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  #41  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 2:38 PM
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Originally Posted by elly63 View Post
Throwback Expos day at D.C. baseball game divides Montrealers — and Americans
The Canadian Press TSN.ca July 6 2019

MONTREAL — An Expos throwback day at the Washington Nationals' ballpark has divided Montrealers, with some cheering the vintage uniforms donned by players Saturday afternoon as an overdue homage and others chastising the move as an "insult" to their baseball forebears.

The Nationals — created after the Expos moved to Washington in 2005 — announced this week they would tout the powder blue away jerseys and pants along with the vintage caps sported by Montreal players in their inaugural season 50 years ago.

The gimmick fits into a night of retro theatrics at Nationals Stadium that includes 1960s pop tunes, a stylized "M" on the scoreboard, a ceremonial first pitch thrown by newly inducted Expos Hall-of-Famer Vladimir Guerrero Sr. — and, of course, some poutine and smoked meat among the concessions.

While the stadium features a "ring of honour" that includes Expos legends like Gary Carter and Tim Raines, the Nationals' northern roots go largely unacknowledged in D.C., according to observers.

"It's very pick-and-choosy and it's super weird," said Montreal-based journalist and talk radio host Dave Kaufman.

Tributes to all-stars such as Tim Wallach remain virtually absent from the park, he said. "They left it so that Montrealers, at least in my opinion, still have no love for this team."

But Kaufman isn't among the disgruntled.

"I think it's a nod to the history of the franchise," he said. "I look at this as an advertisement for the city of Montreal that's being done in the capital of the United States."

The debate comes amid rising emotions and renewed hopes for an Expos reincarnation in Quebec's biggest city. "It's these kind of side glances and small smiles," Kaufman said.

Stephen Bronfman — son of former Expos owner Charles Bronfman — has long pushed for a hometown revival. Late last month he praised a "groundbreaking" plan for the Tampa Bay Rays to split games between Montreal and Florida.

Sylvain Tremblay, who co-leads the Encore Baseball Montreal social media group, said he's "looking forward instead of thinking about past problems" — but he can't speak for his city.

"Basically they stole our team, and so on. That's the way some people think in Montreal," said Tremblay, whose group has more than 6,200 followers on Facebook and Twitter. "For them, it's an insult."

"The Washington Nationals wearing my Montreal Expos old uniform feels like a slap to the face," complained one Twitter user who says he lives in an off-island suburb.

Quebeckers aren't the only ones turned off by the marketing stunt.

Washington Times columnist Thom Loverro called it a "cheap, lazy, thoughtless promotion," indicating that any claim to a connection between the two teams seems as distasteful as American poutine.

To have Guerrero tossing the opening pitch is to "celebrate a corpse," he suggested, and posited that D.C. should look to its own past, which includes the Washington Senators who took off for Texas in the early 1970s.

Commenters tended to agree, with one asking rhetorically: "why do we give a rats arse about Montreal?" Another local tweeted that the throwback jersey "manages to disrespect both Expos fans and fans of both Senators teams" (there were two iterations).

Nonetheless, fans cheered late Saturday afternoon as Canada's deputy ambassador to the U.S., Kirsten Hillman, introduced the Nationals after the loudspeakers blared out, "Mesdames et messieurs, ladies and gentlemen, your Expos." Between plays the scoreboard piped out scenes of Expos lore, like Gary Carter celebrating a postseason victory in 1981, the only year the team reached the playoffs.

The shared bond of grief may offer a bridge between the two cities — the last two in Major League Baseball to see teams decamp for other climes.

"They know what kind of pain we have, because they had it in '71," Tremblay said. "What can you do? You don't take care of your girlfriend — now she's gone."

But hope is back in the air in Montreal, mingling with the heady musk of nostalgia.

"The Expos were my youth. They were one of the great joys of my life," Kaufman said. "I have not held that same passion about a sports team since they left.

"It didn't matter that they never won a World Series. It didn't matter that they were overall under .500 for my baseball-watching career," he said.

"They were my team and I loved them and I miss them so much."
The Nationals' Expos tribute registered only a very faint blip in the Quebec media over the weekend.
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  #42  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 3:17 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is offline
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But who will be paying for that new stadium in Montreal whose construction Bronfman's group will be "overseeing"? The article say Bronfman will "oversee" construction, not finance it.
That's a good question. I haven't seen this spelled out anywhere in detail, if it's out there, that is. If it's not, maybe there's a reason.

