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  #61  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2012, 9:08 PM
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I would have a good laugh if no developers bid on it..... Unfortunately I doubt that will be the case.
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  #62  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2012, 10:46 PM
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What a depressing article. So they started a process years ago, drew up this $7.7M plan in 2009, then threw it out. Now in 2012 there is no appetite for public spending so the compromise is to look for fabled Good Guy developers who will satisfy earlier inflated expectations of subsidy out of the goodness of their heart.

The reality check will come when people freak out because no Toronto developer will build them 6 market-rate townhomes with attached acres of public parks, day care, yoga studios, and whatever else is being asked for.

Has a developer assessed any of these plans at any point to keep them grounded? The meat of planning work is in finding a balance between amenities and development such that things will function and will be built and maintained properly. I feel like the public "wish list" gets about 90% of the attention and credit despite the fact that it is a tiny part of the work.

Do these people congratulate themselves when they go on a shopping spree and max out their credit cards?
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  #63  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2012, 11:47 PM
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From 2008:

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Originally Posted by Keith P. View Post
I wonder why HRM needs to be in the real estate business. If you have a high concentration of housing in that development I'm unsure why HRM is even involved.

I suspect this will run aground on the rocks of financial realities. While spaces for artists, community groups (*cough* HCAP *cough*) and the like are nice in theory, unless you are willing to basically supply free space they are not viable. To put that in new construction that isn't an art school or something similar really will be a financial drag on the feasibility.
And this from 2009:

Quote:
I'm concerned because the actual specifics seem very sketchy and the call to use the municipal portion for arts and nonprofit groups sounds like a plan to turn it into a pretty slummy looking place pretty quickly. Given the city's atrocious track record in maintaining its own buildings I would expect it to look pretty half-assed after a short time. Plus if I read the report correctly they are saying that one of the two old school buildings would be donated to a nonprofit to renovate -- good luck with that.

Q.E.D.
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  #64  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2012, 9:40 PM
macgregor macgregor is offline
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Originally Posted by kph06 View Post
I would have a good laugh if no developers bid on it..... Unfortunately I doubt that will be the case.
You're right, though because of the SP-A fiasco (and other fiascos), developers will now see/feel a higher risk of HRM interference. This might have a small impact on the amount that they are willing to bid for this or other lots.

Even 5% is a few bucks on a multi-million dollar property. Bucks that the city slowly loses out on...
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  #65  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2012, 2:39 PM
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From 2008:



And this from 2009:




Q.E.D.
Very nice use of QED by the way ;-)
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  #66  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2012, 5:43 PM
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You're right, though because of the SP-A fiasco (and other fiascos), developers will now see/feel a higher risk of HRM interference. This might have a small impact on the amount that they are willing to bid for this or other lots.
Unfortunately this is one of those cases where it's very hard to assess the damage that has been done. We will never hear about the offers and proposals that would have been made had the city maintained a better reputation.

The "chilling effect" on all development from a long appeals process and high taxes and fees is similar. Halifax also has the built-in excuse of "what can you do? it's little old Halifax, so of course we won't have development!" There is actually a lot that could be done to improve the economy and development regime of the city.
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  #67  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2012, 10:58 PM
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Very nice use of QED by the way ;-)
Thank you.

Do they still teach Q.E.D. in school?
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  #68  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2012, 2:47 PM
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Thank you.

Do they still teach Q.E.D. in school?
I could've been a judge, but I didn't have the Latin. I didn't have the Latin for the judgin' -- so I become a miner instead
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  #69  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2012, 4:18 PM
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Thank you.

Do they still teach Q.E.D. in school?
Doubtful! Based on some of the students I see come through Dal, they are barely teaching algebra, little less the logic skills require to provide a "proof".

Actually, joking aside, I find it hugely hit or miss depending on the school that they went to. It is shocking the disparity in the quality of education not just within NS but through the entire country. You can find excellent students coming from schools in places that you would least expect it, and piss poor students coming from school that nominally should be strong. Just as an example, the high school in Truro for the last while has been doing really really well at turning out students with a solid understanding of scientific method etc (largely due to the efforts of one teacher in particular), and yet there are other larger urban schools that are barely doing anything.
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  #70  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 3:29 AM
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Housing body touted as site developer
December 7, 2012 - 9:11pm BY REMO ZACCAGNA BUSINESS REPORTER

Quote:
But proposal to use ‘tax money’ for Bloomfield School project questioned by private firm

Halifax Regional Municipality staff says Nova Scotia Housing Development Corp. is the best option to redevelop the former Bloomfield school site in the city’s north end, but Halifax developer Dexel Developments doesn’t agree. (TED PRITCHARD / Staff / File)
The Nova Scotia Housing Development Corp. is being touted by Halifax Regional Municipality staff as the best option to redevelop the former Bloomfield school site in the city’s north end.

But a Halifax developer who participated in the request for proposals is questioning the legitimacy of the process.

“We’re in business, so we’re not upset about losing, but we’re concerned about how is it that the province can bid with our tax money against … private industry?” Louis Lawen, head of Dexel Developments Ltd., said Friday.

