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  #18361  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 4:36 PM
kwoldtimer kwoldtimer is online now
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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
And seeing as the GG is appointed by the PM, then all a particularly conniving PM has to do is get his timing right and put a toady in there, or acquire their loyalty somehow. If the GG position is of such vital importance, then it has been poorly implemented.
The GG is appointed by the Queen, not by the PM. Australian political history suggests that, for better or worse, the GG's power to sack and replace the PM is real.
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  #18362  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 4:56 PM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
The GG is appointed by the Queen, not by the PM. Australian political history suggests that, for better or worse, the GG's power to sack and replace the PM is real.
OK, but no one is under the impression that Elizabeth is actually going to hand pick her appointment, and if she ever did it would be scandalous and the end of the arrangement. We're putting a lot of trust in maybes and speculation of what would happen in these situations, which come down to the opinion of an unelected person installed by the position she is supposed to guard Canada against, herself theoretically beholden to a foreign hereditary anachronism. Forgive me if it appears to me that this fire extinguisher appears to be based on 17th century technology and has a missing "last inspected" tag.
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  #18363  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:28 PM
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Exactly. If we feel we need a (functional) independent fire extinguisher, why not democratically elect one at the same time as the general election (by universal suffrage country-wide; it could be an extra part on the exact same ballot as we're currently using, which wouldn't cost a penny to anyone)...?

The ballots would look like:

For the position of MP of your riding:
(Check one)
- Guy One - LPC
- Guy Two - CPC
- Guy Three - NDP
- Guy Four - Greens
- Guy Five - Marxist-Leninist party
- Guy Six - some random independent

For the position of GG of Canada, valid until the next election:
(check one)
- Julie Payette
- Prince Harry
- Justin Bieber
- Some guy no one knows who managed to get on the ballot
- etc.
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  #18364  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:31 PM
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Originally Posted by jmt18325 View Post
Who has suggested the Queen 'getting in the way of Parliament?' The issues that require the intervention of the GG or Queen are related to a PM abusing Parliament.
If the PM "abuses Parliament" against the will of a majority of the MPs, that PM won't stay PM. No need for the Queen at all.

If the PM "abuses Parliament" while backed by a majority of the MPs, then that's democracy. No need for the Queen at all.
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  #18365  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:53 PM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
If the PM "abuses Parliament" against the will of a majority of the MPs, that PM won't stay PM. No need for the Queen at all.
.

It's not like it hasn't happened before. There are historical examples. I'll repeat again - there is no country that does things the way that you're suggesting. There is no Prime Minister in the world that is an executive.
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  #18366  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:54 PM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
Exactly. If we feel we need a (functional) independent fire extinguisher, why not democratically elect one at the same time as the general election (by universal suffrage country-wide; it could be an extra part on the exact same ballot as we're currently using, which wouldn't cost a penny to anyone)...?
That actually makes it far worse. It makes that person more likely to wield their authority when it isn't needed. Similar to my other point, I'm not aware of any parliamentary democracy that does things in the way you suggest.
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  #18367  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 5:56 PM
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Originally Posted by milomilo View Post
OK, but no one is under the impression that Elizabeth is actually going to hand pick her appointment, and if she ever did it would be scandalous and the end of the arrangement. We're putting a lot of trust in maybes and speculation of what would happen in these situations, which come down to the opinion of an unelected person installed by the position she is supposed to guard Canada against, herself theoretically beholden to a foreign hereditary anachronism. Forgive me if it appears to me that this fire extinguisher appears to be based on 17th century technology and has a missing "last inspected" tag.
Something being old doesn't make it obsolete. The model we use is the same as or very similar to those used in Australia, Denmark, The Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, and Spain among others. It's not like it hasn't proven itself.
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  #18368  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:00 PM
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So in your opinion, France is in great peril because there's no "fire extinguisher" as Macron is also commander in chief of the armed forces and could decide to become a tyrant tomorrow...? Is that your point?
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  #18369  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:03 PM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
So in your opinion, France is in great peril because there's no "fire extinguisher" as Macron is also commander in chief of the armed forces and could decide to become a tyrant tomorrow...? Is that your point?
Well, I mean, France isn't exactly a model for successful governing systems. This is try number 5, I believe. France uses a rather unique system (also used by Russia and after looking, a lot of other countries now) that has an executive president and a parliament with a prime minister and executive beholden to the parliament. The two are sometimes in conflict, but so far, it hasn't imploded. It's actually a relatively new (60 years old) system of government.
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  #18370  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:12 PM
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I mean, if you look at the list of semi-presidential republics like France, and then compare it to the list of constitutional monarchies like Canada and parliamentary republics like Germany (since the two are basically the same thing), it's pretty clear which system works better.
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  #18371  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:31 PM
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Trudeau bringing on former BOE and BOC governor Mark Carney as a recovery advisor. I wonder if this presages an entry into politics, especially if Morneau leaves?

