's the likely next mayor, but nothing is official yet).

Anyway, when final approval is in place (likely next month), SL Green should have more flexibility to discuss design and begin its own approval process for the site.
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  #475  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2013, 6:25 AM
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I really like what KPF did with Ping An, its one of a few buildings that actually works its way into it's spire I really hope that they are able to do that in One Vanderbilt because I one am getting really tired of the, "Let's put a pointy stick on the roof and call it a spire" train of thought.
     
     
  #476  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2013, 3:47 PM
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I really like what KPF did with Ping An, its one of a few buildings that actually works its way into it's spire I really hope that they are able to do that in One Vanderbilt because I one am getting really tired of the, "Let's put a pointy stick on the roof and call it a spire" train of thought.
I agree, because in the current form, the top really doesn't come together in an elegant fashion at all and looks like a jumbled mess. It just looks wrong and awkward somehow, the progression from crown to spire appears rather lacking in terms of flow.
     
     
  #477  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2013, 4:59 PM
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To change the title to 1500 feet, please.
     
     
  #478  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2013, 1:35 AM
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Wow, I'm relieved to know these informations about De Blasio. I was worried about this change of mayor ... A change in command at this time of ascension of tall buildings is worrying. BUT I'm glad that (maybe) next mayor of NY is not so different in this matter as Bloomberg.
     
     
  #479  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2013, 2:05 AM
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Originally Posted by reencharles View Post
Wow, I'm relieved to know these informations about De Blasio. I was worried about this change of mayor ... A change in command at this time of ascension of tall buildings is worrying. BUT I'm glad that (maybe) next mayor of NY is not so different in this matter as Bloomberg.
If anything mabye even better. Think about it. All these new developments; pro-development. At the same time, he is for more affordable housing and the common man. So possibly we might see a lot more housing for the younger crowd and people just starting careers up.
     
     
  #480  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2013, 5:12 AM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
If anything mabye even better. Think about it. All these new developments; pro-development. At the same time, he is for more affordable housing and the common man. So possibly we might see a lot more housing for the younger crowd and people just starting careers up.


That is something I am actually hoping for, that New York does it's own version of Changsha's Sky City and build large well designed, decently spaced, and affordably priced, supertalls for the incoming denizens of New York.
     
     
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