My impression is that it was going to be mostly paid for by a group of investors, but also would expect there to be some lobbying to the 3 levels of government for some public money. But that is just my expectation on how it would work... or in other words, my speculation...
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  #43  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 3:24 PM
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The Nationals' Expos tribute registered only a very faint blip in the Quebec media over the weekend.
It definitely got attention in the US baseball media. The Expos have become the baseball equivalent of the old cult classic movie that everyone loves to reminisce about.
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  #44  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 7:01 PM
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That's a good question. I haven't seen this spelled out anywhere in detail, if it's out there, that is. If it's not, maybe there's a reason.

My impression is that it was going to be mostly paid for by a group of investors, but also would expect there to be some lobbying to the 3 levels of government for some public money. But that is just my expectation on how it would work... or in other words, my speculation...
That's not happening particularly if Bronfman is in the lead. Brookfield Properties gets hand outs from cities and provinces to build pre-leased, profitable office towers. I don't see them risking their net worth through stock value financing an expensive, money losing asset for an untested team.
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  #45  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 7:04 PM
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It definitely got attention in the US baseball media. The Expos have become the baseball equivalent of the old cult classic movie that everyone loves to reminisce about.
Nostalgia is a very powerful thing. The Whalers suffer from the same fate in Connecticut - a nostalgic throwback with no chance of ever returning. Something nice for older people to discuss and nothing more.
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  #46  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 7:36 PM
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Despite their lack of success with one playoff appearance, the Expos did produce (or had) their fair share of HOFamers and great players. Raines, Carter, Dawson, Guerrero, Pedro and Dennis Martinez, Rogers, Alou. I think some of the nostalgia lies with their lineup of past stars.

I think Bell would be a significant stakeholder in the Expos so I can see a large contribution towards a stadium from them. The Expos would provide them with huge content during the spring/summer and fall on TSN/RDS with 162 dates. Anytime there is another event happening simultaneously - CFL, tennis, golf, World Cup Soccer, other large scale sporting events - they can just place the Expos on their regional affiliate.

Overall, I can see financing of the stadium as follows:

$100 - $200 million from ownership
$125 - $150 million from ticket tax over 20 - 25 years
$100 - $200 million from stadium naming rights
$100 - $200 million from municipality/province
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  #47  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 8:53 PM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Despite their lack of success with one playoff appearance, the Expos did produce (or had) their fair share of HOFamers and great players. Raines, Carter, Dawson, Guerrero, Pedro and Dennis Martinez, Rogers, Alou. I think some of the nostalgia lies with their lineup of past stars.

I think Bell would be a significant stakeholder in the Expos so I can see a large contribution towards a stadium from them. The Expos would provide them with huge content during the spring/summer and fall on TSN/RDS with 162 dates. Anytime there is another event happening simultaneously - CFL, tennis, golf, World Cup Soccer, other large scale sporting events - they can just place the Expos on their regional affiliate.

Overall, I can see financing of the stadium as follows:

$100 - $200 million from ownership
$125 - $150 million from ticket tax over 20 - 25 years
$100 - $200 million from stadium naming rights
$100 - $200 million from municipality/province
I think at least some of the nostalgia for the Expos is the lost opportunity of a serious World Series run that was cut short by the baseball strike of '94-'95. All indications were that they were in the position to make the run right to the end and quite possibly win the championship.

To have that opportunity taken away and then have the team dismantled and eventually moved away has left a feeling of loss for a lot of the fans. At least it did for me...
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  #48  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 9:10 PM
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I could see Quebecor through TVA being a player in the Expos as well. I'm sure they would like to have French rights themselves and parcel out the rest. I'm not sure if Rogers would want in on that, but I can also see them being a fly in Bell's ointment for programming too.
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  #49  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 9:55 PM
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It definitely got attention in the US baseball media. The Expos have become the baseball equivalent of the old cult classic movie that everyone loves to reminisce about.
It's kind of interesting about who gets precedence in the history. Is it the Expos or the old Senators (2x) For the record book, I assume it is the Expos, but historically speaking it was the old Walter Johnson Senators or the team Ted Williams managed in the 60s early 70s. Confusing if you think about it.
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  #50  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2019, 11:28 PM
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It's kind of interesting about who gets precedence in the history. Is it the Expos or the old Senators (2x) For the record book, I assume it is the Expos, but historically speaking it was the old Walter Johnson Senators or the team Ted Williams managed in the 60s early 70s. Confusing if you think about it.
Do either the Twins or Rangers ever wear old Senators uniforms? (asking, I don't know). I do know that I didn't know about the Twins history until I just looked up the prior version of the Senators/Nationals. I knew the Rangers were the Senators before moving to Texas but I have no idea of any kind of historical acknowledgement they make to that part of their history.
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  #51  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 4:07 AM
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On Bonsoir Les Sportifs a Quebec wide radio show this evening, the host said that Rob Manfred told him that the Expos' return will be part of an MLB strategy to market baseball in France Belgium Switzerland, francophone Africa etc.