His company finished second, out of the three proposals involved in the process, with a score of 66 out of 100.

...
Quote:
(rzaccagna@herald.ca)

Read More: thechronicleherald.ca
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  #71  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 5:35 AM
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It does sound a little strange. Is the NSHDC allowed to build market-rate housing or commercial space? What does "targeted at the creative industry" mean? Did the NSHDC really get to claim presumed future tax dollars against their building costs, and was that why they came in under the other bidders? If so the bidding process seems incredibly slanted because, as far as I know, those other bidders also had to provide below-market rate housing.

In a sense this project appears simultaneously heavy-handed and lazy in that the city seems to be handing over the whole thing to a developer (or quasi-developer) while at the same time pandering to special interests and picking winners and losers (the losers pay for the subsidy but do not get subsidized space).

Meanwhile the Housing Trust of Nova Scotia has had to push back housing developments on lots they own because the city is taking forever to grant them a variance on sites with absurd zoning.

It's great to see all the construction happening these days but I still feel like a lot of it is happening in spite of City Hall rather than because of it.
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  #72  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 10:36 AM
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Haha, isn't this like the counter example to the St. Pat's alexandra case?

I think this is a real conflict of interest...
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  #73  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 1:45 PM
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Nothing good will come from NSHDC. They are used to building low-rent cheap and ugly public projects with low-bid contractors. And Lawen's point about using public money to compete with the private sector is a good one. I smell a whiff of NDP cronyism here.
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  #74  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 3:04 PM
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Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
It does sound a little strange. Is the NSHDC allowed to build market-rate housing or commercial space? What does "targeted at the creative industry" mean? Did the NSHDC really get to claim presumed future tax dollars against their building costs, and was that why they came in under the other bidders? If so the bidding process seems incredibly slanted because, as far as I know, those other bidders also had to provide below-market rate housing.

In a sense this project appears simultaneously heavy-handed and lazy in that the city seems to be handing over the whole thing to a developer (or quasi-developer) while at the same time pandering to special interests and picking winners and losers (the losers pay for the subsidy but do not get subsidized space).

Meanwhile the Housing Trust of Nova Scotia has had to push back housing developments on lots they own because the city is taking forever to grant them a variance on sites with absurd zoning.

It's great to see all the construction happening these days but I still feel like a lot of it is happening in spite of City Hall rather than because of it.
My understanding is that this is a separate entity from the Housing Trust of Nova Scotia so I'm not sure if they're delays relate.

Anyway, here is the report from council. http://www.halifax.ca/council/agenda...1211ca1114.pdf
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  #75  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 3:08 PM
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This is the winning bidder:

http://novascotia.ca/coms/housing/Ho...pmentCorp.html

Looks like we're in for a new Uniacke Square. Lovely.
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  #76  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 3:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Jonovision View Post
Anyway, here is the report from council. http://www.halifax.ca/council/agenda...1211ca1114.pdf
Interesting thing in that report: three of the signatories approving it are ex-provincial govt employees, Keefe, Tyson and Fraser. Fraser is particularly interesting as she is HRMs new Director of Planning but was a provincial bean counter in her former career. You may remember her as the person who appeared in front of the media explaining the financial deal around Nova Center. Wait until Bousquet gets a whiff of this.
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  #77  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 4:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Keith P. View Post
This is the winning bidder:

http://novascotia.ca/coms/housing/Ho...pmentCorp.html

Looks like we're in for a new Uniacke Square. Lovely.
I hope not, the old adage about those who ignore the past, being doomed to repeat it... I just hope that there is a varied income mix. The intentions were good with Uniacke Square, but never followed up on. They were set up without having a mix and there were never the inspections that were supposed to happen and as a result, the buildings which were basic but well built, becoming neglected and over the years becoming family properties housing multiple generations. I lived there from 1966 to 1979 and saw it as new to what it was becoming. It is unfortunate that it was not properly looked after, which is what I am afraid will happen with any public housing project. Private enterprise, I feel, is much better suited to build housing and maintain it over a public one. I feel for the developer.
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  #78  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 4:33 PM
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Are there any renderings or site plans anywhere? Didn't see any in those links. The language from the CH story suggests the NHSDC proposal isn't so great either: “The buildings, as proposed, are large in massing and are not well-oriented to the street,” says the staff report. “Although, the existing historic school buildings would be incorporated into the development, the proposed institutional design needs to be more sympathetic to the fine-grained character of these two structures and surrounding neighbourhood context.”

The historic buildings are good, but the rest does sound worryingly blunt and Uniacke-ish. Odd, since a lot of publicly administered housing developments in the last few years have actually been pretty fantastic (see the Regent Park makeover in Toronto).
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  #79  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 4:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Keith P. View Post
Nothing good will come from NSHDC. They are used to building low-rent cheap and ugly public projects with low-bid contractors. And Lawen's point about using public money to compete with the private sector is a good one. I smell a whiff of NDP cronyism here.
Doesn't exactly fill me with confidence
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  #80  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2012, 4:59 PM
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Looks like we're getting another public housing slum.
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