Mark Carney, the only person to run two major central banks, is helping Justin Trudeau craft next steps in a plan to pull Canada out of a deep recession sparked by the coronavirus.

Five months after stepping down as Bank of England governor, Carney has become an informal adviser on policy matters with the Canadian prime minister. Trudeau is leaning on the former Goldman Sachs banker as a sounding board for what officials are characterizing as an ambitious economic recovery plan, according to a person familiar with internal policy operations.

The plan will seek to tackle everything from deficiencies in the social safety net to climate change, infrastructure and immigration. The first measures are likely be rolled out in a budget update this fall before a more comprehensive fiscal package early next year, the person said....


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...?sref=x4rjnz06
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  #18372  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:37 PM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
So in your opinion, France is in great peril because there's no "fire extinguisher" as Macron is also commander in chief of the armed forces and could decide to become a tyrant tomorrow...? Is that your point?
If I'm not mistaken, the French have strict rules on the deployment of the Armed Forces, especially in France. Hence the Foreign Legion: the French President's personal foreign intervention outfit that requires no parliamentary approval.
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  #18373  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 6:38 PM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Trudeau bringing on former BOE and BOC governor Mark Carney as a recovery advisor. I wonder if this presages an entry into politics, especially if Morneau leaves?

Mark Carney, the only person to run two major central banks, is helping Justin Trudeau craft next steps in a plan to pull Canada out of a deep recession sparked by the coronavirus.

Five months after stepping down as Bank of England governor, Carney has become an informal adviser on policy matters with the Canadian prime minister. Trudeau is leaning on the former Goldman Sachs banker as a sounding board for what officials are characterizing as an ambitious economic recovery plan, according to a person familiar with internal policy operations.

The plan will seek to tackle everything from deficiencies in the social safety net to climate change, infrastructure and immigration. The first measures are likely be rolled out in a budget update this fall before a more comprehensive fiscal package early next year, the person said....


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...?sref=x4rjnz06
Thanks for posting. This is good news. I may be a rare fan. But I like him. That said, is Trudeau willing to listen to him? He made recommendations before he left. Many were not implemented.
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  #18374  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 7:56 PM
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Carney has a great deal of credibility on both sides of the Atlantic.
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  #18375  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2020, 9:05 PM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Trudeau bringing on former BOE and BOC governor Mark Carney as a recovery advisor. I wonder if this presages an entry into politics, especially if Morneau leaves?h

Mark Carney, the only person to run two major central banks, is helping Justin Trudeau craft next steps in a plan to pull Canada out of a deep recession sparked by the coronavirus.

Five months after stepping down as Bank of England governor, Carney has become an informal adviser on policy matters with the Canadian prime minister. Trudeau is leaning on the former Goldman Sachs banker as a sounding board for what officials are characterizing as an ambitious economic recovery plan, according to a person familiar with internal policy operations.

The plan will seek to tackle everything from deficiencies in the social safety net to climate change, infrastructure and immigration. The first measures are likely be rolled out in a budget update this fall before a more comprehensive fiscal package early next year, the person said....


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...?sref=x4rjnz06
Carney’s name was floating around last year as a possible successor to Justin Trudeau. If the economy is in ruins a year or two from now, I can see how that might not be a terrible idea.
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  #18376  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 12:52 AM
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Canada has contributed an additional $25M to the Lebanon relief effort:

https://twitter.com/journo_dale/stat...101867520?s=20
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  #18377  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 1:53 AM
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Originally Posted by jmt18325 View Post
Canada has contributed an additional $25M to the Lebanon relief effort:

https://twitter.com/journo_dale/stat...101867520?s=20
There were also reports that Canada was looking at options to get wheat to Lebanon quickly, but I don’t know if that has gone anywhere. There was a report today that the country may run out of flour in two weeks or so (grain elevators destroyed in the explosion). I would have thought other Mediterranean countries would be the better option in the short term.
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  #18378  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 2:50 AM
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I see that the G&M is renewing speculation that Morneau may be on the way out.
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  #18379  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 3:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
Carney has a great deal of credibility on both sides of the Atlantic.
Which I have never really understood. I think he is actually a very intelligent and competent individual but what has he done in his tenure at the BOC/BOE except keep interest rates at rock bottom?

I think taking on Carney as an "advisor" is a clever political move by Trudeau. If he accepts, I think his movement into politics is a certainty. Morneau is on his way out and with good reason. Although I don't think he is a bad MoF, he has shown himself to be corrupt and politically incompetent.

Obviously Carney would only go into the Finance portfolio and with Freeland leading the Liberals into the next election, they will crush the Tories.
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  #18380  
Old Posted Aug 11, 2020, 3:51 AM
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I think he’s shown himself to be politically incompetent. I don’t think it’s fair to characterize him as being corrupt.
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