Basically they want to make the Expos the Francophonie's team.
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  #52  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 12:16 PM
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Vlady hit 90 bombs in the derby last night. We got hope!
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  #53  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 12:37 PM
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On Bonsoir Les Sportifs a Quebec wide radio show this evening, the host said that Rob Manfred told him that the Expos' return will be part of an MLB strategy to market baseball in France Belgium Switzerland, francophone Africa etc.

Basically they want to make the Expos the Francophonie's team.
Interesting... Baseball doesn't have much of a following in those countries, but I see what they are trying to do. The Habs is by far the favourite team in the francophonie (but pretty much limited to Europe in the case of hockey) and the Montreal Impact is getting more attention in those countries than all the other teams, save perhaps the L.A. Galaxy and N.Y. Red Bulls. But that being said, soccer has a very solid foundation in the rest of the world, unlike baseball. Even hockey has a somewhat solid foundation in Europe. Baseball is practically non-existent outside North America, except in Japan.
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  #54  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 12:59 PM
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Interesting... Baseball doesn't have much of a following in those countries, but I see what they are trying to do. The Habs is by far the favourite team in the francophonie (but pretty much limited to Europe in the case of hockey) and the Montreal Impact is getting more attention in those countries than all the other teams, save perhaps the L.A. Galaxy and N.Y. Red Bulls. But that being said, soccer has a very solid foundation in the rest of the world, unlike baseball. Even hockey has a somewhat solid foundation in Europe. Baseball is practically non-existent outside North America, except in Japan.
And parts of Latin America too. But you're right that baseball is fairly limited in global scope.
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  #55  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 1:01 PM
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and the Montreal Impact is getting more attention in those countries than all the other teams,
It helps that L'Impact has had players who are household names in the Francophonie sports milieu like Didier Drogba and Laurent Ciman...
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  #56  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 1:02 PM
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And parts of Latin America too. But you're right that baseball is fairly limited in global scope.
Yes, North America (including Mexico) and the Caribbeans. I am not sure baseball is even on the radar in the countries south of Mexico.
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  #57  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 1:08 PM
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Yes, North America (including Mexico) and the Caribbeans. I am not sure baseball is even on the radar in the countries south of Mexico.
Big in Panama, Nicaragua, and Venezuela.
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  #58  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 1:18 PM
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Big in Panama, Nicaragua, and Venezuela.
And Japan.

Still though, hardly a world sport. Only really important in fewer than a dozen countries.
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  #59  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 1:36 PM
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And Japan.

Still though, hardly a world sport. Only really important in fewer than a dozen countries.
And gridiron football, which is the unchallenged kingpin domestically in the U.S., registers even lower on a global scale.
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  #60  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2019, 3:09 PM
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It's kind of interesting about who gets precedence in the history. Is it the Expos or the old Senators (2x) For the record book, I assume it is the Expos, but historically speaking it was the old Walter Johnson Senators or the team Ted Williams managed in the 60s early 70s. Confusing if you think about it.
Not the same sport, but I know in Winnipeg the Thrashers' franchise is basically considered a technicality. It's the original Jets that get precedence. Yeah Kovalchuk holds a pile of franchise records, but it's the "Winnipeg NHL record" that matters in the eyes of most fans except for a handful of pedantic hockey nerds.

Maybe it's different in Washington given how much time has passed since the original Senators.

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And Japan.

Still though, hardly a world sport. Only really important in fewer than a dozen countries.
Don't forget Korea and Taiwan! I only know this from seeing snippets games on TV while staying at hotels in Asia.



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